The Budget

GrannyGravy13

growstuff

Jaberwok

Surely if you have paid into a state pension fund all your working life, you should, whatever your financial circumstances are the end of the day, be entitled to a full state pension + triple lock or whatever. Its like paying into an insurance policy, and then being told it won't pay out because you are too rich.

Well, it's a nice theory, but ...

No butts growstuff if you have payed all your due taxes and NI during your working life then you should get your State Pension whatever your circumstances.

Yes please!!!

I've paid all my taxes and NI for many more years than the minimum, but don't get a full SP.

Who's disputing it?

You couldn't possibly only give pensions on a means tested basis, that would totally invalidate National Insurance contributions.

Ah! I understand now.

Pensions are means-tested to an extent because the poorest receive Pension Credit, which is a "gateway benefit" and sometimes means they are better off than some with higher incomes.

I the state pension shouldn't be means-tested. The way to reduce it for higher paid pensioners should be through the tax system.

Agreed but it already is reduced through the tax system as are private pensions. This needs careful handling or even more deprivation will result among older people many of whom have worked all their lives and deserve some financial security.

growstuff if you have paid NI and tax for the qualifying period you should receive a full pension.

(I am a WASPI and still waiting)

aonk

Agreed but it already is reduced through the tax system as are private pensions. This needs careful handling or even more deprivation will result among older people many of whom have worked all their lives and deserve some financial security.

The Private Pension which I have just started to draw from is taxed at source, I have no choice in the matter.

If my total income is under the tax threshold it is down to me to claim it back.

"We messed up the economy. You are all going to have to tighten your belts".

Katyj

Did anyone hear anything about the state pension age being increased ? I just heard the tail end of it. I’ve only 6 months to go now before I get mine, surely they can’t change it now 🤞

They’re reviewing it and plan to publish a report in early 2023. Current plans are to increase it to 67 for those born on or after 5 April 1960 and to 68 for those born on or after 5 April 1977. So 2026 will see the rise to 67.

maddyone

Whitewavemark2

We are all paying for Tory mismanagement.

No. We’re paying for the Covid expenses and in particular furlough. And we’re paying for the war in Ukraine and everything that entails, including the huge rise in energy.

The Covid expenses are Tory Mismanagement.

maddyone

Whitewavemark2

We are all paying for Tory mismanagement.

No. We’re paying for the Covid expenses and in particular furlough. And we’re paying for the war in Ukraine and everything that entails, including the huge rise in energy.

I completely agree with you maddy

Katyj

Did anyone hear anything about the state pension age being increased ? I just heard the tail end of it. I’ve only 6 months to go now before I get mine, surely they can’t change it now 🤞

I have 5 months to go, I dont think it will be changed for us, at least I hope not.

rafichagran I hope your right. These last few months seem to be taking forever 🤣

Interesting that Mel Stride has been tasked with finding out why so many people registered as ‘economically inactive’ - in other words on ESA and UC sickness benefits - since the pandemic. It’s not rocket science is it ? The effects of Covid, and the long waiting list is for NHS treatments jump out for a start. Also the migration of ESA claimants to UC has been suspended at the same time as the announcement that there will be more money allocated to tackling benefit fraud - specifically UC fraud and error, which has risen massively during Covid. So the flagship UC has largely been an easy route to fraudulent claims.

The "economically inactive" aren't just those receiving sickness benefits. They include students, stay at home parents, people taking early retirement and those supported by a partner.

And people in a couple, whose household income means they wouldn't be eligible for means-tested benefits, so they don't bother applying.

Some of the "economically inactive" have long Covid. Others lost their job during the pandemic and decided that staying at home suited them.

I had a brain haemorrhage twelve years ago. It was a minor one, which was unfortunate as the consultant said if it was any worse I'd have been comatose and not known about it, but I ~did~ know about it. After I was discharged from hospital my GP signed me off work for three months. Then I had to do a capability test. I failed, mainly because I could stand up and walk across the room. My sickness benefit was withdrawn and I had to go back to work, My employer was appalled: basically I was told to "work from home" for three months, which was odd since I was working on a farm!

That should give some insight into what government regards as "economic inactivity", and the gutter press as "scrounging".

Just been doing some sums.

My state pension will increase by 10.1%.

However, I will lose:

a) 20% in income tax
b) 65% from reduction in Housing Benefit.

Therefore, my increase will actually be 1.5%.

What's that about supporting the least well off?

and in particular furlough

Pammie I certainly don’t think paying furlough to millions of people was Tory mismanagement. Maybe others do, but not me.

maddyone

^and in particular furlough ^

Pammie I certainly don’t think paying furlough to millions of people was Tory mismanagement. Maybe others do, but not me.

If the Government had not payed furlough the U.K. would be in a bigger mess, thousands of people would have lost income and some their jobs, unable to pay their bills and many many SME’s would in all probability folded.

LizzieDrip

*I'm extremely glad the increase wasn't limited to those on Pension Credit! My total income is just above the Pension Credit threshold, so I wouldn't have received anything. I most certainly do need an increase.*

I know what you mean growstuff. I’m also just above the threshold for any benefits so currently get nothing (apart from pension). On a personal level, yes those in our situation do need the increase. I really don’t know what the answer is to make the system fairer - I was merely posing the ‘pension credit’ idea. I’m sure you will agree that many wealthy pensioners will benefit from this rise - is that fair? As I say, I don’t have an answer myself.

You can, separately, apply for those things that are automatic for those on Pension Credit. You can apply to the Council and may get a proportion of your Council Tax "Supported". You can also apply for Low Income National Health Support. Again, you may get a something. There are a few other areas too.

Some other benefits can "tip" you into Pension Credit. It is possible for Attendance allowance to do this and a few others. If you do get a benefit of any sort, it's worth rechecking. The cut-off isn't as sharp as people think.

However, you may be sufficiently above the thresholds and will be for PC if you are on a full New State Pension. It is calculated to be the old pension + pension credit so you would not to be able to get that twice but might be eligible for the other benefits.

The system is fair, in my opinion. Those who pay get a pension. Those who meet the criteria can claim benefits because they have paid to insure this through NI, and those who have paid into personal pension get that. I'm not sure how it could be fairer.

maddyone

^and in particular furlough ^

Pammie I certainly don’t think paying furlough to millions of people was Tory mismanagement. Maybe others do, but not me.

I don’t for one moment think that furlough wasn’t necessary in the context of the lockdowns, but looking back the lockdowns went on for far too long. It was mismanagement from that point of view and from the point of view of the checks and balances which were overlooked. Organisations like Liverpool Football Club used taxpayers money to furlough their back room staff while still paying the players full salary. Covid loans were given out with no time to put in place proper fraud prevention. I know speed was of the essence but £250,000 to fund a one man show, and the performer is now nowhere to be found. Really ? Look at the mess we’re in and tell me this was responsible spending of tax payers money.

growstuff

The "economically inactive" aren't just those receiving sickness benefits. They include students, stay at home parents, people taking early retirement and those supported by a partner.

Agreed. But its specifically those economically inactive people who registered for sickness type benefits who will be the subject of the investigation.

DaisyAnne I have checked and I'm eligible for Housing Benefit and just over £1 a month in council tax relief, but nothing else.

I'm afraid it is galling when I consider how much I've paid in NICs and pension contributions over nearly 50 years. I know NICs don't contribute to a defined pension "pot", but I have paid a damned sight more and for longer than most, so I don't agree that the system is fair. In fact, I can't even believe you think it is.

growstuff

The "economically inactive" aren't just those receiving sickness benefits. They include students, stay at home parents, people taking early retirement and those supported by a partner.

A working age person is economically inactive if they are:

out of work
not actively looking for work
not waiting to start a job
not in full-time education
caring for their family
retired

More than half of the growth in 50- to 69-year-olds leaving work for economic inactivity seen during the pandemic was due to people reportedly leaving work because they were retiring.

Overall, it does not seem as if poor health is the primary driver of these increases in economic inactivity rates. The fraction of workers in their 50s and 60s moving from employment into being economically inactive due to ‘long-term sickness or disability’ has stayed relatively constant, with around 0.3–0.5% of 50- to 69-year-old workers per quarter making this transition both before and after the pandemic. Growth in health-related reasons for leaving the labour force only accounts for 5% of the overall growth in inactivity among this age group. And changes in transitions from employment to inactivity are similar between those with and without a long-standing health condition.

(Sources)
Government website and
ifs.org.uk/publications/rise-economic-inactivity-among-people-their-50s-and-60s

Pammie1

growstuff

The "economically inactive" aren't just those receiving sickness benefits. They include students, stay at home parents, people taking early retirement and those supported by a partner.

Agreed. But its specifically those economically inactive people who registered for sickness type benefits who will be the subject of the investigation.

Ah! I see.