Buckingham Palace Aide resigns

Baggs

MaizieD

Baggs

The motive for recording it is irrelevant.

Why is it irrelevant? Genuine question.

It's irrelevant because we're focussing on what was said.

It's 'possible' that Ms Falusi may have suspected that she would encounter some sort of racism at the Palace, or maybe she just wanted an aide memoire when reporting back to her organisation. If she was recording we will never know her motive, so speculating on it is pointless.

A point made by someone else much earlier on this thread is that if SH hadn't carried out the interrogation none of the subsequent furore would have happened.

Look at the reported transcript of the conversation and ask yourself if it seems like normal chit chat, or even like drawing someone out to talk about themselves?

Thanks, maiz. I understand all your points and agree that they are perfectly reasonable. I read the transcript yesterday.

However, having agreed that SH appears to have been rude (we weren't there so will never know that for certain either), I don't think someone thinking as follows is being unreasonable either:
First the supposed facts
Someone is invited to a reception at the Palace.
They decide to record the conversations they have while there for whatever reason.

Now putting myself in another guest's shoes or the organiser's shoes, I think it's bloody rude to record people privately unless it is for criminal investigative reasons or something equally necessary.

SO....
I think "wearing a wire" and the motive for wearing it at that particular event are, as the saying goes, suspect.

I agree with your comments about the wire, Baggs. 'If' it happened it was definitely rude. Unless, of course, she had enquired in advance as to whether it was allowable and was told it was OK.

There are very big 'IFs' hanging over this aspect of the story, (transcript and wire) though.

Aveline

This is what Ngosi Fulani was wearing. Draw your own conclusions.

wow! "draw you own conclusions"

MaizieD

Baggs

The motive for recording it is irrelevant.

Why is it irrelevant? Genuine question.

It's irrelevant because we're focussing on what was said.

It's 'possible' that Ms Falusi may have suspected that she would encounter some sort of racism at the Palace, or maybe she just wanted an aide memoire when reporting back to her organisation. If she was recording we will never know her motive, so speculating on it is pointless.

A point made by someone else much earlier on this thread is that if SH hadn't carried out the interrogation none of the subsequent furore would have happened.

Look at the reported transcript of the conversation and ask yourself if it seems like normal chit chat, or even like drawing someone out to talk about themselves?

Thanks, maiz. I understand all your points and agree that they are perfectly reasonable. I read the transcript yesterday.

However, having agreed that SH appears to have been rude (we weren't there so will never know that for certain either), I don't think someone thinking as follows is being unreasonable either:
First the supposed facts
Someone is invited to a reception at the Palace.
They decide to record the conversations they have while there for whatever reason.

Now putting myself in another guest's shoes or the organiser's shoes, I think it's bloody rude to record people privately unless it is for criminal investigative reasons or something equally necessary.

SO....
I think "wearing a wire" and the motive for wearing it at that particular event are, as the saying goes, suspect.

Skydancer

If, as a white woman, I happened to be born in an African country and someone asked where I was from I'd assume it was because I was white. I wouldn't consider the question to be racist. Just saying.

Exactly. I know someone in that situation, and she wasn’t upset if people asked her where she was really from.

However, it must be difficult to guess what will offend people.

Never been free speech in my lifetime and I am sure there never will be. Much too upsetting.

Baggs

^The motive for recording it is irrelevant.^

Why is it irrelevant? Genuine question.

It's irrelevant because we're focussing on what was said.

It's 'possible' that Ms Falusi may have suspected that she would encounter some sort of racism at the Palace, or maybe she just wanted an aide memoire when reporting back to her organisation. If she was recording we will never know her motive, so speculating on it is pointless.

A point made by someone else much earlier on this thread is that if SH hadn't carried out the interrogation none of the subsequent furore would have happened.

Look at the reported transcript of the conversation and ask yourself if it seems like normal chit chat, or even like drawing someone out to talk about themselves?

What has happened to free speech? People are going to be afraid to voice opinions at this rate. Nazi Germany in the 1930s springs to mind.

The motive for recording it is irrelevant.

Why is it irrelevant? Genuine question.

Also grannygravy's 11.58.02

Or:
It was a recording. That would make me very suspicious of the intention of the person recording it.

If it is indeed a transcript of a recording then it's a horrible interrogation (I can't call it a 'conversation'). I'm surprised that SH didn't shine bright lights in Ms Falusi's face...

Those who think it's a bit of innocent social chit chat are being a trifle self delusive, I fear.

The motive for recording it is irrelevant.

Aveline

'honorary role' so presumably one of Camilla's new companions or 'ladies of the household'?

Her daughter (can’t remember her name) is now one of ‘Camilla’s Companions’.

Good post at 11.46.07, daisyanne.

Proudly reflecting her heritage in her dress, I'd certainly be tempted to ask her about her family's origins. That would seem polite. I'd also not be able to see her name badge.

Miriam Margoyles live on This Morning (ITV)yesterday told someone who had rang the show for dating advice loose weight, don’t date cripples or turn gay the silence across the media is deafening.

Lady Hussey asks someone in what can be construed as tribal dress where do you/your people come from and there is a media meltdown.

If I was a conspiracy theorist I would see this as a hidden agenda.

volver

One thing nobody has mentioned yet.

We had the same HoS for 70 years. The people she surrounded herself with grew up in an era of deference and Empire. She expected a certain attitude and way of behaving. She seems to have been quite content to stay out of the way when her consort behaved in a particular way and said things which might be considered unacceptable in a modern country in the 21st Century.

So perhaps Lady Susan, a senior member of the Royal hierarchy, was behaving exactly as she has always behaved for the last 70 years, but nobody has told her before that its unacceptable nowadays.

Perhaps having a person born in the 1920s as the top of society's pyramid for all these years, with all that soft power, has stopped certain parts of our society from developing into as forward thinking and woke (ha ha) a society as some of us would like.

I think this is probably the crux of it, and I agree stunts us from developing into a more inclusive less class ridden society.

The act of moving Ngozi’s hair to look at her name badge before speaking to her was IMO disrespectful, and I would not have liked it, even before the inappropriate conversation.

Again this morning, in my home town, I have been asked the same question Where are you from?. I answered but I refrained this time from asking them the question as I didn’t want to upset the other person considering what is happening in the UK., but I think she thought I was rude, so she offered her roots.
I am constantly asked by all different people from all over the world..

They only time I was upset was in 2014 when a Russian asked me. I told her adding that my father was Ukraine and than she said how proud she was of her president. I looked her up and down and walked away.

I am always trying to get people to pronounce and spell my English name correctly, to no avail.

Gabrielle56

Racism? I Suppose one could say so.
Rudeness and ignorance born of an uneducated and closetted life? Definitely! I despise these relics being afforded any slack at all. She's in her 80s and as much use as a chocolate fireguard!! Why?!
Most old Nazis still believe they were right, but do we excuse them for age/ignorance ? No we don't. I'm old but I still have manners and a sense of decency and respect for those who are worthy in my view. Respect is earned not demanded, it's a fact these types could never get their thick heads around! The vast majority of our older folks have managed to move with the times and have not forgotten the courtesy of manners taught them from little-so why should these relics be excused?

You may think you have manners and a sense of decency, but I may not find them so. Are you to be pilloried because of my opinion? That is what is happening to this person.

Are you calling Lady Susan a Nazi? If not, why compare her to one? Should I ask for your post to be removed? Or should I just accept that life contains all sorts of people, and we will not like, or find all of them decent or respectful.

Just how thin skinned do we have to assume people are?

Prince and Princess of Wales are bombarded with cheers of 'USA' and a smattering of boos at Boston Celtics basketball game - one hour after black Reverend gave lecture on 'colonialism and racism' at Earthshot launch amid Palace race row

Whitewavemark2

But but but ……. Even if she was wearing a wire, that would have zero to do with Hussey behaving the way she did.

Even touching the woman’s hair was highly unacceptable behaviour.

Bad manners from start to finish compounded by racism.

I keep asking this. No one answers.

Where was the racism? Actual, definable in law, racism?

The picture I've added is of the tweet of the "conversation" in question. No one can remember a conversation that accurately. It does look like a transcript from a recording.

So:
It is either, a memory of how a conversation went, which will always be biased.

Or:
It was a recording. That would make me very suspicious of the intention of the person recording it.

But:
We don't know.

What is it that "the offended" actually want to happen? What do they want in addition to someone losing their job and being pilloried in the newspapers and online?

If it is that everyone agrees with them, that's not going to happen. We all have our opinions. They do not all chime with those who have chosen, on the basis of one person's feelings and loud complaining, to be offended.

The palace has chosen to believe the description of the conversation and the person accused of impropriety has gone. But still, it continues. What, exactly, oh offended ones, do you want now?

There is a lot of ageism in this thread. May or not be conscious but it makes me sick. The lady concerned was rude and objectionable but leave her age out of it.

Gabrielle56

Racism? I Suppose one could say so.
Rudeness and ignorance born of an uneducated and closetted life? Definitely! I despise these relics being afforded any slack at all. She's in her 80s and as much use as a chocolate fireguard!! Why?!
Most old Nazis still believe they were right, but do we excuse them for age/ignorance ? No we don't. I'm old but I still have manners and a sense of decency and respect for those who are worthy in my view. Respect is earned not demanded, it's a fact these types could never get their thick heads around! The vast majority of our older folks have managed to move with the times and have not forgotten the courtesy of manners taught them from little-so why should these relics be excused?

I despise these relics. thick heads around

It seems that you just cannot help being derogatory

Racism? I Suppose one could say so.
Rudeness and ignorance born of an uneducated and closetted life? Definitely! I despise these relics being afforded any slack at all. She's in her 80s and as much use as a chocolate fireguard!! Why?!
Most old Nazis still believe they were right, but do we excuse them for age/ignorance ? No we don't. I'm old but I still have manners and a sense of decency and respect for those who are worthy in my view. Respect is earned not demanded, it's a fact these types could never get their thick heads around! The vast majority of our older folks have managed to move with the times and have not forgotten the courtesy of manners taught them from little-so why should these relics be excused?

Gabrielle56

Hussey is rude arrogant and unsurprisingly vulgar. Her spouse was head of BBC for years and they considered themselves akin to royalty, and I cannot believe that this old relic is still in royal household?!?! What possible benefits could she possibly bring to modern royal household.i applaud Queen Camillafor ditching the ridiculous ladies in waiting rubbish too! What are we ? Medieval?! Sack all the old bags i say , let's have some bright young lasses and lads getting a look in and NOT the offspring of inbred aristos either! Good hard working modern young people to breathe life into the gasping royal household. Treated as a paid internship with qualifications earned and open to all gender and nationalities of UK. About time we got serious about how we manage this cash sucking white elephant ( sorry elephants!)

Horrid post

If, as a white woman, I happened to be born in an African country and someone asked where I was from I'd assume it was because I was white. I wouldn't consider the question to be racist. Just saying.

The more I think about it the more I think the RF have shot themselves in the foot. They are so sensitive about not being racist they chuck SH under a bus for being racist. Well if SH is racist then maybe there are also others within the RF who are also racist.

It would have been better to explain that because of her ceremonial dress SH thought Ms was from another country and/or proud of her heritage and she was trying to make conversation to put her at ease. She could then apologise if she’d caused offence which was not intended.

As it is they have more or less admitted to racism, true or not, and in America Meghan Markle is jumping for glee saying I told you so.