Another case of “she dressed and behaved in a provocative manner”

No excuse for the male behaviour but some women just do not understand what might be “provocative”.
We had a 40 something, very senior civil service manager who would turn up for conferences in a low cut flimsy dress that showed her cleavage and left little else to the imagination.
When approached by a more senior female colleague she said that she didn’t see why this was not the most appropriate thing to wear and continued to dress in that way and to flirt with all the males. The rest of the female staff, both young and old, disapproved and said that any sexual harassment she might experience would be her own fault.

Chestnut

MissAdventure

I was just imagining the kind of workplace where the disciplinary procedure was done by smacking.

John Wayne would be the boss with Maureen O'Hara as his secretary. I've seen him put her over his knee a few times! 🙈

If it was staged in Ireland it would be the film"The quiet man', which John Wayne drags Maureen O'Hara along. I've actually been to Ballinrobe where it was filmed. the locals were really proud of it

It seems nothing really changes.

MOnica

OK, I will compromise on 50 years.

That person was just an idiot and they are found everywhere. I was in a mixed religion marriage, I got married in 1996, just before the GFA and a lot had moved on then. It was the comment that we are a century behind everyone else, I don't think that it was a fair thing to say.

I worked with some one from Northern Ireland who could not accept I was a catholic because I had a Scottish surname.

After the Flight of the Earls their lands were opened up for settlement by Protestants from elsewhere in Great Britain, most of them were Scots. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plantation_of_Ulster His assumption, and it seemed to be common, was that your religion could be assumed from your name. If, like me, they did not match, then I was an anomaly that required explanation.

M0nica

*Alioop*. I presume you are not a catholic with a protestant name.

???

MOnica this is about a sexual harassment case so why are you asking me that. This thread was about woman who stood up for her rights and it doesn't matter where she is from or what religion she is, she did it and won and that's all what matters. It shows people now, wherever you are, even in a Hicksville place like N.Ireland, well in you're eyes anyway, that they can't get away with nonsense like that anymore.

Alioop. I presume you are not a catholic with a protestant name.

MOnica I'm from Northern Ireland and don't think we are a century behind with our attitudes than the rest of the UK. That's a very unkind thing to say, you may be glad you don't live here, but I love it and wouldn't want to be anywhere else.
No woman that I know here in N.Ireland would take any form of sexual harassment nowadays, it would be reported just like anywhere else in the UK. We aren't a pack of idiots you know.

Well done Coolgran!

I was about 26 and working in a large hospital. One of the paramedics, known then just as an ambulance man, targeted me regularly with inappropriate comments such as ..... I'd like an hour with you in the back of the ambulance. He had a daughter my age. This was said in front of one of his colleagues and in earshot of my colleagues.It was getting that I dreaded meeting him in a corridor. I've no doubt he thought he was just being funny but one day I'd had enough. He made a ribald comment into my office one day from the doorway. I stood up and called him by name. Went into the corridor where he was with a colleague and told him very strongly what I thought of him .and asked how he'd feel about someone speaking to his daughter this way. He was totally gobsmacked. I was shaking with anger and barely took breath. I had no more bother. Thing is, it didn't cross my mind to make a formal complaint. In those days it was part and parcel of 'banter' but that particular day I'd had enough and dealt with it in my own way.
When I went back into my own office all the girls were also gobsmacked that is done this.

It hasn't been "ok" or normal to be smacked with a ruler since my parents were at school in the 50's as far as I'm aware.

Defintely not ok to smack anyone with a ruler, anywhere.

MissAdventure

I was just imagining the kind of workplace where the disciplinary procedure was done by smacking.

John Wayne would be the boss with Maureen O'Hara as his secretary. I've seen him put her over his knee a few times! 🙈

It doesn't matter what she did or how she was dressed, the manager's behaviour was unacceptable and that he thought it was, despite everything that has happened over the last 50 years to make it clear that behaviour in the office should always be professional and that women should not be expected to tolerate unwanted sexua advances anywhere, least of all at work, is the depressing, but in Northern Ireland, attitudes have always been about a century behind everyone else (I am of Northern Irish descent and have always been profoundly grateful that my grandfather left the country at the first opportunity.)

I haven’t seen any evidence the victim was awful. The evidence is the manager was awful. Talk about blaming women when men can’t behave. Adam Eve Apple

It sounds as though the chap thought it was funny, did it in front of another man and then told everyone at a meeting what he had done whilst she was standing there. They thought it was funny.

He was humiliating her, it’s a pity they have kept his name out of the press. No matter how awful she was, it should have been dealt with by her HR Dept. She deserves every penny, it’s a pity he didn’t have to pay it himself.

Why are we putting the spotlight on the woman’s behaviour. here I wonder?

Quite!!

I was just imagining the kind of workplace where the disciplinary procedure was done by smacking.

Aplogies, just seen that you have tried to explain earlier Chestnut.

However I remain bemused that if you don't think she should have been treated that way , why you think her potential awfulness is relevant.

Chestnut

Did I say it was okay for her boss to smack her ? NO
Did I say she was asking for it? NO

You can see why there are so many spats on these boards because people put their own spin on everything. 🤦‍♀️

If you weren't saying that then please could you clarify what point you were making. I can't understand why "she could have been awful" has anything to do with what happened to her!!

Chestnut

It seems imaginations on here go into overdrive. We don't actually know what this woman was like. She may have been awful! Just because she's a woman doesn't make her a victim. I wouldn't sit in judgement on this case from reading just a few brief words in the press.

She was smacked on the bottom by a manager. "What she was like, awful or otherwise" is completely and utterly irrelevant. I am stunned by your comment!

She denies that she did dress or act provocatively, though.
It was one of the untruths, presumably, told about her in order to try and justify the males behaviour.

There are women who dress and act provocatively in the work place but it is a simple matter to suggest appropriate office wear and behaviour, not use a ruler on her bottom.