The 10 awkward questions you should throw at an EU 'Rejoiner'

BlueBelle

But it’s true Galaxy it’s a poisonous paper that’s caused so much false news and so many problems The right wing press has SO much to answer for and if you can’t see that well nothing more to say really

But you can't just stop people reading it and telling readers they're stupid/misguided isn't going to win any arguments. You need to offer a positive alternative.

Its not even a good play on words.

If you cant see that the strategy you are using is partly what led to Brexit then there is nothing more to say really.

But it’s true Galaxy it’s a poisonous paper that’s caused so much false news and so many problems The right wing press has SO much to answer for and if you can’t see that well nothing more to say really

Yes keep on keeping on, keep on throwing around hilarious terms like the daily wail, and showing contempt for those who read it, that's worked really well in the past, didn't contribute to do division at all.

ExperiencedNotOld

From the Mail o; Sunday: an alternative dialogue to that usually presented on Gransnet.
www.dailymail.co.uk/columnists/article-11714171/10-awkward-questions-throw-EU-Rejoiner-corners-dinner-party.html

So, quoting a far-right paper is your only answer to actual views held by members of this forum?

This scurrilous rag is what you hold aloft as representing views you seem unable to articulate for yourself. It's your attempt to stop the democratically expressed opinions being put forward by members of this group.

I would say shame on you. But this OP is too sad an example of the bitterness of those who thought they had "won" something, only to find the whole country lost a great deal. So, I will offer my sympathy to you as someone who seems to require some help.

There is growing support for "rejoining". Those that hold those views are entitled to put them forward. In the same way, you may counter with factually based opinions, and others may add theirs about closer union but not a return to the EU. The drivel in this article will perpetuate the not-entirely incorrect views, held about those who seek to stifle debate on this subject.

Although I have set no example, I hope this OP will be ignored. Discussing with another trading block, our nearest and once largest trading partner, is exactly what we should be doing - why is that different to discussing with the United States, which the weasels of the far-right seem happy to do?

It's time the writers of such articles were put out to pasture. Whataboutery clarifies no argument. Whataboutery shows the level of panic in the writer. The panic that democracy, after a reasoned debate, may change its mind and the panic that democracy may prevail.

I think that what will come out of this meeting in Oxford is almost 100% certain that the ONLY way forward is closer working with the EU.

Britains economy clearly cannot continue as it is, and to rescue it from this downwards trajectory something radical must be done.

How this will be achieved is the big question, as having spent the last decade lying to its voters, and assuring them that Brexit is the utopia of their dreams with full sovereignty, closed borders and golden days of full employment, cheap fuel and food, the truth will have to be faced.

None of it is true.

So the Daily Mail can take its questionnaire and stick it where the sun don’t shine.

It is rubbish.

ExperiencedNotOld

I do apply a pinch of salt to all news articles, whatever their political bent.
However, the facts her seem blatantly clear. Being outside of the EU is not as bad as generally painted, particularly considering that COVID brought problems so soon after our exit.

No it’s not as bad Experienced it’s a HUNDRED TIMES WORSE
Carry on thinking that and reading your Daily wail they ll tell you anything you want to read at least your husband has a more clear view

It appears that politicians from different parties and business people don't think Brexit is going well.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/feb/11/revealed-secret-cross-party-summit-held-to-confront-failings-of-brexit

Courtesy of Twitter via Mumsnet:

2016 Exact same benefits
2017 We won't be worse off
2018 It'll be tough but we know what we voted for
2019 There will be enough food
2020 It's not #Brexit it's Covid
2021 It's not Brexit it's Putin
2022 #Remainers must fix it
2023 Sovrinty

To which I think we now have to add the "it's the left-wing economic establishment".... 🤔

Another Daily Wail attempt to cling to the wreckage! Theresa May said, 'Brexit is Brexit' which clearly meant there was no definition available and Brexiteers know that. It all depended on what was negotiated and Johnson failed to negotiate a successful outcome. The answers to the Wail's questions obviously depend on a future negotiation and cannot be sensibly answered in advance. What is clear to me is that having thrown away all the benefits of being in the EU it will take a lot of negotiating in detail over many years to retrieve some of them. Bad news for everyone except the flag wavers.

Well there would be lots to sort out and I think it's fair to say we won't rejoin for a generation or more or on such favourable terms.

...but as to the question
would the European Court of Justice be superior to British courts?
I'd say YES. the European Court of Justice should be "above" our courts - this doesn't make them superior to them, but serving a different purpose.

Just before I go, and from the Times no less

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/inside-the-mind-of-frustrated-leavers-how-would-they-fix-brexit-95qr7pksx?shareToken=c63a2844c13ec357af07ddeea58bd148

Agreed, same here. Off to friends and then a fabulous concert.

But David Davies understood very well, years before the Referendum, that you can't put to the people a 'yes or no' question. The question has apply to something that is clearly defined, including a proper assessment of all the pros and cons.

No-one, but no-one knew what 'getting Brexit done' meant, absolutely no-one.

Again, he was very clear

youtu.be/oFYATyXX234

It is actually easy to reply to all the daft questions with stuff actually based on fact. But I’m busy today, might give it a reply later when I have more time

I am sorry, but since NO-ONE, not even Cameron, or May or Johnson, or anybody else, knew what Brexit was and which form it would take, how could you possibly understand what you were voting for. No amount of research would have helped- as you can't research something that does NOT exist.

can we work out how much all that cost compared to the 350m a week that was promised? that would make it transparent

I don’t know where the money has gone - but could hazard a guess that much cash went on vaccines, testing, track and trace, PPE, hand wash, Eat out to…, furlough payments, business support et al. All costs never factored in by those clamouring to rejoin and criticising the government for financial woes.
I did vote leave and I did understand, after much research, what I was voting for. My husband vote to stay, but he too spent much time making that decision. We’ve never fallen out about it, respecting each other’s right to their own opinion.
I truly believe we cannot go backwards and that a life apart from the EU is our only future.

I was a Leaver, and at many a Remainer dinner party with friends, I have had to pretend I voted the opposite way. How awful is that? I try not to get too drunk as to let it slip, because I was wrong. I would become a Rejoiner if I could.

Oh, Joseanne. Remember:

"Just so, I tell you, there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who need no repentance"

We love returners to the fold

I'm going to be honest, I got so distracted by the Harry's older woman story I lost interest

Where is all the money promised going? People voted leave for something didn't they? Like the money on the bus for the NHS (yes I keep harping on about it)

I do apply a pinch of salt to all news articles .......
don't do that at the dinner party, blood pressure readings are already high enough!! BActually did you know that if the dinner is correctly seasoned, you shouldn't need to add more salt?

I was a Leaver, and at many a Remainer dinner party with friends, I have had to pretend I voted the opposite way. How awful is that? I try not to get too drunk as to let it slip, because I was wrong. I would become a Rejoiner if I could.

The thing I picked up in the article is that the EU aims to be a federal state with foreign policy under its control. That would be ideal, but because each country is so diferrent and wants to do things its own way in order to protect its own nation, I can't ever see that happening in the true sense. Some of the other nations are neither decisive nor proactive, some are incapable financially, so acting as one homogeneous group doesn't work. As was shown in the covid vaccine roll out and aid to Ukraine.

Well, I got past the 'Remoaners' and had a look through. It looks mostly like a rehash of the Leave lies and truth twisting so I'm not sure that it would cause me too much of a problem.

ExperiencedNotOld

I do apply a pinch of salt to all news articles, whatever their political bent.
However, the facts her seem blatantly clear. Being outside of the EU is not as bad as generally painted, particularly considering that COVID brought problems so soon after our exit.

That is an interesting comment. But please, may I ask, what do you mean by 'not as bad as generally painted'?

I do apply a pinch of salt to all news articles, whatever their political bent.
However, the facts her seem blatantly clear. Being outside of the EU is not as bad as generally painted, particularly considering that COVID brought problems so soon after our exit.

If I'm kindly invited to a dinner-party, even as a Remoaner I'll keep my opinions to myself, because I know how divisive it can become to raise the topic, and how heated the atmosphere is likely to be as a consequence.

Which is why politics and religion are often seen as 'taboo' topics.

Unless the host specifically wishes to discuss Brexit, I would behave like a good little Remoaner and simply chat to the other guests about inconsequential things, and not attempt to turn a social gathering into a bear pit.

I didn't read the article - well, I got as far as "Remoaners" and then lost interest. But I am fair-minded - if an article started with the premise that Leave voters were (as sometimes described) "Brex**itters"... I'd not read that, either.