It was reported in the Independent today that Australia is to try to recruit 31000 British workers, in particular medics, teachers, police officers, plumbers and builders. It is hardly surprising that Australia feels it can benefit from the situation in Britain by tempting workers with higher wages, whilst the British government feels it’s fine to allow the pay of British workers, in particular medics but others too, to fall far behind.
This country already has a dire shortage of doctors, and a labour shortage in many other areas too, and this recruitment drive will deprive this country of further medics and other workers when they are so badly needed here. We have had many threads on Gransnet over the last few years discussing the difficulty of getting an appointment with a GP and if this recruitment drive is successful, as it surely will be, we can clearly expect to wait even longer to see a GP as many more will leave and take their skills to pastures new. In fact waits for everything from a doctor’s appointment to getting a builder to do work will become longer and more difficult to obtain.
What is to be done? When will the government actually understand that the answer to Labour shortages is not to make people work till they drop (thus avoiding paying a pension until people are pushing seventy) but to pay a rate commensurate with the level of skill? We need a highly trained and skilled workforce but we are haemorrhaging highly skilled workers already, we cannot afford to lose another 31000.
There are also large agencies which entice medical professionals to come from countries like India, Pakistan to come and work in the wonderful NHS.
I remember reading about one which was set up by an Indian Consultant who came to work here and, of course, he knows the market in both countries.
There are many British professional agencies whose speciality is to entice key staff, incl. doctors and nurses, to go and work abroad. They charge high fees for doing so, and they will spend quite a lot on targetting, and entertaining (dinners, 'bribes')- both ways.
I think GPS are not that well paid here but nurses are, by comparison. Specialists are very well paid but then they would be in the UK, too. As for the comments about brownness and the dry country well Australia is absolutely huge so you can’t generalise. Some parts are tropical green, some are sub tropical green, some are temperate zones and some are arid desert zones. I think it is 32 times the size of the UK. Where I live the temps vary from freezing point to 42 C but usually around 20-24C which is lovely. It is too dry but then I personally like the sunshine and find rain a bit depressing.
That’s interesting Callistemon, certainly the profile of the small bits of Australia that I have visited is more white than in New Zealand. Maybe this will gradually change if they are importing more people from elsewhere now, but it wasn’t immediately obvious on my visit.
maddyone
Callistemon, no we can’t blame them at all, but I pity the poor people in these very poor countries who are left with even fewer resources than previously. However, some of them do send money home to their families which helps them at least.
That's what workers from poorer EU countries did when they came to the UK.
Casdon
maddyone
However, I do hope that those posters who enthusiastically support this Australian policy will not be appearing on yet another thread shortly complaining about how they can’t get an appointment with their GP for the next three or four weeks. Actions have consequences and more doctors leaving means fewer doctors here, which means longer to wait for an appointment.
If you mean me maddyone I’m not enthusiastically supporting it, I’m saying that I can completely understand why people choose to do it - that’s not the same thing. Our government does exactly the same, just not as successfully at the moment because we have so much less to offer.
I’m not enthusiastically supporting it, I’m saying that I can completely understand why people choose to do it - that’s not the same thing
I'm not enthusiastically supporting it either but I know it happens, has happened for years and that the UK does exactly the same.
Callistemon, no we can’t blame them at all, but I pity the poor people in these very poor countries who are left with even fewer resources than previously. However, some of them do send money home to their families which helps them at least.
maddyone
Actually, I thought yesterday when I discovered this renewed policy from Australia, I actually think Australia is a pretty racist country institutionally, because whilst they turned away the boat people from Vietnam, they wouldn’t even let them land for God’s sake, they have simultaneously targeted British people (white people) for years, since the ten pound Pom scheme to this latest initiative targeting British people yet again.
No, at one time Australia actively recruited immigrants from the Far East.
What Australia discourages is illegal immigration. The highest number of immigrants to Australia are still those from the Far East and India.
The top 10 countries providing the most permanent migrants to Australia in order of rank for 2020–21 are:
People’s Republic of China
India
United Kingdom
Philippines
Vietnam
United States of America
Nepal
Hong Kong (SAR of the PRC)
Pakistan
Thailand
In addition to the top 10, Indonesia is profiled to provide a regional context of migration to Australia.
The top three source countries of humanitarian entrants in 2020–21 to Australia are:
Iraq
Myanmar
Afghanistan
I didn’t specifically mean you Casdon. I meant anyone who supports one thing whilst simultaneously complaining about an action resulting directly from the first thing.
I have despised our government’s actions in poaching staff from poor, third world countries for years. But I don’t blame those staff for taking advantage of those offers.
maddyone
No one does complain about us poaching qualified staff from the Philippines, India etc but I have thought for years that we are immoral for doing so when their countries need them so much, but obviously that’s just me.
No, not just you, maddyone but recruitment of medical staff from India and other countries is huge business.
We can hardly complain if other countries do the same and encourage our trained staff to go.
It's the way of the world, people have gone to seek a better life elsewhere for centuries.
Actually, I thought yesterday when I discovered this renewed policy from Australia, I actually think Australia is a pretty racist country institutionally, because whilst they turned away the boat people from Vietnam, they wouldn’t even let them land for God’s sake, they have simultaneously targeted British people (white people) for years, since the ten pound Pom scheme to this latest initiative targeting British people yet again.
maddyone
However, I do hope that those posters who enthusiastically support this Australian policy will not be appearing on yet another thread shortly complaining about how they can’t get an appointment with their GP for the next three or four weeks. Actions have consequences and more doctors leaving means fewer doctors here, which means longer to wait for an appointment.
If you mean me maddyone I’m not enthusiastically supporting it, I’m saying that I can completely understand why people choose to do it - that’s not the same thing. Our government does exactly the same, just not as successfully at the moment because we have so much less to offer.
Indeed Callistemon as I have just found out (but no wish to derail this thread to one about NZ) so, as you were.
I meant that they might not like it as much as they think they would if they came back to the UK.
The problem with emigrating is homesickness, not necessarily for the country you left, but for the people you leave behind.
No one does complain about us poaching qualified staff from the Philippines, India etc but I have thought for years that we are immoral for doing so when their countries need them so much, but obviously that’s just me.
karmalady
Grass is greener for some, only it is not green, it is brown and parched. My sisters always live in fear of bushfires, one has had to flee at the last minute, twice and she has moved 7 times since being in aus. They miss our green and lovely uk and the historic places and buildings but now they are trapped as their families are australian born and bred
The grass is often greener, karmalady but the reality is often different.
That’s interesting Katie. So you’re saying young Aussies are not interested in work, education, job satisfaction etc?
That’s pretty shallow in my opinion. I chose my job because I believed I would enjoy it.
MerylStreep
I didn’t hear anyone complaining when we took workers from some of the poorest countries in Europe.
And medical staff from India, the Phillipines and other countries where they are desperately needed.
www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(22)00233-1/fulltext
“especially when openly targeted by another government which prefers to poach staff rather than train its own.”
Young Aussies are very lifestyle oriented and give a low priority to skills and work ethic,
However, I do hope that those posters who enthusiastically support this Australian policy will not be appearing on yet another thread shortly complaining about how they can’t get an appointment with their GP for the next three or four weeks. Actions have consequences and more doctors leaving means fewer doctors here, which means longer to wait for an appointment.
I think that the working conditions in the NHS and schools, probably police too, which are three areas being targeted, have been allowed to fall so much so that the attractions of better working conditions alongside better or similar pay, is bound to attract our highly trained workforce abroad. Remember, these people are being targeted, they are not simply making the decision alone, although some do. Our government sticks rigidly to it’s policy and has done so for over ten years, and it’s policy is to ensure that public pay does not rise. As long as this is the policy, highly trained people will defect abroad, especially when openly targeted by another government which prefers to poach staff rather than train its own.
I think one thing that’s changed recently is that Australia no longer seems a very long way away. A non stop flight from Perth now takes 18 hours, so if there’s a crisis which requires people to travel, they can get across the world in a day. I’m not trying to sell it, but it’s undoubtedly still an attractive option for young families. In fact if I was a young nurse or doctor now, I’d go for it myself.
karmalady
Grass is greener for some, only it is not green, it is brown and parched. My sisters always live in fear of bushfires, one has had to flee at the last minute, twice and she has moved 7 times since being in aus. They miss our green and lovely uk and the historic places and buildings but now they are trapped as their families are australian born and bred
And a very long way away too. There are plenty of other countries much nearer, and with great climate, who will be very happy to recruit staff, especially medics, nurses, IT- with higher salaries than OZ or NZ- and much nearer. Plenty of opportunities in Europe, if someone is prepared to learn the local language. Sadly the UK's current education system means that learning a foreign language beyond 14, and especially byond 16, is very rare, especially for those who specialise in sciences, like medics. But this can be overcome with a 6 months residential and a bit of hard work.
There used to be a sort of exchange system in both medicine and teaching where young people from Australia came here to work for a short time and our young people went to Australia. For medicine it also increased training and experiences for both parties. I would imagine the state of both professions now has put Australians off coming here
We have family in Victoria and friends in Perth.
The wages might be higher however, their prices are rising including property.
The thing that always struck me on our many visits has been shopping for shoes and clothes (childrens and adults) there are cheap and cheerful then a big jump to expensive there is not really a mid range High St as we are used to in the U.K.
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