Rape may as well be legal in London, Met Police officer said

I read some of this on line this morning, extremely depressing. The male dominated misogynistic culture is chilling. It seems to have been so well established it was seen as the norm, so impossible to challenge

It’s important that the aggressive, bullying, ‘boys banter’ culture in the firearms units are tackled immediately and effectively. I recognise that being in one of those units demands strength of character but that should never include arrogant bullying. Twenty years ago, a friend with 30 years service in a metropolitan area commented that the fire armed unit were best avoided, had an unpleasant culture.

I think also the absolutely abysmal conviction rate for rape has virtually made it legal. Rapist know the chances of conviction are also zero. So there is no fear of the consequences of their action. I'd posit a false accusation of rape is more likely to end up in a conviction than an actual rapist being held accountable.

I listened to a report on this morning's news and was just sickened. I honestly thought it was a case of a few bad apples but to discover that this disgraceful toxic culture is so embedded is shocking. The sad thing is that good decent police will struggle to stay in the service and I'm sure there are many who just become totally disheartened.

The Met needs being completely broken up into smaller units with a totally different leadership.

Part of the answer must lie in recruitment and training with a readiness to dismiss out of hand recruits/trainees who cross the line. Maybe a compulsory older age of joining.

“The Met” is tarnished for sure but do we really believe that several separated police areas in Greater London is going to be better. Criminals operate city wide, inter force information and responsibility would become a nightmare.

It sounds like a criminals charter, even in large rural areas criminals don’t operate close to home they travel into the next police area because it slows down detection and they can get away with more.

There are no doubt a couple of hundred of misogynists, racist and bullies in the Met, there are however a couple of thousand good police officers.

I should imagine the good ones are extremely depressed and saddened at this latest report.

I agree gg13 this report is demoralising and labelling for the good officers.

12 years ago David Cameron’s austerity programme started the process of wrecking public services. 20,000 experienced officers were seen as not needed. Many other experienced officers saw the writing on the wall and went to the private sector. It seems few people aspire to CID which used to be seen as a good place to be if investigation was your aim
Many specialist units went
No wonder policing is in a mess. It has the same recruitment and retention problems as every other public service.
The met is too big.

You are right GG13, but the same is true of these and other failings in other public service professions - teachers, nurses, social workers (particularly social workers) and probably also bankers.

Why did the government spend millions on a report that told gave us information that we already knew of and to add insult to injury, nothing will change. Well not in my lifetime 😡

Changing this law might help.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/nov/19/make-it-easier-to-sack-failing-officers-urges-met-police-chief

I've known this for a while and it is utterly infuriating

The way victims are treated is appalling and that's the ones brave enough to come forward only to feel violated a second time by tests and questioning

All for almost no conviction rate

It's a massive failing in our country

MerylStreep

Changing this law might help.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/nov/19/make-it-easier-to-sack-failing-officers-urges-met-police-chief

From Guardian report

“About 3,000 Met officers are not fully deployable because of worries over their performance or problems with physical or mental health”

It is a fact that 3000 Met police officers are attacked and injured on duty every year, are they to be denied the employment rights everyone else enjoys. It hardly surprising that a police officer that has been attacked on the street or rather cautious about going back.

My lovely neighbour has recently been retired on health grounds because of back injury and ptsd. He’s a real loss to the police force but…..

I havent looked at the conviction rate in other countries, that would probably be useful particularly some European countries, although difficult due to varying definitions of sexual assault. Is it a particular issue with policing, courts in this country or is it the difficult generally of achieving rape convictions.

Kent police don’t rate rape as very important. In fact a hate crime is more important. But at least you can report it online

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11888161/Kent-Police-slammed-poster-classifying-sexual-assaults-non-emergency-crimes.html

I read that earlier MerylStreep. It seems the post has been taken down. I may be wrong but I hope that ridiculous, offensive attempt to reduce 999 calls was made by a civilian not a police officer.

Yes, an extremely distressing report, and radical intervention is urgently needed.. not just reassuring words. However, we need to be very careful that we don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. I believe that the bad apples are a minority, and it's these who should be investigated, ideally by an agency external to the Met, and rapidly removed from service. Standardised systems and processes need to be introduced which ensure that at the first sign of a potential problem, the incident is thoroughly investigated, and if proven, rapid expulsion should follow, with criminal charges being made where appropriate. As for the Met being broken up into smaller units, I don't believe that this is either practical or desirable if the most efficient approach to fighting widespread crime in the capital is to pursued. Dilution of intelligence would be the result, and the criminals would benefit. There is no quick fix, and I feel that the new head of the Met should be given a couple of years to achieve measurable results.

We have to remember that hate, discrimination and sex crimes are very emotive and suspending every police officer or other public official on flimsy accusations is going to quickly become unmanageable.

In Kent, Domestic Violence is also not considered a serious crime. It just goes to show what the Kent Police feel about women. 35 years ago, after my ex had put a gun to the back on my neck and pulled the trigger to terrify me, the West Sussex police just gave me a crime number and told me to go to the Civil Courts. I have been assured that service has been improved to protect women better but I do wonder. This is the same Police Service who allowed a man to keep a gun knowing he lied about his medical history and then went on to slaughter is wife and children with it. It brings home how vulnerable women are.

In the 1970s Danish police were offhand when women reported rape and a lot of women felt they were treated as criminals rather than as victims.

Then police and doctors took the matter in hand, creating special units both in the police force and in hospitals to ensure that women reporting rape and later, homosexual men reporting it too, were taken seriously and treated with dignity,

So changing police attitudes is possible. You might want to suggest that senior police ask the advice of colleagues in countries where women who report a case of rape are decently treated, evidence is not lost or contaminated and hospitals have trauma unists with staff trained to carry out professional gynaeocological examinations of traumatised women.

Katie59 but that's the type of attitude that has made it the way it is - and 'flimsy accusations' very much plays into the 'oh it's just women making it up' narrative that is so prevalent, and gets so many rapists off the hook.
Maybe, just maybe, if they did start suspending people accused of rape (or other sexual assault / harassment) crimes immediately, then it might just make a few think twice about how they behave, and might just prevent some of these crimes.

WonderBra

Katie59 but that's the type of attitude that has made it the way it is - and 'flimsy accusations' very much plays into the 'oh it's just women making it up' narrative that is so prevalent, and gets so many rapists off the hook.
Maybe, just maybe, if they did start suspending people accused of rape (or other sexual assault / harassment) crimes immediately, then it might just make a few think twice about how they behave, and might just prevent some of these crimes.

The reason that police wear body cams these days is so that unjustified accusations can be dismissed, there are a lot of vexatious accusations made against the police. They also wear a stab vest these days because the risk of someone picking up a kitchen knife when a domestic is being investigated is very high.

Katie59

We have to remember that hate, discrimination and sex crimes are very emotive and suspending every police officer or other public official on flimsy accusations is going to quickly become unmanageable.

I would posit that a sex crime is never flimsy. It is a violent physical assault. Emotive yes. But then so is GBH.

Putting sex crime into the same category as a verbal insult just shows how little British society values women.