'woman' jailed for multiple abuse offences

It is not reasoned statements that spread fear and hatred, it is criminals claiming to be transgender as a get-out-of-jail card who are causing alarm.

Transwomen are Male. This man is the same sex as transwomen.

Theexwife

MerylStreep

Theexwife

Nothing to do with the police, they arrested an offender. They did not decide what gender the offender was.

Ah, another fruit loop. Just what need on GN.

That was rude, I simply meant it was not the police that decided, they are not at fault, they were bound by stupid rules of using the pro noun that a person says they are.

He rightly went to a men's prison.

Two posts and not one word of condemnation of the police.

VioletSky

A disgusting abusive man claiming to be a woman does not give trans people a bad name

The people who say that give trans people a bad name by continuously conflating the two

Especially when, most trans women in prison are in male prisons and have never asked to go to a woman's prison... because they obviously have more respect for women than some women will ever have for them

For these sorts of statements to be allowed undoes any possibility for an intelligent reasoned discussion and just spreads fear and hatred. I expect better from feminists honestly. Its saddening to witness and why I won't participate in this discussion further

conflating the two

What distinguishes them from each other?

There in lies the rub.

Facts are necessary, or planes fall out of the sky.
So is truth when describing them.

I always knew when the chickens came home to roost that it would be the feminists fault

Especially when, most trans women in prison are in male prisons and have never asked to go to a woman's prison... because they obviously have more respect for women than some women will ever have for them.
Do you have a source for any of that, VS? That most transwomen prisoners are in male prisons, that this is because they have never asked to be housed in women's prisons, that they have respect for women, or that actual women have no respect for transwomen prisoners?

There are a lot of assumptions bundled into that sentence, and it would be good to know which are made up and which can be substantiated.

As for the 'bad name' thing - I agree that not all transpeople are abusers. But the concept of 'giving someone/a group a bad name' is about guilt by association. It means that the innocent are assumed to be guilty because others of their number do bad things. Those of us who recognise that that is happening are not guilty of anything other than understanding how these things work. It's not unlike saying that sexism happens - it doesn't mean that the person saying it is sexist.

A disgusting abusive man *claiming to be a woman does not give trans people a bad name*

Why in this case is he "claiming to be a woman" but another man saying that they are a trans woman isn't claiming but apparently should be accepted as a woman? The fact that he is a transwoman who has committed abuse does not change the principle so often expressed on here that if someone says they are a woman then they are.

I am attempting to separate out his actions from an important principle, frequently claimed in these discussions, of acceptance without question if someone says they are a woman! Are you saying that his actions mean that his claims are disbelieved? But others are believed without question?

VioletSky
Could the reason that more trans women are in male prisons than female prisons is because they still have their tackle/bits
and have committed a sexual offence.
Btw. From Jan this year those mentioned above won’t have a choice.

Well said, Madgran.

I wouldn't hold your breath waiting for an answer though. . .

It should not be too difficult to check whether an offender is anatomically male and, if so, assign him to a male prison.

No wonder there's such confusion about gender. Keir Starmer has reassured us that 99.99% of women don't have a penis. Ergo 01% must have.

Sir Keir said 99.9% of women "of course haven't got a penis" as he was asked about his stance on whether a person with a penis can be a woman.

It is not reasoned statements that spread fear and hatred, it is criminals claiming to be transgender as a get-out-of-jail card who are causing alarm.

👏👏👏👏

LiverLover

No wonder there's such confusion about gender. Keir Starmer has reassured us that 99.99% of women don't have a penis. Ergo 01% must have.

^Sir Keir said 99.9% of women "of course haven't got a penis" as he was asked about his stance on whether a person with a penis can be a woman.^

Is that the same as saying that people with penises can't be women? The doublespeak is getting more incomprehensible, isn't it?

Kier needs to differentiate his male from his female when it comes to this issue, as currently it looks like he doesn't know his arse from his elbow. As a lifelong Labour voter I am seriously reconsidering my vote, and I know I'm not alone. It looks as though the LP are learning from the SNP debacle though - they are talking about 'modernising' the Gender Reform Act, but who knows what that will turn out to mean.

Doodledog

*Especially when, most trans women in prison are in male prisons and have never asked to go to a woman's prison... because they obviously have more respect for women than some women will ever have for them.*
Do you have a source for any of that, VS? That most transwomen prisoners are in male prisons, that this is because they have never asked to be housed in women's prisons, that they have respect for women, or that actual women have no respect for transwomen prisoners?

There are a lot of assumptions bundled into that sentence, and it would be good to know which are made up and which can be substantiated.

As for the 'bad name' thing - I agree that not all transpeople are abusers. But the concept of 'giving someone/a group a bad name' is about guilt by association. It means that the innocent are assumed to be guilty because others of their number do bad things. Those of us who recognise that that is happening are not guilty of anything other than understanding how these things work. It's not unlike saying that sexism happens - it doesn't mean that the person saying it is sexist.

I believe the official figures (no idea what they are) indicate that a large majority of trans women are in men's prisons.

I can't find any reasons given for this (haven't really researched it) - so the claim that it's because they obviously have more respect for women than to impose themselves on a female prison is rather spurious. I suspect it's more to do with the actual crimes they've committed or logistics. I also doubt they're always given a choice, either.

And you're right - about the "guilt by association". Not something most on GN sign up to, I think overall we're more fair minded. The one trans woman I know, is about as much like 'Jade' as chalk is like cheese.
Recognising that trans people are unfairly discriminated against and often reviled - as indeed are other demographics - doesn't mean that you are indulging the discrimination by pointing it out. I know for a fact that my trans woman friend has suffered such discrimination - a more gentle soul you could ever wish to meet, though we talk little about it because we are both absorbed by our mutual 'hobby' (Baroque music).

VioletSky
For these sorts of statements to be allowed undoes any
possibility for an intelligent reasoned discussion and just spreads fear and hatred. I expect better from feminists honestly. Its saddening to witness and why I won't participate in this discussion further"

The 'statements' - that trans women get a 'bad press' because of individuals like Jade are true - I don't know how you can't see it. To be blunt - what effect do you think this case and the reporting of it, will have on the uninformed, the bigots, those that 'other' anyone who isn't like them; the type who regard all asylum seekers as 'illegals'; question the validity of the disabled, the unemployed, food-bank users, etc, etc? We're pointing this out, not conspiring with it.
What, in your view, constitutes an "intelligent, reasoned discussion"?
I would defend the human rights of all trans gender people - I simply do not believe their experience of womanhood, of being a woman, is the same as mine. It's not any the less valid - but it is simply not the same. We meet at the 'crossroads' as human beings, all of us, but we take different roads from thereon.
Anyway, as you're not going to participate in this discussion further, I'm not expecting a reply.

So according to KS, the man who could be our next PM, 0.1% of women have a penis!!!!

0.01%, I think. I suppose he is covering his tracks in case of rare physical anomalies, but yeah, he needs a biology lesson.

Especially when, most trans women in prison are in male prisons and have never asked to go to a woman's prison... because they obviously have more respect for women than some women will ever have for them.

It's not like choosing your holiday hotel - convicted prisoners do not have a choice, it is not their decision to make.
They can ask but that request will not usually be granted. The number is in single figures.

Yes you're right Doodledog 0.01%. With such questionable knowledge of basic biology, one wonders if he'd recognise a rare physical anomaly if confronted with one.

I don't see why women being against in tact males claiming to be women, being housed in women's prisons signifies their disrespect.

I don't see why women being against in tact males claiming to be women, being housed in women's prisons signifies their disrespect.

Especially when they're there for raping and sexually abusing those women. There's definitely a lack of respect somewhere but only a fool or a misogynist would lay that at women's feet.

It beggars belief that he is claiming to be a woman it's women need prorecting from such evil men. Pity he can't be castrated along with a few others.

I’m no scientist, in fact I’m much more a left brain kind of person but, even I know research is clear that there are differences in male and female brains.
How on earth has sensitivity to feelings led us to the point where men who rape women can claim to be female. It’s bonkers

https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202304/medium-970338-screenshot-20230326-181345.png https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202304/medium-386280-screenshot-20230326-181456.png

Here are figures on the numbers of sex offenders who claim to be transwomen, compared with the general populations of men & women.

Transwomen committing sex offences at more than 4 times the rate of other men.

A similar number, around 100, from a population of 30,000,000 women & a population of 48,000 transwomen.

It seems to me that either
(a) those men who claim to be transwomen are much more likely to be sex offenders than other men or
(b) male sex offenders frequently claim to be transwomen or
(c) both of the above.

We are repeatedly told that gender and sex are different things.
Why, then, is gender being used to replace the category of sex?

Great to see you posting, FN. I hope all is well.

Thanks for those figures FN.

Hi Doodledog. Yes, all fine thanks.