Labour Lib Dem coalition

Fleurpepper You are ever hopeful. No matter what party a smaller party goes into coalition with, there is one thing they can be absolutely be sure of - that they will be expected to carry the can for everything that is unpopular with the electorate and be blamed for everything that goes wrong.

What dominant party could resist the opportunity to increase their chances of outright victory in the next election by polishing their own credentiaals for re-election by blaming its junior partner for all its failings.

M0nica spot on

M0nica-absolutely!

M0nica, time for this to change. It has been the way due to First Past the Post- see saw disaster. Time for cooperation, putting heads together and find balance- and exclude the far right politics of the current Cons Party.

If Labour get in at the next general election, (which I expect them to do, even with KS as leader), does anyone believe that they’ll bring in PR? They never have in the past, except maybe when they’ve just lost an election.

One more reason for a Lib-Lab alliance- so Lib Dems can push pressure on Labour to start the process on a form of PR with minimum required and get much closer to Europe and regain our place in Single Market and FMOP.

Junior partners cannot exert much pressure. Look at the Conservative/LD coalition. I merely comment . I don’t expect the Conservatives to lose the next GE.

If Lib Dems and Labour ally, with Greens and SNP- even if only for tactical voting, I don't think Cons have a chance.

But yes, I know many in our family and friends, who, knowing that the Cons have almost bankrupt the country in a way not even Corbyn could have done, who will vote Tory with their head bowed down and holding their nose, and in secret - because they don't want to be taxed more to pay for above.

Not me, for sure!

Almost bankrupt (sic) the country? What nonsense. I assure you we won’t be bowing our heads or holding our noses or keeping our choice secret - unlike all those many (as always) people you know. I must post the definition of ‘ many’ sometime.

We have a friend who’s an estate agent. He says people are still suffering from the fallout from the Truss/Kwarteng budget.

Just on one of your points about MPs not understanding Bills. Every MP gets 'Notes on Clauses' which is essentially a plain English guide to the contents of a Bill so they really have no excuse for not understanding the legal language in the Bill. Of course, the ones who can't read may have difficulty.

Fleurpepper

M0nica, time for this to change. It has been the way due to First Past the Post- see saw disaster. Time for cooperation, putting heads together and find balance- and exclude the far right politics of the current Cons Party.

Calling the Conservative party far right is disrespectful , crass, and an insult to those victims of those extremes.

*Fleurpepper what a lovely Lib Dem sentiment, The chances of it happening, is unfortunately extremely low. Meanwhile we have to deal with things as they are.

I have now belonged to the Libs/Lib Dems for over 60 years and this 'perfect world' thinking of theirs, rather that dealing with the 'actualities' has always been one of their traits that has most irritated me.

I think that all parties prefer to govern on their own, but pragmatically if push comes to shove they will endeavour to form some sort of lose coalition.

I agree WWM2, but 'loose' should be the operative word.

Germanshepherdsmum

Almost bankrupt (sic) the country? What nonsense. I assure you we won’t be bowing our heads or holding our noses or keeping our choice secret - unlike all those many (as always) people you know. I must post the definition of ‘ many’ sometime.

Could you remind us of the debt burden of the UK at the moment?

I am fully aware YOU will do so with glee- I was talking about the MANY (yes I do understand the meaning of the word, no need to help at all) we know who are so disappointed with the Cons performance and behaviour for the past 12 years, the destructive and costly Brexit, and so much more - and will hold their nose very tightly if and when they vote Tory again- to protect their assets. Many will vote Lib Dem this time for the first time ever too.

Who are you to doubt who I do know or not, lol!?!

How much debt is the UK currently in?

Currenty at over 2,530 b

2021/222,372.6
2020/212,146.1
2019/201,919.2
2018/191,925.2

Worse actually

£2,445.2 billion at the end of Quarter 3 (July to September) 2022, equivalent to 100.2% of gross domestic product (GDP).

And up and up. What is it now???

Freya5

Fleurpepper

M0nica, time for this to change. It has been the way due to First Past the Post- see saw disaster. Time for cooperation, putting heads together and find balance- and exclude the far right politics of the current Cons Party.

Calling the Conservative party far right is disrespectful , crass, and an insult to those victims of those extremes.

I really am struggling to understand this post.

There are elements within the Conservative Party which most certainly are far right. To whom is it disrespectful?

It's not crass to describe reality. It's not the calling out of right-wing politics which is an insult, but the way right-wing politics affects some people certainly is an insult.

Fleurpepper

Worse actually

£2,445.2 billion at the end of Quarter 3 (July to September) 2022, equivalent to 100.2% of gross domestic product (GDP).

And up and up. What is it now???

How much is the UK paying in interest on the debt? That figure is more important than the total debt itself.

Fleurpepper As I said I deal in realities. It is always the time for co-operation etc. But the fact is it doesn't happen, we need to deal with the situation as it is.

Demonising any individual because of they way they vote is offensive and demeaning. All but a tiny group of voters, vote the way they do for what they consider good reason, whether people of a different political persuasion agree with them or not.

I find it uncomfortable when those on the left are so dismissive and patronising, and sometimes quite offensive, of those voters who do not share their political views and vote for more rightwing parties.

I find this very odd because the left of the political spectrum see themselves as being of and part of the majority of the population - yet at the same time they look down and patronise, those same people.

The problem with the Tory party is that the extreme right wing is quite large, they have held power for many years. Cameron was only allowed to be leader if he held a Brexit referendum, May wasnt tough enough and had to go, Johnson was chosen to lie his way through. Their pinnacle of power was Truss, totally unsuitable and a miserable failure, Sunak is still in their grip but as election looms they do recognize him as best bet to retain what power they can.

How’s the Nat Con conference going, anyone heard anything?

15th to 17th May for the NatCon conference.

Fleurpepper

Worse actually

£2,445.2 billion at the end of Quarter 3 (July to September) 2022, equivalent to 100.2% of gross domestic product (GDP).

And up and up. What is it now???

Debt on its own is not the problem there are many nations with larger than 100% debt to GDP ratios, including the US.
What is more important is what we are spending it on, currently we are not spending enough on development to improve growth. Because of the we have now fallen far behind in new technology and we are having to import far too much.