Labour will be a major reforming government

Such cynicism on here, what, if any of the Starmer statement, bothers you? I can see no issue with any of them, and prefer a balanced, realistic plan to get this country out of the mess it is in. Starmer is right not to be too specific about their plans, for recent history has shown a tendency of the Tory administration to steal some of his better ideas (after sneeringly rejecting a windfall tax, Sunak, as Chancellor, brought in an 'Excess Profit Levy). Yes, he is not the most vibrant of politicians, but, frankly, after the cataclysmic period with that traitor Johnson in no 10, bring it on.

I have a real problem with giving 16 year olds the vote.

Only this morning on the news there was a discussion with a Government Minister and a member of the public regarding bringing in the GDL (graduated driving licence) as it’s been proven that youngsters brains do not fully form or mature until age 24/25.

This is apparently the reason that there are a high number of RTA’s involving the 17-25 age group. The most common cause of death in this age group is RTA, whether they be a driver, passenger, cyclist or pedestrian.

If this age group is not deemed emotionally mature to drive without conditions, have to stay in full time education or an apprenticeship until 18, how/why are they deemed ok to vote on how the country is run?

It’s a very big NO from me.

As for the rest I think Mr.Starmer and the Labour executive are saying what they think the electorate want to hear.

Unfortunately my confidence in any politician or political party actually following through on their promises is at an all time low.

I will consider whether or not to vote when all manifestos are known.

Germanshepherdsmum

It’s very easy to say what any idiot knows people want to hear.

yes. It worked very well for Johnson and an awful lot of people believed his lies

Pie crust promises - made to be broken?

But presumably you will still vote? And all we voters have to go on is what politicians say, and whether we agree with the general drift.

I certainly don’t vote for personality. Look where voting for Johnson got us!!

I've just worked out that I've voted in all, in 14 General Elections. On every occasion, I've heard many politicians of all shades talk the talk, but have seen very few who actually then managed to walk the walk. Someone much wiser than me once said something along the lines that Politics is the gentle art of getting votes from the poor, and campaign funds from the rich, by promising to protect each from the other. That rang a bell with me, and simply reinforces my opinion that politicians will say or do virtually anything in order to garner votes, but what they actually do when they get into power is invariably a very different story. So please excuse my elderly cynicism at Starmer's worthy description of his planned, forthcoming reforming mission to rebuild the New Jerusalem. As many Crusaders have found before him, the cost of funding such a campaign can be crippling to the economy. Frankly, I have no confidence in ANY of the current crop of politicians to dig us out of this hole. Sorry to be so negative, but that really is how I see it.

Thanks for that maizie I am sort of thinking of cutting and pasting it bit by bit for discussion, as people so often don’t read links and continue with misinformed arguments. I am guilty of doing just that😳

Kandinsky

He could promise everyone the earth, his problem is a lot of people just don’t like him. He has no charisma, no charm, & there’s something about him I just don’t trust.
If Labour had a more popular leader they’d win the next election - with Starmer, not so sure.

I suspect that people may have learned their lesson with Boris Johnson..

Caleo

Whitewavemark wrote:
"
When plans etc are drawn up for the building of flood defence/control, it is done so with the environmental oversee, which means that precious and sensitive environments are protected. The flood defence engineers are required to submit plans to the environmentalists in the EA. This relationship is being broken and the resulting damage to what is already a very damaged environment will, be trashed for ever.

I am very much hoping that labour will listen to this argument and put in necessary measures."

Whitewavemark's information is true. With her permission I only want to say that EA is the Environment Agency. Readers of social media such as this often don't take the time to figure out what initial letters stand for.

I have written to my MP - a labour bod.

varian

We ought to give democracya try.The overwhelming majority of delegates to last year's Labour Party conference voted in favour of abandoning our undemocratic FPTP voting system in favour of a truly democratic system of Proportional Representation.

Yes.

We ought to give democracya try.The overwhelming majority of delegates to last year's Labour Party conference voted in favour of abandoning our undemocratic FPTP voting system in favour of a truly democratic system of Proportional Representation.

Whitewavemark wrote:
"
When plans etc are drawn up for the building of flood defence/control, it is done so with the environmental oversee, which means that precious and sensitive environments are protected. The flood defence engineers are required to submit plans to the environmentalists in the EA. This relationship is being broken and the resulting damage to what is already a very damaged environment will, be trashed for ever.

I am very much hoping that labour will listen to this argument and put in necessary measures."

Whitewavemark's information is true. With her permission I only want to say that EA is the Environment Agency. Readers of social media such as this often don't take the time to figure out what initial letters stand for.

Kandinsky

He could promise everyone the earth, his problem is a lot of people just don’t like him. He has no charisma, no charm, & there’s something about him I just don’t trust.
If Labour had a more popular leader they’d win the next election - with Starmer, not so sure.

A lot of right wing Tory voters, and the left of Labour don’t like him. Both of those things will be in his favour in winning the middle ground, which is where the majority of the UK sits politically. I sincerely hope the era of charisma and short termism politics is over, because it’s done us absolutely no favours, what we need is a return to serious, pragmatic, less egocentric politicians who care and will do right by the population.

Primrose wrote:
" 🤣🤣🤣 votes at 16? At the last elections the 18+ youth couldn’t be bothered to get out of bed and vote even though they had been chanting “ooh Jeremy Corbyn” at Glasto and he had promised them the earth.

16 year olds won’t put down their phones long enough to vote 🤣🤣"

I too am tempted to want only well educated people to form the electorate. However there are obviously plenty of well educated persons who have very bad ideas and do very bad things. Democracy has disadvantages like the one highlighted by Primrose but it's better than the alternative

sir flip flop

For those who want more detail, Labour List have tried to put together a summary of current Labour planning

Labour has drafted its most comprehensive policy programme yet for what we could see from a Keir Starmer-led government. It should give anyone questioning whether Starmer has any policies pause for thought, and quite a long pause – we got hold of the 86-page draft yesterday, and put the hours in pulling together a full summary. The document is the latest stage in the party's national policy forum process. The policies included will first be "debated, amended and agreed" by those involved in the NPF, with NPF members able to file amendments until June and a key meeting in July. Then party conference in October will vote on the resulting programme. And then ahead of an election, a "Clause V" meeting will decide which parts reach the manifesto. So it's far from a done deal.

It can be found here:

labourlist.org/2023/05/labour-manifesto-2024-election-what-policies-npf-party/?source=email-labour-list&link_id=3&can_id=721839c2094a32b4f5d2c4aea10821c3&email_referrer=email_1914567&email_subject=is-this-the-2024-labour-manifesto

Okay:

1) Investment in green agenda. 👍 so long as he doesn’t expect us all to go out and buy an expensive and inefficient heat pump, or an expensive electric car until the infrastructure is improved

2) Expansion of NHS staff. 👍👍👍👍👍

3) Votes at 16. NO. If people are called children till 18, why would they suddenly be adults at 16. I think we know the answer

4) Fundamental reform of workers rights. It depends on what this actually means. Theoretically good, but not knowing detail, impossible to judge

5) Recognise people’s need for stability, order, security. Very woolly, sounds good in principle, but what does it mean. Need details.

Starmer is not fit to be a Prime Minister. In fact, I'm amazed that he was elected leader of any political party. He's a wishy-washy sit on the fence character, and keeps changing his mind about things. I wonder if he buys socks which are all the same colour so that he isn't faced with a choice to make each morning.

He could promise everyone the earth, his problem is a lot of people just don’t like him. He has no charisma, no charm, & there’s something about him I just don’t trust.
If Labour had a more popular leader they’d win the next election - with Starmer, not so sure.

Germanshepherdsmum

It’s very easy to say what any idiot knows people want to hear.

Thank you for your insightful and useful comment.

I have a couple of difficulties with the EA changes - first I think that OFWAT has been totally toothless, largely it must be admitted because it has lacked the backing by the government. This could change.

The second is the way the EA is being split. When plans etc are drawn up for the building of flood defence/control, it is done so with the environmental oversee, which means that precious and sensitive environments are protected. The flood defence engineers are required to submit plans to the environmentalists in the EA. This relationship is being broken and the resulting damage to what is already a very damaged environment will, be trashed for ever.

I am very much hoping that labour will listen to this argument and put in necessary measures.

Germanshepherdsmum

It’s very easy to say what any idiot knows people want to hear.

And as Starmer is certainly not an idiot, he will have thought long and hard about which initiatives to commit to, which is a refreshing change.

One of labour policies in greater detail

Labour have plans regarding the Water regulatory authorities. I am not in favour because I want to see water re-nationalised.

However this is a broad outline of-the plan

The Labour party is drawing up plans to create a new water regulator as it seeks to address public anger over the dumping of raw sewage in Britain’s rivers, lakes and beaches.

Under the proposals, a Labour government would merge most of the Environment Agency, the pollution watchdog, with the financial regulator Ofwat and the Drinking Water Inspectorate to create a new oversight body, according to people familiar with the plans.

The party would also create a separate flooding agency with the remnants of the Environment Agency to protect communities in England and Wales in the case of extreme weather events.

Public outrage around the practice of water companies tipping raw sewage and storm water into Britain’s waterways has become a political priority in recent months.

The scandal has prompted widespread protests and led to beaches being closed for swimming several days last summer with a repeat expected this year.

Ofwat regulates the water and sewerage industry in England and Wales, which is made up of privatised regional monopolies

It sets how much companies can charge customers and their required level of infrastructure investment, which is reviewed every five years.

Labour would retain this regulatory model but extend the five-year term to encourage longer-term capital planning, according to people familiar with the plans.

Article in the FT

It’s very easy to say what any idiot knows people want to hear.

The trouble is politicians ,including him, say a lot of stuff so that they are elected. Hope for your sakes he is true to his word, but I wouldn’t count on it.