Court of appeal supports asylum seekers challenge

Maremia

Something has just cropped up in my news feed about aBraverman u-turn. Heading off to read it properly.

Oh thanks for the heads up I’ll have a look.

Something has just cropped up in my news feed about aBraverman u-turn. Heading off to read it properly.

Perhaps MS means our freedom to protest, which will be curbed by the new laws?

Not a single suggestion. I am sure there are Tory GNs on here just now. What about the MP in your area? Not any more competent that Braverman? Ignore the dozens who plan to bale out at the GE, but that still leaves dozens upon dozens who could step in as Home Secretary, and do a much better job. I mean, how difficult is it, to sort out and expand all of those safe routes, and re-recruit the Border Control workers lost over the past 13 years?
The issue is not going away. It will, as I explained up-thread, continue to grow. Braverman is just not up to it.

MerylStreep

^so your freedom of speech will be gone^
It might have passed you by but we have already lost it.

Under what law?

so your freedom of speech will be gone
It might have passed you by but we have already lost it.

Freya5

DaisyAnneReturns

Nicenanny3

22:30Iam64

I’m particularly alienated by (not)nicegranny3’s suggestion that asylum seeker may = rapist.
Yes some asylum seekers will be predators but not the majority, this demonising/othering of desperate people is a sad reflection of the lack of compassion and understanding shown by some

The Rwanda proposal was always dreadful. Now it’s illegal thank goodness

*I beg your pardon another poster calling me names just because you don't like my post taken from a newspaper, well I'm sorry but it happened an illegal who came off a dingy only 40 days before and was being put up in a Hotel in Skegness courtesy of the UK taxpayers raped a girl, perhaps you don't like the truth and I did not say that all illegals coming over the channel having paid criminal gangs to get here are rapists but the facts are that the ones who have destroyed their paperwork/IDs we know nothing about and infact they could be convicted criminals, murderers, there are supposedly 19 suspected ISIS soldiers being put up in hotels God only knows why they haven't been deported. Perhaps instead of calling posters names you should get your head out of the sand*

I dread to think which paper you were quoting from. People cannot be "illegal" as I am sure you know by now. However an asylum seekers arrives, if the say they they are claiming assylum they have done nothing "illegal".

You caĺl yourself "nice" but the use of such language is the first step in ghettoising a group. We have seen this done in the past and doing it now makes those who use such language no better than those we did it in the past. They are certainly not "nice" people, whether grandparents or anything else.

Conflating the words "asylum seeker" with the word rapist as if they are one and the same is disgusting. It reflects the use of the word "vermin" against Jews in the 1930s which conditioned people to think their "extermination" was acceptable. In the past (at least I hope it is past) in the USA, the conflation of colour with the word "rapist" let to vigilante attacks and even lynchings.

I think simply saying that you are not being "nice" is the least anyone can expect when they pick up on these extremist attempts to manipulate a population.

Freedom of speech is a privilege, not a right. This type of propaganda destroys others human rights.

"Freedom of speech is a fundamental human right. Enshrined in Article19 of the declaration of HR".
"I might not like what you say, but I defend your right to say it."

In order to deal with the asylum issue, the Tories are thinking of leaving the ECHR.

So your freedom of speech will be gone.

DaisyAnneReturns

Nicenanny3

22:30Iam64

I’m particularly alienated by (not)nicegranny3’s suggestion that asylum seeker may = rapist.
Yes some asylum seekers will be predators but not the majority, this demonising/othering of desperate people is a sad reflection of the lack of compassion and understanding shown by some

The Rwanda proposal was always dreadful. Now it’s illegal thank goodness

*I beg your pardon another poster calling me names just because you don't like my post taken from a newspaper, well I'm sorry but it happened an illegal who came off a dingy only 40 days before and was being put up in a Hotel in Skegness courtesy of the UK taxpayers raped a girl, perhaps you don't like the truth and I did not say that all illegals coming over the channel having paid criminal gangs to get here are rapists but the facts are that the ones who have destroyed their paperwork/IDs we know nothing about and infact they could be convicted criminals, murderers, there are supposedly 19 suspected ISIS soldiers being put up in hotels God only knows why they haven't been deported. Perhaps instead of calling posters names you should get your head out of the sand*

I dread to think which paper you were quoting from. People cannot be "illegal" as I am sure you know by now. However an asylum seekers arrives, if the say they they are claiming assylum they have done nothing "illegal".

You caĺl yourself "nice" but the use of such language is the first step in ghettoising a group. We have seen this done in the past and doing it now makes those who use such language no better than those we did it in the past. They are certainly not "nice" people, whether grandparents or anything else.

Conflating the words "asylum seeker" with the word rapist as if they are one and the same is disgusting. It reflects the use of the word "vermin" against Jews in the 1930s which conditioned people to think their "extermination" was acceptable. In the past (at least I hope it is past) in the USA, the conflation of colour with the word "rapist" let to vigilante attacks and even lynchings.

I think simply saying that you are not being "nice" is the least anyone can expect when they pick up on these extremist attempts to manipulate a population.

Freedom of speech is a privilege, not a right. This type of propaganda destroys others human rights.

"Freedom of speech is a fundamental human right. Enshrined in Article19 of the declaration of HR".
"I might not like what you say, but I defend your right to say it."

GSM, they had no need to arrive in 'small boats' as there were safe routes at that time. Also, there were enough Border Control and associated staff to deal with the situation. Now we have Suella and the Rwanda project, and all the money wasted on this so far. With so many other Tories in Parliament, surely there is one, that's all it needs, just one, capable of taking on the post.The Tories have at least another year to start to sort it.

Germanshepherdsmum

It’s not an ability to identify the culture, as you well know. You will be as aware of this as I am. I don’t rise to bait.

The truth is that no such culture exists

Only your prejudice and xenophobia.

OK I’ll do your job for you.

So up to September 2022 the biggest numbers of Asylum seekers were Albanians - Christian European culture - I can find nothing in that culture that vilifies white women as whores. In fact the numbers of Albanian application have dropped drastically to a total of a little over 150 this year.

So second and now the largest are Ukrainians - Christian European culture - nothing.

African countries - cultures of course vary enormously as do the religion. I am not aware of any African culture that vilified white women.

Next Iranians - Islamic, Middle Eastern culture - absolutely nothing in their culture that encourages this attitude. Of course I’m not familiar with the Koran - but I’m sure we would know about it if it did.

Next Syrians -who share the same culture and like- wise

Somali - Christian and Muslim mix - nothing.

Afghanistan - almost entirely Muslim -

How about Indians? Asian sub-continent culture largely Hindu. I’m sure Sunak can put you right on that. Although I suspect the numbers seeking asylum are miniscule if any likewise….

How about Pakistan? - share culture with India but almost entirely Muslim.

I’m sure you get the picture.

So I wish you would help me out here as I seem to be missing a culture?

I don't know if I’ve misunderstood this but, according to TRIP’s a lot of the money that the UK had pledged to spend on overseas aid ( an amount that had already been reduced) has actually been diverted to pay for migrants that are actually in the UK. So when people throw figures around about how much per day we are spending on housing migrants in this country it is already money that has been allocated to that anyway. Of course, the people that say we shouldn’t help migrants that arrive here will probably argue that we shouldn’t help other countries. And, if that money isn’t going to the countries that need it surely it will result in more people needing to escape that country?

Germanshepherdsmum

I’m sure you are well aware Glorianny - it’s been reported often enough.

And I don’t think the parents of our second generation immigrants within the government came here on dinghies with no papers, do you?

I don't think it really matters how they got here. It's the contribution to society which they make when their applications have been approved that matters.

Just because some asylum seekers have entered the UK by 'irregular' routes (because they have no other options) it doesn't make them any less of a person who may have much to contribute.

Better safe routes and processing would cut much of the smuggling gangs' 'custom' and make it easier to deal with the few that would be left. The government has firmly set its face against any sensible solutions in the interest of populism. If they were to get their fingers out and do the job properly I'd have more sympathy with those who complain about the 'small boats'.

Germanshepherdsmum

Perhaps you could. As was said on a thread yesterday, seek and ye shall find.

Ooh, I love a research project. Perhaps you could kindly help with the parameters:

Do these cultures think all British women are whores, or is there an ethnic factor to consider? Do any of the cultures think, for example, that black British women are whores, but white British women are not? Or that southern Asian British women are, but Chinese British women are not? Or some other permutation?

Thank you in advance for your help.

Germanshepherdsmum

I’m sure you are well aware Glorianny - it’s been reported often enough.

And I don’t think the parents of our second generation immigrants within the government came here on dinghies with no papers, do you?

Three quarters of asylum applications are granted as they are processed, of those refused over half are granted on appeal, which means over 90% of asylum seekers are given protection. No matter how they arrived.
The Rwanda system will not take account of the reality of the status or origin of the asylum seeker.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

Perhaps you could. As was said on a thread yesterday, seek and ye shall find.

Germanshepherdsmum

It’s not an ability to identify the culture, as you well know. You will be as aware of this as I am. I don’t rise to bait.

Why won’t you identify this so called culture?

Perhaps I could look as the cultures of the asylum seekers and see where they proselytise such a belief?

Glorianny

Am I the only person who finds it increasingly weird that we have a government, with several of its senior officers second generation migrants, who think they have they have the authority and mandate to close Britain to asylum seeker or to deport them to unsafe countries? Do they never think "There but for the grace of God (and the welcoming British people) go I"?

Not at all Glorianny. I expect the vast majority know that to be the case. But the 9% extreme right are out in full force at the moment encouraged by our current government, and foolishly not knowing they are being used as a defection.

It’s not an ability to identify the culture, as you well know. You will be as aware of this as I am. I don’t rise to bait.

Whitewavemark2

Whitewavemark2

Germanshepherdsmum

The reporting of a crime can hardly be called propaganda. Asylum seekers have not been conflated with rapists. One apparently committed rape. I have already said that some come from cultures which deem white women whores. We have seen evidence of that from asylum seekers and from men born here but raised in a particular culture.

Which culture is that?

I am trying to find the culture that sees white women as whores. I can’t find that culture yet - appreciate a reply.

So I assume from you inability to identify the culture they sees white women as whores that we can rest assured that no such culture exists.

I’m sure you are well aware Glorianny - it’s been reported often enough.

And I don’t think the parents of our second generation immigrants within the government came here on dinghies with no papers, do you?

Glorianny, you are not alone.

Migration has 'pull' and 'push' factors. This has been the case throughout all of our history. The 'pull' factor for GB is that we are a safe 'rich' nation. We can attempt to control the 'pull' factor, but we need a working system. The Rwanda project was a dog-whistle waste of time and effort. Suella Braverman is not up to the job, and should be replaced. With so many Tories in Parliament, there must be at least one who could take on this post, and do a better job. If you can suggest anyone, let Sunak know asap.
Unfortunately, we have no control over the 'push' factors, i.e. the reasons people feel compelled to leave their homes. These factors are well documented in the News. I think we are at a point in time when the 'pull' factors are growing and becoming more urgent, and so migration will increase.
Someone up-thread mentioned the French not being a help in this. May I offer a point of information? Before BREXIT we had a working system with our continental partners.

Am I the only person who finds it increasingly weird that we have a government, with several of its senior officers second generation migrants, who think they have they have the authority and mandate to close Britain to asylum seeker or to deport them to unsafe countries? Do they never think "There but for the grace of God (and the welcoming British people) go I"?