Excellent article on economic migrants from genuine refugee

foxie48

Primrose53

Another 500+ arrived today. That’s like a bargeful every day now. Well beyond a joke.

I don't think anyone thinks it is a "joke". There is nothing funny about people risking their lives to claim asylum. This "bargeful" are people, people like you and me, children like our children, people with hopes for a better life. People, not a "bargeful". A bargeful is lumps of coal, containers of "stuff" , things transported but surely not "people"?

The barge is full, hence bargefull. Read today migrants are demanding houses, not hotel rooms. Tell me another country where we can just enter and demand housing. I for one am sick and tired of them.

Primrose53

Another 500+ arrived today. That’s like a bargeful every day now. Well beyond a joke.

I don't think anyone thinks it is a "joke". There is nothing funny about people risking their lives to claim asylum. This "bargeful" are people, people like you and me, children like our children, people with hopes for a better life. People, not a "bargeful". A bargeful is lumps of coal, containers of "stuff" , things transported but surely not "people"?

Another 500+ arrived today. That’s like a bargeful every day now. Well beyond a joke.

How can any government deal with the floods of people arriving on boats. If they haven’t got paperwork we can’t process them anyway, you can’t believe what people say. The Daily Mail, has its faults, but it has done a lot of good, more than any other newspaper, with their campaigns. I believe it’s the most read newspaper. No one has to buy it. A couple on here look down on it, always rubbish everything that’s done. I would like to know what high powered jobs they hold and what they are doing contributing as they are so passionate to take everyone. I can but guess.
No country has this sorted, why do they sit waiting in France and risk their lives to come here, France is safe. We need to assess quickly and return those not entitled to be here. Ask anyone that lives by the centres and hotels where they are housed what they feel, the truth? Their sympathy has run out.

I am highly empathetic, it's one of my best traits, I think. To be able to put myself in someone else's shoes. My hard as nails Mum would, in fact, call me "soft". I'd rather be that than to rubbish people in desperate need.

The way these asylum seekers are blamed rather than the Government sitting on its arse not processing them quickly enough is frustrating.

Christian faith and the parable of the Good Samaritan has always resonated with me.

14:24Chocolatelovinggran

I wonder how easy it will be to collect robust data on how far this initiative will succeed in it's avowed aim to "stop the little boats"? If I were a people smuggler I'd be reassuring my " clients " that this is not true/ only applies to Albanians/ is enacted just on Wednesdays or any other such nonsense. These folk are on the front line, have the ear of desperate men and women and will be motivated to keep up their lucrative trade. Who will measure the effectiveness?

I'm sure when plane loads take off to Rwanda news will get around pretty quickly, would you pay thousands of pounds to end up in Rwanda, fingers crossed Supreme Court agrees

39westendgirl

In your view, Nanny3 , not in mine .

You have your view and I have mine fair enough, what amused me about your post was leaving Nice off my name lol, how old are you that's something little kids at school would do

I wonder how easy it will be to collect robust data on how far this initiative will succeed in it's avowed aim to "stop the little boats"? If I were a people smuggler I'd be reassuring my " clients " that this is not true/ only applies to Albanians/ is enacted just on Wednesdays or any other such nonsense. These folk are on the front line, have the ear of desperate men and women and will be motivated to keep up their lucrative trade. Who will measure the effectiveness?

In your view, Nanny3 , not in mine .

Good.

The Lords, last night, backed down on any further amendments to the government's bill to stop the "little boats", so it will become law shortly.

news.sky.com/story/lords-back-down-over-controversial-government-plans-to-stop-small-boats-crossing-the-channel-12922611

LondonMzFitz

Stopping the boats is imperative, it's dangerous on many levels -
The boats are unsafe.
The route the boats take is unsafe - adverse weather, larger vessels along those routes running down the small boats - you would have to be really desperate to resort to these means.
The money the boat owners take from these desperate people!
Allowing unvetted, undocumented people into the country with no health checks taken.

But the legal route - processing people - is incredibly slow (I looked up statistics a couple of months ago - 18 months for the process is the norm). From what I read - Staff are trained and then leave .. demoralised by their work. There aren't enough trained staff - that, in my opinion, is where the money should be spent - right now! You won't stop the small boats until people are able to find a better solution. A workable solution - 18 months on the premise of "maybe" being allowed to enter the UK versus a small boat and in the country within days - what would a desperate person choose?

Adding a recent YouTube of a Channel 4 programme which some might find of interest. I live in Lincolnshire and the takeover of RAF Scampton is a big issue up here.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=KakdFcNezW4

My little Village has a local hotel (within 2 miles) that has in the last 10 months been used to house asylum seekers, I see them walking around the Village - playing football - sitting by the Village pond - walking to the local shop. I've not had any problems, the four or five I've spoken to (I've purchased footballs for them) seem very nice, although some people vent on the local facebook page (I understand groups of 3 - 4 - 5 men can be intimidating, but honestly some of the ignorant comments - and there are racist comments - make me rage).

Metal boats are now being constructed from scrap metal and they’re using old tyre inners as life belts. This is in Tunisia. Seems the whole world wants to come here by one method or another.

Meanwhile a barge is off the coast of Dorset ready to house 500 immigrants who will have buses laid on so they can go ashore and play football, shop, use computers etc. Can’t imagine many will come back on the bus!! Locals are not happy either.

Stopping the boats is imperative, it's dangerous on many levels -
The boats are unsafe.
The route the boats take is unsafe - adverse weather, larger vessels along those routes running down the small boats - you would have to be really desperate to resort to these means.
The money the boat owners take from these desperate people!
Allowing unvetted, undocumented people into the country with no health checks taken.

But the legal route - processing people - is incredibly slow (I looked up statistics a couple of months ago - 18 months for the process is the norm). From what I read - Staff are trained and then leave .. demoralised by their work. There aren't enough trained staff - that, in my opinion, is where the money should be spent - right now! You won't stop the small boats until people are able to find a better solution. A workable solution - 18 months on the premise of "maybe" being allowed to enter the UK versus a small boat and in the country within days - what would a desperate person choose?

Adding a recent YouTube of a Channel 4 programme which some might find of interest. I live in Lincolnshire and the takeover of RAF Scampton is a big issue up here.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=KakdFcNezW4

My little Village has a local hotel (within 2 miles) that has in the last 10 months been used to house asylum seekers, I see them walking around the Village - playing football - sitting by the Village pond - walking to the local shop. I've not had any problems, the four or five I've spoken to (I've purchased footballs for them) seem very nice, although some people vent on the local facebook page (I understand groups of 3 - 4 - 5 men can be intimidating, but honestly some of the ignorant comments - and there are racist comments - make me rage).

Monica your comments don’t stack up.I am the least angry or emotional person you could ever meet, and I agree with the article and all the points that Furedi makes.
Half the world is on the move and so many countries are tearing their hair out for a remedy to stop it as it impacts their country so negatively.Stopping the boats needs action not constant handwringing and if this government or whoever come next can act it will be a good thing.

westendgirl

Primrose It is so difficult to have a conversation with you, a pity.

Because I don’t agree with you?

Grantanow

Why didn't Furedi's parents and their kids stay in Austria - a safe country? If they arrived on UK shores today they would have been assessed for Rwanda as having travelled through safe countries. Of course, they're white which might have affected the result. Where are the safe and legal routes for refugees? The article fails to explore that.

Austria itself was still on its knees in 1956 after Hitler's War. They were overwhelmed with Hungarian refugees and England was the place to go if you were an intellectual as they had won the war.

westendgirl

I have read the article, twice in fact which seems to me to be a diatribe against the House of Lords. He talks about genuine refugees but fails to say that there is no way for the genuine refugee to enter the country, so the refugees from countries such as Afghanistan, Syria , who are often have much to offer and are very well educated are left in limbo.
I was more interested listening to how Germany, where they have many more immigrants, has been glad to use the talents of these people to fill their gaps.

Germany has a much better organised refugee system. Refugees are expected to learn German so they can integrate far more quickly and contribute towards the economy which has welcomed them.

Primrose It is so difficult to have a conversation with you, a pity.

joycerousselot123

Whitewavemark2

MaizieD

All I can say is that you lot are easily impressed.

My thoughts exactly. Not enough critical thought.

So, could you tell us what you feel is wrong with his explanation? (if you would)

I agree with Maizie and Whitewave.

Personally, I would say that the article is "an emotional argument made with little or no supporting logical evidence". This is one of the reasons psychologists give for why people resort to name calling. That would seem to fit the quoted text.

I imagine the reason why so many people "liked" the article is because of it's bias towards towards emotion. Yet more populism.

So, yet again, the prize goes to the man who can make people angry and emotional, not to those who give a logical and workable argument.

westendgirl

Another comment from another true refugee ;The illegal migration bill is a nasty piece of work.
Lord Dubs arrived on the Kindertransport age 6.

I think we all know about Lord Dubs but that was during the war, so completely different times and involved around 10,000 children. Since then our country has taken in people from Uganda, The Congo, Hong Kong, Syria, Afghanistan, Eastern Europe, India etc. Millions!

Boat people alone we have 45, 755 in 2022 and we are up to 12,772 already halfway through 2023. That is not counting all those who have arrived undetected by boat and in the back of lorries and who have just disappeared into the night.

Anniel

This was intended to be a serious topic of discussion, but the amount of pomposity shown by WW2 and her mates has me laughing. If I was an immigrant who was professionally qualified and had to enter UK via a small boat, I would have the required skill to have uploaded my particulars when i reached France or would be sufficiently lucid enough to show enough English to impress the UK authorities. If I could afford thousands to give to smugglers I would have the wherewithal to convince and have some form of documentation somewhere to prove my qualifications. It seems to me that those romantics who think we should believe the young men arriving in UK that they could solve the professional labour shortage prove that their analysis is lacking.

The average person on the streets would like to see our own homeless rehoused and those of them with mental illness treated. reading this thread, surely the Scots have the room to take a lot of refugees and economic migrants? Immigration is a hot topic on the political agenda of voters. I hate to tell you that most people who are on Council waiting lists are not in favour of uncontrolled immigration. Could all the labour enthusiasts tell us Sir Keirs policy on illegal immigration and his answer to the small boat crisis please?
Thank you for an entertaining few minutes!!

Starmer has got no policies on tackling this. In fact they've been heard to say, , of course,that it'll be the least of their manifesto.
www.telegraph.co.uk.news
Labour is hiding its true views on illegal immigration.

Another comment from another true refugee ;The illegal migration bill is a nasty piece of work.
Lord Dubs arrived on the Kindertransport age 6.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/immigration-uk-small-boats-channel-asylum-b2303591.html

Well according to this article in the Independent, which I always feel is a well balanced newspaper politically, there are lots of reasons why genuine refugees can't use those routes. Did you know that you have to be physically present in the UK to claim asylum?

westendgirl

There are no safe and legal routes ar present and Furedi would have had to get here by whatever means they could.
Primrose don't you realise that often families club together to send their young to a new life in the hope that they will then be able to send for them when they are settled and working.
Interesting to hear that Germany , who have taken in many more immigrants,welcome them to fill the gaps where there are shortages in employment. Here of course they are not allowed to work and thus contribute to this country. This is , of course deliberate .The Tory party desperately looking for votes .

Yes there are safe and legal routes. These people just want to queue jump. See Gov web site.

Grantanow

The Holocaust is irrelevant. Austria was safe for Jews in 1956. Yes, I did read the article. There was no need to venture further.

What an awful comment you have made about the Holocaust. Really you think it's irrelevant to Furedis parents fleeing. At least they fled together.