The Refugee Ship

Glorianny

Migration from England is classed as migration. migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/the-impact-of-migration-on-uk-population-growth/#:~:text=Official%20figures%20project%20that%20the,

The devil’s in the detail though. It doesn’t surprise me that England has seen large numbers of immigrants wanting to settle, because it’s cities that they want to live in. We don’t have many cities in Wales. According to the Welsh data from the ONS the local authorities here that had the highest rates of population increase since 2011 were in Newport (9.5%), Cardiff (4.7%), and Bridgend (4.5%), all urban areas with good services and access. Declines in population were in the rural and former mining communities where there’s no work. The greatest rates of population decrease since 2011 were in Ceredigion (5.8%), Blaenau Gwent (4.2%) and Gwynedd (3.7%). I’m in an area of outstanding natural beauty, a national park, so it’s not surprising we are seeing lots of incomers, people making lifestyle choices rather than international immigrants.
I’m sure that if you looked in detail at any part of the UK a similar picture would emerge, our own population is on the move constantly as well as international immigration changing the makeup.

Glorianny

Migration from England is classed as migration. migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/the-impact-of-migration-on-uk-population-growth/#:~:text=Official%20figures%20project%20that%20the,

Does that go all ways then. Thought we were one United Kingdom,and I don't need to have a visa,or a passport to enter the other countries of said Kingdom.

Migration from England is classed as migration. migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/the-impact-of-migration-on-uk-population-growth/#:~:text=Official%20figures%20project%20that%20the,

why on earth they don't do as Labour plan, to asses those in Calais so those deemed ok can come over on an ordinary boat I don't know. Then I'd be happy about turning little boats back or moving people to somewhere else. It's as if the Tories think being nasty to black people is a vote winner, the way they've treated the NHS, education, police, benefits claimants is dire. I was on benefits for a while when I split up from my ex, I was pleased for the help and happy for it to be clawed back later, as tax credits are doing.

Glorianny

The UK population is still growing but much more slowly. Scotland and Wales will experience population decline without migration.

I don’t think in all fairness that’s true Glorianny- we might in Wales if English people didn’t keep deciding they like it better here and moving - the population is rising, particularly since lockdowns have meant more people can work from home, we’ve had so many families where I am moving in that the schools and housing market are struggling. I imagine Scotland is the same, people want to live in beautiful places if they can find work.
One of the challenges for immigrants though is that they want to maintain social connections with people from the same background, as we all would if we moved to a different country. They find it hard to settle in rural communities with rubbish public transport and very little suitable work, no local religious centres, poor access to the food they are used to, etc. so they gravitate to cities where all those things are available. I was involved to a small degree as the NHS rep on resettlement schemes, and that was one of the major headaches.

There was one, may still be there on the Clyde (Glasgow) for 1000 Ukraine refugees. No complaints raised then, why now all of a sudden. Whilst there will be genuine asylum seekers amobgst those to be housed on a boat, there will be many economic migrants purporting to be a refugee. Where else can they be housed? Sure the government would appreciate constructive suggestions. Long term UK residents are finding it hard enough to get suitable housing here. Yes the system can probably be improved but again the volume and the cost of verifying every application has to come from somewhere, the taxpayer. Sorry but if I was a genuine asylum seeker fleeing for my life, I think I'd find a boat moored in safe waters to be a haven.

The UK population is still growing but much more slowly. Scotland and Wales will experience population decline without migration.

I have read the comments with interest. I am wondering if any of the pro 'asylum seeker' posters have lived in an area of high immigrant population, where hardly anyone speaks English, and many cannot and will not speak English even after many years of living here. There is no integration, we live side by side but not together. The children are rushed off to religious teachings after school and at weekends, so do not socialise. The coffee shops are so full of men it is rare to be able to find a seat. There are gangs, from some of the countries mentioned in your posts, and crime. High crime. People trafficking, drugs and prostitution. These arrivals disappear to areas where there are already large numbers of people from their own countries, and enter the life of crime. Believe me, I know. I see it every day.

DrWatson

These people are 99% NOT 'refugees' - they are economic migrants, and from places we have NO historic connection with, nor responsibility for (eg Chad, Mali, Somalia, Eritrea, etc). People claiming they are refugees should research the places in the country where children have been abused, and the crime levels have risen, as a result of these people being parked in that locality. The Rwanda plan had a lot of positives.

With a name like yours I thought you’d be a fact hound DrWatson, but clearly not.
In the first quarter of 2023, the Home Office’s provisional ‘Statistics relating to the Illegal Migration Bill,’ released on April 24, 2023, recorded 3,793 migrants crossing the English Channel in small boats. Among these, the majority originated from five countries: Afghanistan (24% or 909), India (18% or 675), Iran (14% or 524), Iraq (9% or 345), and Syria (8% or 286). Not the countries you highlighted. Figures for quarter 2 are not available yet.

These people are 99% NOT 'refugees' - they are economic migrants, and from places we have NO historic connection with, nor responsibility for (eg Chad, Mali, Somalia, Eritrea, etc). People claiming they are refugees should research the places in the country where children have been abused, and the crime levels have risen, as a result of these people being parked in that locality. The Rwanda plan had a lot of positives.

The numbers of people dying may roughly equate to the numbers arriving Dickens (I haven’t checked) but babies are being born here all the time so that argument isn’t sustainable.

The UK would be far better able to look after its own people if it didn’t have to accommodate (in every sense of that word) vast numbers of immigrants arriving without permission.

No country can cope with a huge influx of ½ million people coming in each year.

Which is, roughly, the equivalent number of people in the UK who die each year (the most up to date figures indicate the death rate is higher). The population doesn't live forever.

But of course, no country can take in an unlimited number of immigrants haphazardly.

However, the civilised world will have to ultimately get to grips with the fact that people will continue to emigrate from countries that are embroiled in both civil and foreign wars (some of which the civilised world has actively participated in); they will also emigrate from poverty and climate disasters. Some will obviously go through the legal channels and others might not have any legal channels left open for them to access.

It's a problem that isn't going to just go away, and if the 'world' shuts its collective doors - we will end up ultimately with gangs of marauding 'pirates' roaming the seas and invading their next door neighbours, and the world will become a very unsafe and unstable planet. We, the civilised world, are not entirely innocent when it comes to the impoverishment of various nations - commercial exploitation has also also played a part in that impoverishment.

As for the UK looking after its own people - it could do just that, if it wanted to, regardless. But it would need a government that wanted to invest in public services, and the wellbeing of the whole nation. And that is not the government we have or have had for the last 13 years.

Immigration and the asylum of refugees has been weaponised and is being used as a political tool. It will not solve the problem which can only be dealt with by a world-wide integrated policy and properly funded and staffed government agencies to deal with it.

Exactly!

www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5bsgRpxHLo

Controversial barge that houses 500 asylum seekers arrives in Dorset

Thank God, I came from a country that never signed the international refugee treaties and therefore has no asylum policy in place.

After saying that a quarter of the workers there roughly 1.2 million are foreigners and foreign expats but they are all come in with valid work visas.

Their salaries have to be above a certain threshold before they can bring in their dependents ie spouse and children.

I personally feel UK should not be taking in anymore refugees or asylum seekers since the government cannot even look after its own people.

No country can cope with a huge influx of ½ million people coming in each year.

vickymeldrew

MillisBoris:
I think you will find that the asylum seekers who come here speak English, not French.
Those who remain in France speak French.

Surely it's because they might already have relatives here? France probably hadn't allowed them to settle there.

We do need a quick processing system, without a doubt.

But, we cannot keep taking endless people.

Something needs to change.

knspol

We all grumble about not enough housing, difficulty in getting a GP apt, difficulty getting children into local schools and so on. As a country we cannot cope with the number of migrants turning up on our shores. IMO the majority are not refugees fleeing persecution but more likely economic migrants seeking free healthcare, housing etc. They need to be housed somewhere and apparently we're running out of hotel space to the detriment of our tourist industry. Where else can they be housed???

The main cause of problems with education, housing and NHS is 13 years of Tory misrule. Their ideology is to reduce public services, remember they got rid of 20,000 experienced police officers, had many experienced managers i l.a. Made redundant.

We need a more effective efficient system for processing asylum seekers. We also need better governance of our country

MillisBoris:
I think you will find that the asylum seekers who come here speak English, not French.
Those who remain in France speak French.

MillieBoris

Will somebody please explain very simply why all these economic migrants etc are so keen to cross the channel?? What are the French doing right that we are doing wrong. Perhaps we should look at the French system

Maybe this one good reason
France
Channel migrants: French politicians call on UK to overhaul 'lax' labour laws to deter crossings
Migrants stand aboard an RNLI (Royal National Lifeboat Institution) lifeboat after being rescued crossing the English channel at Dungeness, England, September 7, 2021.
By Alasdair Sandford with AFP • Updated: 12/10/2021
Calais area politicians blame the UK for lax labour laws that attract illegal migration, responding to UK criticism that the French aren't doing enough to stop Channel crossings.

French politicians hit back at the UK and at their own government on Monday as a surge in the number of migrants trying to cross the English Channel in small boats heightened tensions between the two countries.

Politicians from the region have criticised the UK for "lax" labour laws they say attract illegal migration, also calling into question the 2003 accord between France and Britain aimed at tackling the migrant crisis along the coast.

"I think it's time for the British government to change its internal law, to make it harder and harder for illegal migrants to get a job in the UK, to get a house in the UK, to live in communities in the UK," Pierre-Henri Dumont, French MP for the Calais area, told Euronews.

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"Why all these migrants are in Calais is not because they want to stay in Calais, it's because they want to go to the UK because it's easier to be illegal in the UK than anywhere else in Europe."

Describing the British as "cynical" and "sarcastic", the mayor of Calais called on President Macron to bring together various authorities to take a tougher approach and get to the root of the problem.

"The British are cynical, sarcastic, unable to reform their Labour Code because it is there, the problem, and it is they, in fact, who largely promote illegal work and therefore reinforce the pull factor," Natacha Bouchart told FranceInfo Radio.

"it is time to break the agreement of more than twenty years ago and put the ins and outs back on the table, since they are making no effort."

France rescues more than 340 UK-bound migrants in English Channel
Damien Carême, an MEP from Europe Ecology - The Greens and a former mayor of Grande Synthe near Dunkirk, described the British prime minister as untrustworthy.

"(Brexit negotiator) Michel Barnier had the confidence of Europe, and of the United Kingdom, but it is clear that it was impossible to trust Boris Johnson," he told FranceInfo. "There is a populist withdrawal under Boris Johnson which suggests that discussion is impossible."

Watch the interview with French MP Pierre-Henri Dumont below:

Carême also called for the Le Touquet treaty to be ditched: "This Le Touquet treaty is no more glorious than the treaty between Europe and Turkey to keep refugees at home".

Such calls have long been made by Xavier Bertrand, president of the Hauts-de-France region, who has now put his name forward as a candidate for the right-wing Les Républicains party in next year's presidential election.

The British government says more than 1,100 were intercepted by UK controls at sea on Friday and Saturday. According to the UK news agency the Press Association, 17,000 migrants have crossed the Channel in 2021, twice the number for 2020.

The UK has said that money promised to France to help prevent the crossings will be paid in the coming weeks.

UK to pay France €62.7 million to curb Channel migration
Britain's plan to send migrant boats back to France 'inhumane' and 'unworkable', critics say
In July, the two countries signed a deal, under which Britain would pay France €63 million, to increase patrols to clamp down on illegal migration across the Channel. But UK Home Secretary (interior minister) Priti Patel recently threatened to withhold the funding unless more people were stopped from reaching the British coast.

In September France said it would not tolerate "financial blackmail", following reports that British border gurads were to receive training on how to turn back migrant boats before they reached the English coast.

Even before the weekend's crossings, UK-French relations were further strained on Friday when Sky News broadcast images showing about twenty migrants taking to sea in broad daylight from the coastline south of Calais, in front of stationary police officers.

The French authorities say thousands of migrants are intercepted by French patrols as they try to cross to England. At the weekend, Interior Minister Gérald Darmanin called on the UK to pay up the money owed under the agreement.

"We haven't seen the financial colour of the €63 million," he said. "However, additional gendarmes have been hired and technological resources have been bought to guard this border."

The UK has far fewer asylum requests than France. It received 29,456 asylum applications in 2020, according to the House of Commons Library. Of EU countries, European Union figures say Germany had 102,500 applicants, Spain had 86,400, with France in third receiving 81,800.

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Old I know,but with the amount they let come over, perhaps they have changed their mindsl

Will somebody please explain very simply why all these economic migrants etc are so keen to cross the channel?? What are the French doing right that we are doing wrong. Perhaps we should look at the French system

Anniel good posts. I'm actually amazed and angry that according to the Government website you posted

If you’ve been refused asylum
You’ll be given:

somewhere to live
£47.93 per person on a payment card for food, clothing and toiletries

No wonder they are coming over on the dinghies

HousePlantQueen

Nicenanny3

450 illegals arrived today nearly one barge full.

They are not "illegals" whatever our opinion of the offshore accommodation barges is.

Until they land on our shores, and claim asylum,under maritime law,they are illegal. With no documentation or permission to enter this country.
Is it illegal to arrive in the UK by boat?
That means someone who reaches the UK on a small boat could face up to four years in prison. But people who make the Channel crossing are protected by international law if they claim asylum once they arrive.27 Apr 2023
www.channel4.com › news

To be honest, in the current housing climate they are fortunate to be offered anything. My, soon to be ex, daughter in law decided she no longer wanted to be married and wanted her share from the marital home. The only way that this could be afforded was to sell up. My son is going to use the small proceeds (they’d only lived there for 3 years) to buy a narrow boat, he will live there and the children will stay with him 3 or 4 nights a week, My daughter in law has tried for months to rent a house or flat but there are up to 100 people going after each property and with 2 children and not a very high wage earner (although she has offered to pay a year’s rent in advance out of her share of the house) she has no chance at all. Air b and b places want between £2000 and £3000 a month for a room and flats start at £7000 for a month! She’d quite like someone to come along and offer her anything at all! I know this is her decision but then all the illegal refugees made the decision to come here, didn’t they?

The Rwanda scheme will see them sent to Rwanda for processing and to remain Freya.