Should the President of the Spanish FA resign

Agreed. In one way it IS about women's football - who gets to control it, or who has been - everywhere.

Well said Dickens and some other posters who have articulated things more clearly than I could.
I’ve been shocked and disappointed reading posts excusing or minimising this man’s behaviour.

I’d hoped times had changed 1969 when I, as a young newly married woman had a more senior work colleague play with the zip on the front of my dress while making suggestive comments. I felt embarrassed, intimidated, powerless and never felt able to wear that dress to work again. Was I confident to call it out, no but I dearly wish I had been. I can see from some comments here that others have had similar experiences in the past

Surely we as women who are older, perhaps wiser and more confident now, have a responsibility to name it for what it is, sexual harassment. If we’d all been braver years ago maybe things would be an easier for our daughters and granddaughters now. But having said that, the responsibility for ant sort of sexual harassment always lies firmly with the perpetrators.

grannyqueenie

Well said Dickens and some other posters who have articulated things more clearly than I could.
I’ve been shocked and disappointed reading posts excusing or minimising this man’s behaviour.

I’d hoped times had changed 1969 when I, as a young newly married woman had a more senior work colleague play with the zip on the front of my dress while making suggestive comments. I felt embarrassed, intimidated, powerless and never felt able to wear that dress to work again. Was I confident to call it out, no but I dearly wish I had been. I can see from some comments here that others have had similar experiences in the past

Surely we as women who are older, perhaps wiser and more confident now, have a responsibility to name it for what it is, sexual harassment. If we’d all been braver years ago maybe things would be an easier for our daughters and granddaughters now. But having said that, the responsibility for ant sort of sexual harassment always lies firmly with the perpetrators.

Surely we as women who are older, perhaps wiser and more confident now, have a responsibility to name it for what it is, sexual harassment. If we’d all been braver years ago maybe things would be an easier for our daughters and granddaughters now. But having said that, the responsibility for ant sort of sexual harassment always lies firmly with the perpetrators.

👍👍👍

I think many on here will agree that when you've been grabbed, or groped, the first re-action is shock - you can't quite believe it's happening, and, in such situations we were often stunned into a state of immobility because we didn't quite know how to deal with it. We knew, instinctively, that a slap would've escalated the situation, and caused a scene. It takes a hell of a lot of presence of mind to deal adequately with this kind of thing - it might look easy in films, but the reality is quite different.

Those who blame the victim - "well, she just stood there - why didn't she push him away?"... yeah, so easy isn't it when millions of eyes are on you to know in a split second how to deal with it.

It's so depressing when people find excuses for what is, and always will be, regardless of the time or place, an attack on the integrity of a woman's body. You don't put your mouth on another person's mouth without their permission.

Well said granniequenie and Dickens

So true Dickens I didn’t do a thing when it happened to me not a thing You are stunned, you doubt yourself did that really happen, then you start thinking did I do anything to give the wrong signals, you’re embarrassed it’s like if you take a tumble the first thing you do is look to see if anyone saw you, then you get up with the feeling ‘of course I meant to do that’ you are mortified and basically don’t know how you should behave without making a fuss

The latest is his mother has locked herself in a church and gone on hunger strike I m beginning to think they re a loopy family

We kiss/peck people, male and female, we know on the cheeks, sometimes up to four times depending in which region we are in France but never on the lips.
Has he done the same to a man in the same circumstances in the past?

Hunger strike a bit of an over reaction don’t you think !!!

I hesitate to judge him, thinking of reactions when Wales has beaten England in the six nations and I was in the stadium, been hugged, kissed, lifted off my feet , can only imagine Wales winning a World Cup

BlueBelle

So true Dickens I didn’t do a thing when it happened to me not a thing You are stunned, you doubt yourself did that really happen, then you start thinking did I do anything to give the wrong signals, you’re embarrassed it’s like if you take a tumble the first thing you do is look to see if anyone saw you, then you get up with the feeling ‘of course I meant to do that’ you are mortified and basically don’t know how you should behave without making a fuss

The latest is his mother has locked herself in a church and gone on hunger strike I m beginning to think they re a loopy family

The latest is his mother has locked herself in a church and gone on hunger strike I m beginning to think they re a loopy family

Ultimately this will end up being all about Rubiales and his family - all because he had to make the win about him. Why the hell couldn't he have been gracious and just given her the traditional 'hug' and peck on the cheek, like most do now? Why was the head-holding, mouth-kissing deemed necessary by him... it's almost like he felt the need to dramatise the win in this way to make himself more relevant to it.

Well said BlueBelle and Dickens

Anniebach, with respect, the scenario you experienced isn’t comparable to the behaviour of Rubiales.

We used to go on holiday abroad with the expectation of having our bottoms pinched especially by Italians.
I already described up thread being pinned against a wall by the company accountant, yes these things happened and it was wrong then and wrong now. Difference is women today are standing up and saying a big NO this is not ok.

Ism64 and being pinned against a wall is comparable?

Annie your short combative posts on this make it difficult to answer. I don’t understand what you’re saying. If you were deliberately pinned up against a wall against your will - what are we comparing that with

Iam being pinned against a wall, yes frightening, I experienced a hand up my skirt when I accepted a lift from someone I knew well, I managed to get out of the car and walked nearly 4 miles home, trapped between a filing cabinet and a wall , bottom pinched when leaning over a desk, these did not take place in front of millions of people whilst high as a kite on the euphoria or winning a World Cup. So I cannot compare the happenings I have just spoken of with that

But it’s not one or the other Anniebach They are ALL wrong your experiences, my experiences, others that have posted on here and the lady footballer. None are right, they weren’t then, and they aren’t now, luckily women have more of a voice now

I find it very hard to understand why you find the need to defend the man

I don’t understand the comment Annie.
I was giving an example of men’s behaviour then which was never called out . The sense of entitlement and power imbalance meant he thought he could do what he wanted.

Thing is it’s over 50 years later and at long last men’s bad behaviour is no longer acceptable. Once men call out other men then perhaps things may change. In the meantime we speak out.

Anniebach

Iam being pinned against a wall, yes frightening, I experienced a hand up my skirt when I accepted a lift from someone I knew well, I managed to get out of the car and walked nearly 4 miles home, trapped between a filing cabinet and a wall , bottom pinched when leaning over a desk, these did not take place in front of millions of people whilst high as a kite on the euphoria or winning a World Cup. So I cannot compare the happenings I have just spoken of with that

But isn't it all part of the same 'culture'?

The hand up your skirt and the bottom-pinching are all part of the same male sense of entitlement that persuaded Rubiales he could grab her head and kiss her on the mouth.

Some men are more overbearing than others - it's just a matter of degrees.

Now his mother has closed herself off in a church, claiming a hunger strike till the "hunt" for her son ends.....

I swear reality is stranger than fiction

Anniebach, very unpleasant experiences, sadly shared by many of us in our age group. That doesn’t make it ok. It certainly doesn’t make Rubiales behaviour acceptable because some men behave even more badly

He did not touch her bottom

And….

1.Grasping an acquaintance’s head while you kiss them does not imply consent.
2. He should have apologised as soon as he realised that people weren’t happy with his actions, even if he felt it was the sort of kiss, he would give his non-existent daughters.

Yes he should have apologised when he knew he had upset her

Anniebach

Yes he should have apologised when he knew he had upset her

Sadly, that would have meant accepting he was in the wrong and he seems to be unwilling to do that.

Its been a very long meeting this afternoon and evening but his own Football Association tonight have asked him to step down and resign.

Its both an issue in itself but has become a huge issue for three reasons

Millions over the world witnessed the behaviour and asking, what's appropriate and what isnt:

it reflects changes happening in Spanish society and on Spanish Society.

The focus is on a man with a great deal of power who thinks what he did was fine - so questions of how can he reasonably still hold that power is in question.