MerylStreep
I doubt if the majority of protesters could point on a map where Israel, Gaza, and the West Bank are.
You've got that right!
Bereavement wipes out everything
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Israel/Palestine - To think this is how I feel
(449 Posts)"Britons despair of violence instead of taking sides"
A head line from yesterday's Sunday Times who printed the results of of a YouGov Poll with possibly an interesting statistic of the different age demographics and how they are lined up in their support of the opposing sides in this terrible conflict. I'm focusing here on the middle ground headed up where sympathies lie,
"Both sides equally" as follows: 18-24 17%, 25-49 28%, 50-64 39%, 65 plus 37% Possibly that response of the older generation, could be argued reflects the more measured attitude of knowing that, as with most conflicts, there are two sides and situations are generally more nuanced than the superficial black and white.
Hamas attack on the defenceless citizens of Israel was the stuff of nightmares, there was a headline, a few days ago in particular, as to what was inflicted on babies which I wish I'd never seen, but once read cannot be unread. This was premeditated, barbaric in the worst possible sense, enough to think "we've come so far in how mankind has developed, but something like this happens and we might just as well be back in ancient times" We know there is another side, The Palestinians have undoubtedly been treated most unfairly, but nothing justifies the brutality that was meted out that day.
Now the Jewish communities of the western world are having the full force of the hatred of the Israeli government well and truly dumped on them. Why? THEY HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING WRONG! they are communities like the rest of us just peacefully trying to go about their daily lives. Stars of David have been daubed on Jewish houses, businesses, within their communities in Germany and France and to a lesser extent here, all resonant of previous nightmare times Jewish people lived through. The other day a Jewish woman in Lyon was stabbed, how much worse is this all going to get, it's unbelievably depressing that one community can be so unfairly reviled in this way. What of the pro Palestinian marches, whilst I accept many marching are doing just that supporting Palestine, there are equally plenty of agitators and Hamas supporters. Posters pin pointed have shown comments such as these "make this a Jew free world" "Rid the world of the Jews" the hate is there in full force, once again for the umpteenth time they are being "othered" singled out, attacked, blamed, just to be Jewish is to be conflated with whatever the government of Israel is doing. The demonstrations are becoming more and more aggressive in their stance, should they for example be allowed to occupy the concourses of London train terminals, where commuters have to pass through that throng, and if Jewish, I imagine that could be alarming as it was on the tube train recently, when the train driver, who I hope was sacked, decided to initiate a completely inappropriate support Palestine chant amongst commuters on his train. Some of those demonstrating aren't doing it in that passive, dopey way of say Just Stop Oil, it's full on vitriol on the part of some militants, less about support of one faction and more about haranguing our Jewish community. IMO they should not be allowed to occupy areas where the general public have to pass through and the police should do more to arrest those that are overtly committing hate crimes against Jewish people.
In summary, another heartbreaking headline in yesterday's paper from Palestinian Dr Izzeldin Abuelaish "An Israeli shell killed three of my girls, but hate will only prolong the horror"
MerylStreep
I doubt if the majority of protesters could point on a map where Israel, Gaza, and the West Bank are.
Or know much about the history of the region.
Or the fact that thousands of Muslim servicemen lost their lives in WW2 and we honour and remember them too.
The attacks by Hamas are indefensible and I was shocked to hear about anti Jewish taunts and graffiti but the vast majority of demonstrators are not anti Jewish but totally against the Israeli attacks on innocent Palestinian civilians in which the Israelis are behaving as badly as Hamas. A huge number of children have died or been injured and have seen terrible things from which they will never recover, this will sure drive them to support Hamas when they are older. I despair of the world
Well said Soniah and sadly I agree with you.
As with all cultures/races/faiths there are “good” and “bad” people, just to simplify.
Too many innocent people are still being killed in many areas of our world, not in the name of religion, but in the pursuit of land !
Hamas attacked Israel, a cease fire and Hamas would agree !
Exactly Anniebach- that is tragically true. There are people and organisations that have the uncompromising mentality of either win or lose. Hitler was one of those - would talking and appeasement have worked then? Never in a million years - not a chance. Luckily we had the man for the job. Hamas is another such organisation and by their evil strategies are putting innocent people at risk and allowing them to be killed. For instance, I do believe that the rules of war state that opposing forces should wear uniforms- the Israelis do - Hamas?
My fathers cousin was murdered in 1947 by Jewish terrorists in Palestine. For that and other atrocities the Jewish terrorists for a country and their leader became the first prime minister of that stolen country. In 1947 Jewish terrorists kidnapped people and blew stuff up just like Hamas are doing now, then the Jewish terrorists hung their captives. I want Sunday to pass peacefully for the sake of all our veterans but we all know there are people out there who want to make a show of themselves just becuase that is the way they are. I hope the police deal with them sharply.
The Hamas atrocity of 7th October was appalling and horrific. It needs to be viewed in the context of the displacement of Palestinians after the War. Palestinians have been living under Israeli control for decades and there has been not progress towards a peaceful solution on either side since the days of Arafat, Rabin and the Oslo Accord of 30 years ago.
Britain has been complicit in this situation, post war, allowing Zionist terrorists to take control of the region, set up their Government and dictate terms. It must be remembered that the UN has sanctioned Israel multiple times for breaching resolutions.
The situation is never going to change unless both sides talk and negotiate their way to a solution. Netanyahu us in record in 2019 saying that it suited Israel to have Hamas formenting unrest. Even Thatcher and Major talked to the IRA secretly in a bid to stop the troubles..
The marches each weekend are not anti- Jewish, but pro- peace. Indeed many Jewish people participate in them. I speak with some inside information as my cousin is Jewish, having lived on the border with Lebanon for 40 years. Even she understands the Palestinian position and the absence of any agency in the situation.
Hamas does not represent the people of Gaza- no elections have been held there for decades.
The sad thing is that it’s extremists on both sides who fuel this war and revolt. Prior to the formation of Israel, Jews and Arabs Co-existed peacefully and that is a very sad realisation.
People need to get their heads out of the clouds and face up to the reality of the consequences of mass immigration.
Absolutely right, Curtaintwitcher.
OK, I'm with the group that despairs of the violence without wishing to take sides. Any act act of violence and the torture and slaughter of anyone is horrific.
I have thought about the following:
HAMAS...did not happen in a vacuum and a reason is certainly not a justifiable excuse.
Some regard any criticism of the State of Israel as tantamount to anti semitism. Surely any state whose actions cannot be criticised without accusations of race hatred flying around, is worrying.
Israel has a right, indeed a duty, to protect its citizens.
The constant killing of innocent people in Gaza is sick yes Israel
was attacked first but all this killing its going to heal nothing It will create more anger retaliation and keep the hatred growing from Palestine
The West Bank is looking dreadful, the Israelis are acting like terrorists.
Very well said. What happenedon7th Oct was a pre meditated and deliberate act of brutality and hate and upset me terribly. All this started because of Hamas! I also feel terribly sad for Palestinian civilians who are innocent and have become collateral damage in all of this. So sad and upsetting on all sides. 🙏🙏🙏
👍
Once upon a time, in Palestine, Jews and Arabs lived as neighbours in harmony, once upon a time Greeks lived in Turkey and Turks lived in Greece, all lived in harmony. Until the politicians started to stir things up. Greed is the enemy.
Whitewavemark2
The West Bank is looking dreadful, the Israelis are acting like terrorists.
How, where, when?
I've reported your remark as a blood libel against Jewish people. I'm appalled. I very rarely contribute, but have enjoyed most of the different interesting posts through the years. However your post is completely unacceptable.
Which post GrannyDeeto4?
Zuki
The constant killing of innocent people in Gaza is sick yes Israel
was attacked first but all this killing its going to heal nothing It will create more anger retaliation and keep the hatred growing from Palestine
Yes, exactly what Jewish friends in Israel say
'' am concerned that what happened on 7th October has turned into such a collective ptsd for the Israeli people that its going to be harder than ever for them to consider making concessions for the Palestinians, and the cycle of horrors will continue''
people in Israel who oppose Netanyahu and the bombing of Gaza are being silences, sacked from their jobs, attacked verbally and in the street, beaten up black and blue and even imprisonned, right now.
This friend was born and bred in Israel, served in the Army and Kibbutz, and so did her husband. They moved away because of their fear of Netanyahu. Many family and friends still there, including ACs and GCs. They have been attacked verbally, and threatened for voicing their anger re Netanyahu's policies and bombing of Gaza.
''You can share my posts its really important that people know what's going on. But anonymously would be better, as there is a McCarthy witch hunt going on in Israel. People are being put in prison for expressing the slightest empathy with the Gaza victims
I am scared if I go back they could arrest me too, and I have to protect my family still there'
Believe me or not.
'' The Israeli Palestinians are getting hit the worst. Losing jobs and getting arrested right left and centre.''
Fleurpepper perhaps you will answer , you know so much ,
Would Hamas agree to a ceasefire?
That’s one couple only.
Which people have been imprisoned for simply voicing concern over innocent victims in Gaza? Israeli citizens are still in shock at the sheer hellishness and brutality of those 7th October murders/ hostage taking but even so it’s doubtful that there have been trials and imprisonment of anyone who merely says they feel sorry for Gazan citizens.
Sorry but it doesn’t stack up.There would have to have been far more to it than that.
I think Hamas would love a ceasefire! Regroup. Sort themselves out. They’re already begging Hezbollah to help them - they have 10x the armaments and weapons of Hamas. But if Hezbollah step in, America WILL step up.
I read today that some of Gaza’s citizens are publicly railing against Hamas. Hopefully the tide is turning. Ordinary peaceful Palestinians are having the scales fall from their eyes. They know they’re being used as cover/shields for Hamas. A terrorist organisation that has prioritised tunnels under hospitals, schools and nurseries instead of using all that subverted money for the good of the ordinary Gazan people. They rule the Palestinians with an iron fist!
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