The Supreme Court has ruled the Rwanda deportations are illegal

It’s a bit like inflation. The problems are never, according to the government, their fault. But when things improve it’s always down to what they have done.

I thought Brexit was all about protecting our borders? Hasn’t gone well, has it? Today one Conservative MP ( can’t remember who) was blaming France for not doing what we pay them to do and then it was pointed out that numbers had decreased over the last few months. Might that not be because of what the French are doing?

Feel free to disagree 😃 that’s what forums are for.I have no real hope that either the present government or Labour will turn the tide of the small boat issue.

Disagree with Oreo’s last comment. Stopping the small boats may increase some Tory majorities and maybe tip them in in a seat or two, but not a make or break issue to the electorate at large for all the reasons already given.

So was I (admittedly not in great detail) but I really can't think of anything like it. Even the pre-WW2 refusal to turn Jews away, bigoted as it was, wasn't quite so pre-planned and heartless.

I was talking about laws that were brought in, that were seen as bearable when they applied to others, but never thought they could be applied to all growstuff.

growstuff

Oreo

The Rwanda plan is still on.
RS on tv now saying just that.There will be a treaty ready to go through Parliament to show Rwanda is safe for the immigrants, and if all else fails he wouldn’t allow the court in Strasbourg to scupper it.

And I believe every word RS says!

Have you read the full judgment?

The Supreme Court certainly doesn't agree that Rwanda is safe for asylum seekers. The ECHR is only a small part of it.

Just reporting what RS was saying at that particular moment on tv.
I rarely believe what any politician says will come to pass.
My further comment that any party who could stop the small boats would win an election is still a valid one.Whether any party actually could do it is a moot point.

Primrose53

foxie48

maddyone

Oh thank you foxie. I thought you were talking about asylum seekers, but you’re talking about people whose asylum applications have been refused. I guess they must be put into detention centres. I would hope that if they’re housed in a detention centre prior to deportation, the detention there should be a very short time. But maybe it’s not.

People from the Windrush generation who were here quite legally and had British citizenship were held in detention centres and then deported. Really shocking. About 50% are eventually given right to stay, and there have been cases of people held for 2 or more years before being released. Sadly not a shining example of British efficiency. We really should be able to act more humanely.

I think you are a bit muddled up. Can you rewrite that post.

Tell me which bit is muddled up and I'll address it.

As far as I know, the pre-WW2 government didn't consider totally ignoring national and international laws.

DaisyAnneReturns

growstuff

DaisyAnneReturns

Iam64

DAR - I fear people who reject the EHRC don’t realise they’d be giving up their own rights, just that ”illegals’ should have no rights at all, ever

I know, Iam and MayBee I know, but it is is amazingly sad.

And we have seen if all before.

TBH I'm not sure I have ever seen anything like this before - not in the UK anyway.

I was looking back into history growstuff.

So was I (admittedly not in great detail) but I really can't think of anything like it. Even the pre-WW2 refusal to turn Jews away, bigoted as it was, wasn't quite so pre-planned and heartless.

Oreo

He will try very hard to achieve this before an election is called I bet.
Any party which can stop the boats will do well in the election, like it or not.

Any party which thinks it can "stop the boats" is living in cloud cuckoo land and anybody who thinks that any of the current plans will work needs to give their head a wobble.

Resources for investigating trafficking gangs have been slashed. The UK has refused to take up offers for processing in France. The UK has also cut the number of claims being processed, so people are left in limbo.

What we've seen over the last year or so is loud-mouthed rhetoric, which hasn't a hope in hell of reducing the number of asylum seekers, but it persuades a few people that something "is being done".

growstuff

DaisyAnneReturns

Iam64

DAR - I fear people who reject the EHRC don’t realise they’d be giving up their own rights, just that ”illegals’ should have no rights at all, ever

I know, Iam and MayBee I know, but it is is amazingly sad.

And we have seen if all before.

TBH I'm not sure I have ever seen anything like this before - not in the UK anyway.

I was looking back into history growstuff.

growstuff

JudyBloom

JenniferEccles is right, they have come through safe countries.

So?

Those safe countries have no obligation to accept them.

Neither should we.

Iam64

foxie, thanks for highlighting what happened to some wind rush people

My experience of asylum seekers isn’t vast but it’s genuine. Generally genuine people, escaping death, wanting to work. We should allow then to work as their claims are processed. One family I know well escaped certain death for political reasons. The and their 4 adult children eventually granted asylum. Mrs asylum is a fantastic foster carer, mr was a uni lecturer, now teaches English to refugee children who arrive with no English, helps them progress from his school into local schools. Three of their children already qualified and working in nhs, one at university. I could go on,
My experience of our immigrant communities is no different than our white British community. Mixed but generally positive. Most people work hard. Most immigrants want a better life so contribute
I might be leftie leaning but I’m not inexperienced or naive

You can add to not being different from the settled British community that these people have had the resilience, bravery and entrepreneurship to leave the comfort zone of their home country behind and travel halfway across the world, knowing that their lives are at risk.

DaisyAnneReturns

Iam64

DAR - I fear people who reject the EHRC don’t realise they’d be giving up their own rights, just that ”illegals’ should have no rights at all, ever

I know, Iam and MayBee I know, but it is is amazingly sad.

And we have seen if all before.

TBH I'm not sure I have ever seen anything like this before - not in the UK anyway.

Oreo

The Rwanda plan is still on.
RS on tv now saying just that.There will be a treaty ready to go through Parliament to show Rwanda is safe for the immigrants, and if all else fails he wouldn’t allow the court in Strasbourg to scupper it.

And I believe every word RS says!

Have you read the full judgment?

The Supreme Court certainly doesn't agree that Rwanda is safe for asylum seekers. The ECHR is only a small part of it.

Iam64

DAR - I fear people who reject the EHRC don’t realise they’d be giving up their own rights, just that ”illegals’ should have no rights at all, ever

I know, Iam and MayBee I know, but it is is amazingly sad.

And we have seen if all before.

JudyBloom

JenniferEccles is right, they have come through safe countries.

So?

Those safe countries have no obligation to accept them.

Calendargirl

On the News tonight, Yvette Cooper, Shadow Home Secretary, was asked what Labour will do if (when) in power, to sort things.

She said they will tackle the gangs who get paid by the migrants to get them across here, or words to that effect.

Didn’t say how they were going to do that though.

Well, they could start by reversing the savage funding cuts to the agencies responsible for tackling smuggling gangs.

Allsorts

Can those that want everyone to come here, tell me where they are to go, our own people can’t get even a rented place. If these people are desperate why don’t they stay in the first safe country. They come here as we are a soft touch,

Is there anybody on GN (or even in the whole country) who wants everyone to come here?

So you seriously think all asylum seekers should stay in Greece or Italy? Do you realise how lucky the UK is that it's the end of the line? BTW the majority of asylum seekers aren't even heading for the UK.

Urmstongran - come on now, don’t be bringing your older northern woman experience and advice to our glorious government.
There’s a Big Risk we may be coming at this with practical advice, despite setting off from opposite ends of the political spectrum

Germanshepherdsmum

I expect the centres differ growstuff. Life didn’t look bad on the barge for instance, apart from legionnaires! My son lives very close to Wethersfield. I think work there is ongoing as the air base had been abandoned with the intention of redevelopment and they don’t yet know if the council’s challenge will succeed (which I hope it does - the proposal has killed the local property market).

And I thought residents were concerned about the location of the airbase as unsuitable because it's remote. The latest is that they're concerned that there are two gun clubs located nearby and asylum seekers will be traumatised. I didn't realise the main concern was house prices.

DaisyAnneReturns

foxie48

If the govt decides to take us out of the ECHR, I for one, would be prepared to come out onto the streets and march in protest. Or, perhaps they will have changed the law to prevent protests?? I find the thinking and direction of this govt increasingly worrying. Identify scapegoats, use inflammatory language, try to do things contrary to the law, try to change the law so they can do what they want. I know this sounds alarmist but I genuinely feel that unless the Conservative party moves away from it's right wingers we could become increasingly undemocratic.

I think we would have to foxie.

Why, oh why are people prepared to give up there own human rights?!

Because they don’t realise that something that will take basic human rights from a refugee might actually take away their rights, too. Because they think they’re a different sort of human being and untouchable.

Why couldn’t the government have spent all those millions on hiring more staff & centres to process the screening of migrants? The situation we have is ridiculous. Moves at a snail pace - understandably as there is a lot of checking to do if people arrive without passports etc - so that’s fair enough. But why not increase the cohort of checkers?

Nearly 700 migrants arrived just on Monday. At this rate more migrants arrive daily than get dealt with from the huge backlog of thousands. That must feel dispiriting for the staff trying to sort them out. You’d go home from work pretty demoralised I expect.

Another day at work, another boatload ...

DAR - I fear people who reject the EHRC don’t realise they’d be giving up their own rights, just that ”illegals’ should have no rights at all, ever

foxie48

If the govt decides to take us out of the ECHR, I for one, would be prepared to come out onto the streets and march in protest. Or, perhaps they will have changed the law to prevent protests?? I find the thinking and direction of this govt increasingly worrying. Identify scapegoats, use inflammatory language, try to do things contrary to the law, try to change the law so they can do what they want. I know this sounds alarmist but I genuinely feel that unless the Conservative party moves away from it's right wingers we could become increasingly undemocratic.

I think we would have to foxie.

Why, oh why are people prepared to give up there own human rights?!