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The Supreme Court has ruled the Rwanda deportations are illegal

(234 Posts)
foxie48 Wed 15-Nov-23 10:38:02

Thank goodness for that, I am extremely relieved that they have made this ruling. It will be interesting to see how the Govt will react to this. I was particularly interested in this quote from Lord Reed on BBC in Oct 2020
“We don’t do politics, we do decide legal questions which can have political ramifications and they can be important political consequences, but the issue we decide is strictly legal issue.”

GrannyGravy13 Wed 15-Nov-23 10:55:47

Let’s hope that the Government has a Plan B, as the current situation is untenable.

It is not fair on the refugees/migrants, it is not fair on the communities who have a sudden influx of young men (with nothing to occupy them) nor is it sustainable for the public purse.

Germanshepherdsmum Wed 15-Nov-23 11:04:52

It is indeed untenable. The result of a challenge to the government’s plan to house up to 1700 male asylum seekers in a disused air base in rural Essex is currently awaited.

The SC said that in principle sending asylum seekers to a safe third country is not unlawful, they simply didn’t consider that Rwanda fitted the bill, so maybe a deal will be done with another country.

Whitewavemark2 Wed 15-Nov-23 11:11:42

The decision was pretty damning. It goes so far as to say that any future Home Secretary cannot simply take a potential country of transportation assurances if safety fir the transportees, they have to take all sorts of other evidence into consideration.

One has to seriously question the governments judgement.

Iam64 Wed 15-Nov-23 11:12:13

I listened to the Judgement. It was detailed and as the evidence was summarised and reviewed it became clear it would rule the proposal to deport asylum seekers to Rwanda was unlawful.

It’s shocking that Braverman and her advisors didn’t reach that conclusion and crack in in finding ways to speed up applications and return young men to Eastern Europe where they don’t face war or death because they’re gay/support the wrong side

growstuff Wed 15-Nov-23 11:13:07

How about processing claims more quickly?

Would it be unreasonable to consider whether Plan B (Plan C or whatever) would actually be achievable?

MayBee70 Wed 15-Nov-23 11:19:31

So the next thing will be the government wanting to take us out of the ECHR. God help us all if that happens. First they came for refugees and then they came for all of us….

Whitewavemark2 Wed 15-Nov-23 11:19:58

Shades of Brexit😄😄

Lawyers and experts tell the government that it will never work

Government ignores it and it blows up in their face.

Of course dealing with the claims is the way forward and perhaps now their hands will be forced - or perhaps they aren’t up to it.

Iam64 Wed 15-Nov-23 11:22:14

I fear they aren’t up to it Whitewave. I’m relieved about the Judgement but irritated SB Rishi, their lawyers and advisors ever considered it legal never mind ethical

LauraNorderr Wed 15-Nov-23 11:27:51

This crazy idea was not only unlawful but immoral, uncaring, unaffordable, etc.
Now let’s see some workable and humane solutions put on the table.
Money spent on facilitating speedier processing would be a good start.

foxie48 Wed 15-Nov-23 11:36:38

If the govt decides to take us out of the ECHR, I for one, would be prepared to come out onto the streets and march in protest. Or, perhaps they will have changed the law to prevent protests?? I find the thinking and direction of this govt increasingly worrying. Identify scapegoats, use inflammatory language, try to do things contrary to the law, try to change the law so they can do what they want. I know this sounds alarmist but I genuinely feel that unless the Conservative party moves away from it's right wingers we could become increasingly undemocratic.

Whitewavemark2 Wed 15-Nov-23 11:42:52

foxie It isn’t alarmist it is verifiable fact

Germanshepherdsmum Wed 15-Nov-23 11:45:25

The ‘crazy idea’ was not unlawful per se - it was the choice of Rwanda which, in the SC’s view, which was unlawful.

LauraNorderr Wed 15-Nov-23 11:48:44

The crazy idea to send desperate people to Rwanda is unlawful.

Whitewavemark2 Wed 15-Nov-23 11:49:32

That is right. A so called safe country may well pass the test, but frankly just giving that a modicum of thought will become immediate clear that it is never going to work.

MayBee70 Wed 15-Nov-23 11:49:35

I keep wondering if there’s another country I could move to and can’t believe I’m thinking it.

Whitewavemark2 Wed 15-Nov-23 11:50:00


Grantanow Wed 15-Nov-23 12:24:27

The unanimous Supreme Court decision shows just how useless Braverman was as Home Secretary in devising an unlawful scheme and her winge that Sunak has no Plan B rebounds on her as the responsible Minister for anticipating problems. I doubt efforts to find yet another recipient country will succeed as the risk of refoulement to refugees' country of origin will always be an issue. The underlying point is that the UK needs more immigration to fill jobs in the NHS and elsewhere. The boat people are a very small percentage of legal immigration and blown out of proportion by the Tories for electoral reasons. Current refugees should be allowed to do paid work. The argument there is a reservoir of idle Brits is specious - many are disabled, suffering from long Covid and too old for manual work and they are often in the wrong location with little prospect of moving due to the lack of adequate social housing.

JenniferEccles Wed 15-Nov-23 12:26:24

‘Desperate people’ ?
Really? As we all know the vast majority of them are young males, economic migrants who turn up here illegally and expect to be housed, fed, given spending money, and the thing is that’s exactly what happens.

I’m very disappointed the Rwanda plan is deemed unlawful, but as I understand it, it’s only that particular country.
Hopefully another country has been considered, otherwise Suella Braverman was quite correct in her scathing letter.

LauraNorderr Wed 15-Nov-23 12:36:11

Yes JenniferEccles desperate people.
They are predominantly young men mainly because their family at home in war torn and unsafe countries give up everything to pay for their eldest son to make a journey to a better life in the hope that they can then send for and share a better, safer, more prosperous life for the other family members.
Think how desperate you would have to be to give up everything you own and potentially put yourself in danger for your son or grandson.

Cold Wed 15-Nov-23 12:36:33

It seemed like the Government did no proper research - another "wishful thinking" policy. Rwanda should have raised serious red flags given its failure to deliver refugee housing agreements to other countries

Why didn't the fact that Rwanda had previously had a similar deal with Israel - that broke down in 2018 when Rwanda reneged upon its agreements with Israel and expelled some refugees that they were meant to be housing to other unsafe countries

MayBee70 Wed 15-Nov-23 12:42:48

My friend is helping someone who came here on a boat. A young man let down by this country when we pulled out of Afghanistan and effectively gave it back to the Taliban. Who tortured this young man because one of his relatives treated someone who had stood up to the Taliban. The Taliban had murdered some members of his family. Every person who arrives here on a boat has a story. It’s wrong that the government just brands them as nameless boat people.

Germanshepherdsmum Wed 15-Nov-23 12:47:44

I don’t agree that by the time these people reach France they are desperate. Desperate when they left their country of origin maybe, depending on their circumstances, but no longer desperate.

Whitewavemark2 Wed 15-Nov-23 12:54:37

It seems that they fully intend to pursue and upgrade the agreement with Rwanda.

It is just words - it simply won’t come about before the next election.

JenniferEccles Wed 15-Nov-23 13:04:46

Sorry but no they are not desperate, not in the way you mean LauraNorderr

Desperate to get here yes, as we are a soft touch, but as we all know, before they arrive here they have travelled through several perfectly safe European countries.