Net Migration Shocker

I’m another do-gooder I expect. I volunteered in setting up the first women’s refuge in our town in the early 1970’s, volunteered in supporting offenders being released from prison and with other groups. Then after qualification, 35 years working with children and families. Three years post retirement working part time in a family centre. So, I’m well aware of homelessness, it’s causes and devastating impact on people. Yes I know about a hard days work

The last 15 years, I’ve volunteered with a charity that rescues and rehabilitates dogs.

Allsorts, I am proud to be a do- goooder. I volunteer in a foodbank and in a school. I did do a days hard work every day until I was sixty one. I am saddened that people who try to make their corner of the world better are described so perjoratively.

I’m really confused as to why people are so shocked about immigration figures. When the UK voted to impose economic sanctions on itself and decimate much of its workforce, AKA Brexit, it was absolutely clear that those vacancies, many in social & health care, would have to be filled by foreign workers from other non-European countries. People who voted for Brexit based on ‘racism’ have got their comeuppance. You know the old saying ‘be careful what you wish for’! Actions have consequences.

this = these

It's curious that the number of study visas to students from India has increased so sharply since 2019. The government has total control over this numbers. They have nothing to do with the EU or "boat people".

Here's what it says:

...there were 138,532 sponsored study visa grants to Indian nationals in year ending March 2023, an increase of 53,429 (+63%) compared to year ending March 2022 and the largest number of study visas granted to any nationality. Grants to study for Indian nationals have risen markedly since year ending March 2019 and are now around 7 times higher.

Chinese nationals were the second most common nationality granted sponsored study visas in year ending March 2023, with 100,397 visas grants, 14% fewer than the 116,312 in year ending March 2022.

The 2023 figures put India at the top of the tables and China second:

www.gov.uk/government/statistics/immigration-system-statistics-year-ending-march-2023/why-do-people-come-to-the-uk-to-study

Suela only one brave enough to tell the truth. Others just duck the problem because of backlash. Look at crime and knife statistics, objectively. At Prison populations objectively. It's too late now, glad I'm the age I am. Our already established population cannot get homes, walk through any city or town. Work with the homeless, we're all only a few steps from homelessness any of us and bringing thousands of others into the country pushes all further back. People are already living in sub standards housing, good hardworking people who cannot save enough for a home if renting because how do you save with rent going out. Not everyone has had the support that I've been able to give mine, emotionally and financualky, it's those that don't get it we should be worrying about.
Do many of these to gooders know nothing of reality. Do they out in a days hard work.

Re the amount of Chinese students.

www.theguardian.com/education/2019/nov/05/alarming-chinese-meddling-at-uk-universities-exposed-in-report.

These reports are also in The Telegraph and The Times educational.
Are they all wrong?

This article confirms that Germany is recruiting from Brazil

en.mercopress.com/2023/06/08/germany-recruiting-skilled-labor-particularly-nurses-in-brazil

casdon your post 14.52 is absolutely correct. The recent net migration figures reflect this economic requirement. Austerity and other government policies have a direct influence on these figures.

The government is weaponising these figures just as they threatened to do before the election.

The boat people are the tiniest amount to be almost invisible. They are not part of this economic migration, but seeking asylum which is a different issue.

So you have exactly zilch personal experience of working with foreign students DAR.
I wonder why I’m not surprised that you know absolutely nothing!
The law has nothing to do with the it. All the pupils I was referring to came here perfectly legally, but they didn’t bring their families with them because they were at a boarding school. The parents remained at home earning the money to pay their school fees.

i have tried your link as well Freya without success.

There are always bound to be people that buck the system but do you have any quantifiable evidence on the numbers of people doing this.

The cost of a university degree for a foreign student is normally north of £40,000 a year, and I think students have to have paid their fees before they get their visa. How many people can make so much money in the black economy, which mainly houses people paid wages well below the minimum wage to make i worth paying £40,000 for the privilege. I doubt there are many doctors, IT specialist or specialist engineers in the black economy.

Freya Please can we have a link to the source of your statement that Germany will need 200-300,000 more nurses in the next ten years.

I dont think you can get away from the fact that some posts are based on pure prejudice. Sadly that makes a useful discussion impossible.

I shall try and work out how to put this thread on "ignore" if such a thing is possible.

MayBee70

Iam64

They are MaizieD
A friend who was a senior manager at three different universities said they depended on foreign students
My local university has a large number of students from China

Nottingham University is full of Chinese students: has been for as long as I can remember. There is even a copy of one of their main buildings somewhere in China. They have very close links.

Indeed it does:

www.nottingham.ac.uk/about/campuses/chinacampus.aspx

Nottingham University makes a profit from the outpost in China. I'm not sure what this has to do with immigration to the UK. It means that Chines students are staying in China rather than coming to the UK.

Your link doesn't appear to be working Freya.

DaisyAnneReturns

Unpleasant? Stifling debate? What do you call this, eazybee? If you (or the writer) want others to speak softly and with reasoned facts, you need to the same.

And many don’t! They disappear into the black economy and therefore pay no taxes or insurance, and others simply keep on getting work visas and stay on to work, and bring their families in to join them, if they’re not already here as ‘dependents’ although I’m unsure how anyone can be dependent on a student without a job.

I find this disgusting. Others will find it disgusting too. When trying to work out why someone would say that, without any proof or numbers to tell us who and why those described are doing what MO says they are, I have reached only one conclusion. If there is another one I am very happy to learn.

You are wrong, there has been several reports of students entering to study, one never even started their course in Wales then disappearing into the black economy, one started found it too hard, how on earth do Universities assess the suitability of overseas students, or are they just interested in the money Universities and the Home office are failing the people of this country, and those who come here to work legally. See inside news.sky/story. Easily searchable,if you want to of course.

Thanks.

fancythat

My attention span seems to have got shorter in proportion to my age.
I was fine at school.

Middle age - DH likes films. I used to struggle to watch one in a whole sitting when we first married. Now 20 mins is my maximum preferred watching time for them.

I rarely watch any 10 min videos. Whoever sends them and whatever they are about.
Bad isnt it.

Even on here, or whatever I am doing, I dont stay on one thing for long.

I think your first sentence in pretty common to all of us (smile)

Bad isn't it
Not at all. We are, thankfully, all individuals - and all the better for our differences. I put videos on for those who want them but they’re not mandatory- it's just nice to share.

Should say 200,000 to 300,000 nursesin next 10 years.

Grantanow

Immigration is here to stay and the Tories know it. Their failure is to fail to build more houses, schools and health facilities. Post-Brexit immigration (approved by visa) from non-EU countries has risen to fill NHS and care sector vacancies and student places at universities (generating much needed fee income). Many of these return home when their course ends. We simply don't have enough younger people to skills train (too few births). If we had not Brexited most of the immigrant intake would have been replaced by free movement. Labour know it too.

You always quote Brexit as a problem re essential workers, see Germany, expected to have shortage of 200 to 300, Nurses, and guess what, they are still in the EU, free movement and all that,yet they're recruiting Nurses from Brazil. !!!

My attention span seems to have got shorter in proportion to my age.
I was fine at school.

Middle age - DH likes films. I used to struggle to watch one in a whole sitting when we first married. Now 20 mins is my maximum preferred watching time for them.

I rarely watch any 10 min videos. Whoever sends them and whatever they are about.
Bad isnt it.

Even on here, or whatever I am doing, I dont stay on one thing for long.

fancythat

DaisyAnneReturns

You dont need to read fancythat. Just watch, listen and, hopefully (as in that's what I always hope for), learn.

He's paid the subscriptions, followed those in the know and done the analysis for you.

Out of interest, do you watch the news or read a newspaper? It's just another way of getting information. I do "get" that some people don't want to engage with technology but it doesn't seem unreasonable to assume that of of this on GN a reasonable number might like getting information that way.

Not in 10 minute bites, no.
My DH says I have the concentration span of a gnat.
Makes watching films, um, interesting!

We mustn't be unkind to gnats This is now becoming fascinating. People learn/absorb information in so nany different ways.

Don’t answer if you don't want you, but what have you done in the past when you have had to learn?

maddyone

Do you have any experience of independent boarding schools and foreign students DAR?
I would be very interested to hear of your personal experiences re independent boarding schools and foreign students.

But that would be suggesting I set my "experience" above knowledge of the law MO. Personally, I don't.