Net Migration Shocker

I’m surprised that students are include in the net migration figures most of them will go home. Legal migrants I don’t have a problem with, at present we are in Norway a Shengen country and every where you go Norwegians are notable by their abscence, shops , restaurants, tours, you name it.

I confess that i am ignorant on this subject, but why do we not give legal immigrants time limited visas after which they are expected to return home.

Say 5 years extendable to 10, which could be made permanent in some circumstances. It seems to me that especially for medical stff, to come over here, work and link that with study to improve their qualification would benefit both this country and their country of origin when they return.

Grantanow

And now we have Jenrick and Badenoch proposing to cut visas for workers in the care sector which has great difficulty attracting staff for old people's homes. Clearly they don't care about the impact on those needing care.

(Yes, I know the homes could pay more to attract UK workers but given the overall shortage of workers that simply means denuding other sectors of staff).

Perhaps we really have to accept the far-right intend to kill off the elderly.

DAR carers could be an exempted profession in any new legislation? Bit dramatic to suggest that Jenrick and Badenoch know what they are talking about.

ronib

DAR carers could be an exempted profession in any new legislation? Bit dramatic to suggest that Jenrick and Badenoch know what they are talking about.

[Smile]

Just wondering who are these ‘far-right’ people? I find labelling people or groups of people dangerous and judgemental.

nanna8

Just wondering who are these ‘far-right’ people? I find labelling people or groups of people dangerous and judgemental.

Really, on what basis? Far right and far left are both commonly used expressions and just describe a position on a political spectrum. It is of course, culturally referenced and I believe you live in Australia?

I think both terms are tossed about far too much. Very often an insult to those whom we disagree with. Similar to the way people who are patently not racists are accused of same.

I agree with you nanna8 and it is usually used as an insult to ‘other’ people and make them ‘less’. I’m not talking about Tommy Robinson here, just Gransnetters calling or hinting that others are far right usually, or occasionally far left.
Unpleasant behaviour from people who wouldn’t dare make such comments in real life!

Katie59

I’m surprised that students are include in the net migration figures most of them will go home. Legal migrants I don’t have a problem with, at present we are in Norway a Shengen country and every where you go Norwegians are notable by their abscence, shops , restaurants, tours, you name it.

That must have been because all the Norwegians were with us. I spent a few days in Norway last month with my partner and met loads of Norwegians.

According to The Guardian the Home Office doesn’t know what happened to 17000 asylum seekers whose asylum claims have been withdrawn.

They are people on the far-right of politics nana. Are we to stop quantifying everything? What tosh. If you support something you have already identified yourself by the politics you find not only acceptable but preferable, no one else is doing that. Most people know the predilictions of the various political groups.

As for judgemental, what is wrong about making a judgement on extremes that hurt others?

I promise you I would and do use those words in normal conversation maddyone, if that's the conversation is about. If someone identified with fascistic or communistic policies I would be happy to use those words too.

Extremes, by there very nature set one group above another. If you think that's okay it tells me a great deal about your view of life. As a self-confessed democrat and centrist, I heartily hope that tells you a great deal about me.

that's the that's what the

DaisyAnneReturns

Grantanow

And now we have Jenrick and Badenoch proposing to cut visas for workers in the care sector which has great difficulty attracting staff for old people's homes. Clearly they don't care about the impact on those needing care.

(Yes, I know the homes could pay more to attract UK workers but given the overall shortage of workers that simply means denuding other sectors of staff).

Perhaps we really have to accept the far-right intend to kill off the elderly.

That is the most ridiculous outburst yet , for goodness sakes. Unless of course you mean the poor elderly folk left behind, whilst their countrymen/women, rove over here, because their own countries pay even crapper wages than we do.

Haven't you followed the coronavirus enquiry and the government's view of economy before the frail and ill?

What has this far-right government done to the NHS? The waiting list for hospital treatment rose to a record of nearly 7.8 million in September 2023. The 18-week treatment target has not been met since 2016.

What about care? With consistent underfunding, access to publicly funded care for older adults is now limited to those with the lowest means and highest needs. Provision across the country has become fragile and fragmented, and workforce shortages limit the supply of care. With 165,000 vacancies in 2021/22, the vacancy rate in the sector has reached a new high, and the workforce has shrunk for the first time since records began. Navigating the social care system is highly complex and confusing. Nuffield Trust

Who is this intended to hurt if not the elderly and, if not intended, what on earth does it say about this government's competence, Freya?

If you can only answer with a personal attack you have no answer.

M0nica

I confess that i am ignorant on this subject, but why do we not give legal immigrants time limited visas after which they are expected to return home.

Say 5 years extendable to 10, which could be made permanent in some circumstances. It seems to me that especially for medical stff, to come over here, work and link that with study to improve their qualification would benefit both this country and their country of origin when they return.

Immigrants are often given time-limited visas.

growstuffWhy do we never hear of this or see it discussed. Most foreign medical staff seem to come over and settle permanently with no plans to return..

Can you put any figures to your assertion?

DaisyAnneReturns

Haven't you followed the coronavirus enquiry and the government's view of economy before the frail and ill?

What has this far-right government done to the NHS? The waiting list for hospital treatment rose to a record of nearly 7.8 million in September 2023. The 18-week treatment target has not been met since 2016.

What about care? With consistent underfunding, access to publicly funded care for older adults is now limited to those with the lowest means and highest needs. Provision across the country has become fragile and fragmented, and workforce shortages limit the supply of care. With 165,000 vacancies in 2021/22, the vacancy rate in the sector has reached a new high, and the workforce has shrunk for the first time since records began. Navigating the social care system is highly complex and confusing. Nuffield Trust

Who is this intended to hurt if not the elderly and, if not intended, what on earth does it say about this government's competence, Freya?

If you can only answer with a personal attack you have no answer.

This is about immigration. NOT the covid inquiry, why have you even mentioned it in this context.

M0nica

*growstuff*Why do we never hear of this or see it discussed. Most foreign medical staff seem to come over and settle permanently with no plans to return..

Can you put any figures to your assertion?

Medical staff in training grades have always had to have fixed term visas to work in the NHS Monica, they run for the length of the training contract. Years ago when I worked in acute hospitals it used to cause endless headaches for hospital medical teams because the process was very slow, and left gaps in teams while visas were awaited. There’s a new visa system for needed health professionals including doctors now, introduced this year.
iasservices.org.uk/health-and-care-worker-visa/

M0nica

*growstuff*Why do we never hear of this or see it discussed. Most foreign medical staff seem to come over and settle permanently with no plans to return..

Can you put any figures to your assertion?

Do you have the figures about foreign medical staff coming over and settling permanently, as you claim?

No, sorry, I don't have the figures on five year visas to hand, but I do know that's the normal process. My partner regularly recruits researchers from abroad on temporary visas and, as Casdon has explained, it's a headache waiting for them and also ensuring they're renewed once they run out. It used to happen in schools too.

DaisyAnnReturns
There you go again with the ‘far right’ government stuff, do you really know what far right even means?
As to your assertion that ‘we have to accept the far right intend to kill off the elderly’ don’t think I’ve ever read such a ridiculous comment on a forum before.

growstuff

M0nica

growstuffWhy do we never hear of this or see it discussed. Most foreign medical staff seem to come over and settle permanently with no plans to return..

Can you put any figures to your assertion?

Do you have the figures about foreign medical staff coming over and settling permanently, as you claim?

No, sorry, I don't have the figures on five year visas to hand, but I do know that's the normal process. My partner regularly recruits researchers from abroad on temporary visas and, as Casdon has explained, it's a headache waiting for them and also ensuring they're renewed once they run out. It used to happen in schools too.

I know the same visa process is also used in industry, my daughter is in HR and she deals with visas for foreign engineers coming to work in the UK.

nanna8

Just wondering who are these ‘far-right’ people? I find labelling people or groups of people dangerous and judgemental.

Quite. They do it to try and shut down discussion.😉