Trump crushes his Republican rivals in the Iowa caucus!

Trump is an astute manipulator of public opinion and in my opinion he is dangerous to the future of the world, let alone the US. What I can't understand is why the Democrats and Republicans have no middle aged candidates worth selecting instead of these two candidates for an expensive care home.

Thank you Galaxy. That seems movement from my speaking truths frightening you.

What a joy you are DA.

Don't credit Trump with an iota of intelligence MayBee70

His pronouncements are random, and make no sense, except to his fanatical followers who will lap up any Trump nonsense as if it was sense.

So Trump, who wants to leave NATO and withdraw funding for Ukraine is now saying that Biden should come down heavy with Iran

Galaxy

As I say Daisy the words hard right etc have been rendered utterly meaningless to me in recent years.
Your definition of extremists is probably different to mine. Its again a word that is used with complete abandon these days.
I am a feminist so am unlikely to be in anyway in favour of trump, but I can also see that ignoring vast swathes of the electorate might be problematic. But people will continue with it I am sure.

I do think storming the Capitol is extreme Galaxy don't you?

I won't add a long list but I do think you are right about the degree of your knowledge about the US and its politics.

Perhaps you could let us know where we can read the document by the young Labour candidates?

Your thinking seems to be unstructured and unevidenced and yet you say you are frightened of mine. Is it that you think the tellers of factual truths should not be believed? Perhaps I should change my name to Cassandra.

That they had concerns that were minimised. That certainly in recent years (I am probably talking about Brexit voters more than trump here as I know more of this country than the US) there has been an shift by the left away from issues such as class, deprivation etc in favour of identity politics. Not all of the left but some of it. I read a five page document recently from some young labour candidates recently they didnt mention poverty once.

Ignoring vast swathes of the electorate in what way, Galaxy?

As I say Daisy the words hard right etc have been rendered utterly meaningless to me in recent years.
Your definition of extremists is probably different to mine. Its again a word that is used with complete abandon these days.
I am a feminist so am unlikely to be in anyway in favour of trump, but I can also see that ignoring vast swathes of the electorate might be problematic. But people will continue with it I am sure.

Why do you think that people who can see how extremists behave and don't like what they see frighten you, while the extremists themselves don't Galaxy? It seems a bizarre reaction. You appear to say you would rather we all had a blinkered view of those on the far right. Mind you, it does explain why do many who stood against Hitler died for their view.

Do you feel you would also like us "not to see" what Russia is doing, what China may do, or how the increase in North Korea's weapons tests is worsening tensions with the United States, South Korea and Japan, or is it just the hard right we must turn a blind eye to?

MaizieD

GrannyGravy13

Callistemon21

GrannyGravy13

too dumb, too stupid

lost their moral compass

they survive on cruelty, callousness and revenge

Just three of many exerts pertaining to Trump voters, oops I forgot ^racists & facists^

oops I forgot
And - I expect they voted for Brexit too!
😯

My post was to DaisyAnneReturns as she requested some examples of derogatory remarks towards Trump supporters on this thread.

I wouldn’t call anyone names because they put their cross in a box I do not agree with.

Nope, GG13, you said 'IQ'. I have been right through the thread and no-one has used the term 'IQ'. I would have thought that you would know very well by now that DaisyAnnReturns tends to focus on very literal points and not bothered to argue with her.

OTOH, having just trawled through 10 pages of posts I found very few direct attributions of 'stupidity' to Trump supporters and you've picked out the only 'lost moral compass' in the whole thread (moral compass has nothing to do with IQ).

I did find lots of expressions of surprise that anyone should support Trump, without any accompanying opinion of the intelligence of those supporters, and lots of very derogatory descriptions of Trump himself, with which I'd be surprised if you disagree.

There were a few references to research evidence that Trump voters are mostly less well educated, but I don't see why anyone should feel uncomfortable with the empirically evidenced facts.

FWIW I'm of the opinion that even very intelligent people can be 'stupid' in some ways.

There are other threads too .....

Those who claim to see that tend to be very reluctant to turn their scrutiny on themselves. I have come to the conclusion I am afraid that those I am most frightened of are those who think they are on the right side.

I would suggest you make sure you quote accurately. Otherwise, we are still trying to discuss a myth GrannyGravy

You have chosen not to accept that there are generally good people, who can behave in ways that horrify us and later horrify themselves.

You have also chosen not to accept that there are people whose views are far outside any form of democracy most of us would recognise, who are skilled at the manipulation of voters.

You are entitled to take that point of view. However, you seem to feel that others may not describe what they see and accept as truth.

I do see people who thrive on cruelty, callousness and revenge. I see them on GN as well as in the political arena. I also see people in positions that affect us all who believe in their personally deserved dominance, both in wealth and power.

I also see those prepared to justify turning a blind eye.

I also see people whose political leanings can be characterised as fascist and/or racist.

You don't have to agree - we still live in a democracy. But your argument against this view doesn't seem to exist only your opinion.

Re the allegation if racism,take a look at The Central Park Five.

One may make the leap that this is racist behaviour,Trump is a racist. Its not unreasonable to make another leap that those drawn towards him,share his views.

GrannyGravy13

Callistemon21

GrannyGravy13

too dumb, too stupid

lost their moral compass

they survive on cruelty, callousness and revenge

Just three of many exerts pertaining to Trump voters, oops I forgot ^racists & facists^

oops I forgot
And - I expect they voted for Brexit too!
😯

My post was to DaisyAnneReturns as she requested some examples of derogatory remarks towards Trump supporters on this thread.

I wouldn’t call anyone names because they put their cross in a box I do not agree with.

Nope, GG13, you said 'IQ'. I have been right through the thread and no-one has used the term 'IQ'. I would have thought that you would know very well by now that DaisyAnnReturns tends to focus on very literal points and not bothered to argue with her.

OTOH, having just trawled through 10 pages of posts I found very few direct attributions of 'stupidity' to Trump supporters and you've picked out the only 'lost moral compass' in the whole thread (moral compass has nothing to do with IQ).

I did find lots of expressions of surprise that anyone should support Trump, without any accompanying opinion of the intelligence of those supporters, and lots of very derogatory descriptions of Trump himself, with which I'd be surprised if you disagree.

There were a few references to research evidence that Trump voters are mostly less well educated, but I don't see why anyone should feel uncomfortable with the empirically evidenced facts.

FWIW I'm of the opinion that even very intelligent people can be 'stupid' in some ways.

Sorry, posted before checking FT rules

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www.ft.com/content/4c5daf6e-f642-4abe-9e0e-8d4ef3121706

Donald Trump has warned donors that they will be “barred” from his “MAGA camp” if they make further contributions to Nikki Haley’s campaign, raising the stakes for her billionaire backers a day after she was defeated in the New Hampshire primary.

After dominating the first two contests in the Republican race, Trump has tried to snuff out his rival’s campaign, labelling her an “imposter” who lacks a real base of support among the party.

But Trump went further on Wednesday night, moving to choke off the funding that Haley hopes will propel her campaign to the next primary contest, in her home state of South Carolina, in late February.

“Anybody that makes a ‘Contribution’ to Birdbrain, from this moment forth, will be permanently barred from the MAGA camp,” Trump wrote in a post on his social media site Truth Social, using a nickname for Haley. “We don’t want them, and will not accept them, because we Put America First, and ALWAYS WILL!”

Haley responded to Trump’s threat by posting on X, “Well in that case . . . donate here. Let’s Go!”, along with a link to her donation page. She added that her campaign had raised $1mn in the 24 hours since the New Hampshire primary.

www.ft.com/content/4c5daf6e-f642-4abe-9e0e-8d4ef3121706

Callistemon21

GrannyGravy13

too dumb, too stupid

lost their moral compass

they survive on cruelty, callousness and revenge

Just three of many exerts pertaining to Trump voters, oops I forgot ^racists & facists^

oops I forgot
And - I expect they voted for Brexit too!
😯

My post was to DaisyAnneReturns as she requested some examples of derogatory remarks towards Trump supporters on this thread.

I wouldn’t call anyone names because they put their cross in a box I do not agree with.

GrannyGravy13

^too dumb, too stupid^

lost their moral compass

they survive on cruelty, callousness and revenge

Just three of many exerts pertaining to Trump voters, oops I forgot ^racists & facists^

oops I forgot
And - I expect they voted for Brexit too!
😯

too dumb, too stupid

lost their moral compass

they survive on cruelty, callousness and revenge

Just three of many exerts pertaining to Trump voters, oops I forgot racists & facists

GrannyGravy13

As is often posted on MN DaisyAnneReturns ^read the thread^

That's not my job GrannyGravy, it's yours if you want to make a relevant point - wherever they say on mumsnet.

Thank you Maizie. Sadly, Germany was humiliated after WW1. We learned lessons from it after the WW2 surrender.

This country, in parts, was, and still is being falsely persuaded that we have been humiliated. I guess the same could be said of what Trump is doing.

Callistemon21

ronib

Does anyone else remember total shock when studying History o level to learn that Adolf Hitler came to power through legitimate means?

We didn't get that far in History 'O' level but somehow I seem to have been aware of it ronib

And of Oswald Mosley and his Blackshirts in this country.

Hitler came to power through legitimate means because he offered hope and rebuilding of humiliated nation.

He retained his power through the use of force. That is how dictatorships generally work. That is the ultimate control mechanism for any form of government if they can't manage to govern by the consent of most of the citizens.

Of course, as under any regime, there were a significant number of people in Germany who shared his views. By the time even some of them realised how abhorrent they were it was too late, the enforcement by the use of force mechanism was in place and unstoppable.

That is why many people in more 'liberal' regimes are deeply suspicious of government attempts to use what they consider to be excessive state force to curtail individual rights.

I think it was A level…. But pretty unsettling at the time…

ronib

Does anyone else remember total shock when studying History o level to learn that Adolf Hitler came to power through legitimate means?

We didn't get that far in History 'O' level but somehow I seem to have been aware of it ronib

And of Oswald Mosley and his Blackshirts in this country.