Police forced to intervene and send people home as hundreds queue for appointments at new practice in St Pauls, Bristol

I was at the dentists yesterday (still NHS thank goodness). While waiting, I heard the receptionist tell someone on the phone that no, she couldn't make an appointment as she hadn't seen the dentist in over 2 years so she was no longer an NHS patient. A bit abrupt - I think she got an abrupt reply back!

That's my husband also off the NHS patient list, then - someone who only went when he needed to. It's all so wrong.

Sarnia you are absolutely right. The government won't care as they can all afford private treatment anyway.

Grantanow

Whether the NHS dentist shortage is due to Brexit or not the responsibility to provide an adequate service throughout the UK rests with the Tory government (the SNP in Scotland) and they have failed miserably.

So did Labour, too, sadly.

It's been going on for over 30 years.
We have a Labour government in Wales and health is devolved.

In the 1990s, the government reduced the payments to dentists for treatments so many left and went private.

I think Labour made an attempt to set up NHS practices where there were none but not enough was done.

No government seems to be interested now in providing NHS dental services even for children.

Join the world club! We have to pay hundreds every time we go to a dentist. Just a check up is $135. Private health covers a bit but that in itself costs a fortune.

Sarnia and everyone, don't worry, Rishi feels your pain

dentistry.co.uk/2022/08/05/i-feel-your-pain-rishi-sunak-on-his-seven-fillings-and-plans-to-reform-dentistry/

someone who only went when he needed to

But if he had gone for regular 6 monthly check ups, chances are he would have avoided needing any ‘emergency’ treatment.

Plus would have remained on ‘the list’.

Well grantanowI live north of Glasgow there are around 5 or 6 dental practices here in a small town all do NHS work and one is currently advertising for nhs patients .The next nearest towns on both directions are also well provided with dental practices.Perhaps you dont know that NHS Scotland has more staff per capita ,nurses ,doctors and dentists than the rest of the UK ?

There are three dental practices in our High Road, all have NHS patients and all have currently got their books open.
(S E England)

The NHS issue annual contracts to perform a fixed number of units of work known as UDAs, no more and no less or you get fined. The contract value doesn't go up annually, while overheads do, plus you get endless oversight (read harassment) from busy body NHS managers with their box ticking clipboards.

Unsurprisingly a lot of dentist give up on working for the NHS and go private, at which point, you would assume that the NHS would reissue their annual UDAs to another dentist. But nope, they simply let them vanish into the ether. So there's less NHS dentistry all the time!

One of our Dental Practices (two sites) now does Botox, Fillers and various other cosmetic procedures which apparently subsidises the NHS dental side.

Urmstongran

The NHS issue annual contracts to perform a fixed number of units of work known as UDAs, no more and no less or you get fined. The contract value doesn't go up annually, while overheads do, plus you get endless oversight (read harassment) from busy body NHS managers with their box ticking clipboards.

Unsurprisingly a lot of dentist give up on working for the NHS and go private, at which point, you would assume that the NHS would reissue their annual UDAs to another dentist. But nope, they simply let them vanish into the ether. So there's less NHS dentistry all the time!

All introduced in 2015/16

Indeed WhiteWave.

And as for the children - no free check-ups - how short-sighted is that?

It's a disgrace, particularly for children who need the regular dental check ups in order to keep their teeth healthy. My 15 year old grandson was told by his NHS dentist that they could no longer carry on unless he was a private patient. His mother and I rang everywhere we could think of and every single practice in North Norfolk and beyond sympathised but could not help. In the end I was lucky and found a practice in Kings Lynn who would remove his teeth (for orthodontic reasons) privately for £300 so I paid and he received excellent care. This country really is in a mess!

paddyann54

Well grantanowI live north of Glasgow there are around 5 or 6 dental practices here in a small town all do NHS work and one is currently advertising for nhs patients .The next nearest towns on both directions are also well provided with dental practices.Perhaps you dont know that NHS Scotland has more staff per capita ,nurses ,doctors and dentists than the rest of the UK ?

I also live in Scotland. Locally one dentist closed, one no longer doing NHS, l closed list for new NHS.
Healthcare is very much a postcode lottery.

Callistemon21

The same NHS dentists are using the same facilities here to carry out private treatment. I'm not sure how it works.

Calli most dentists are self employed or work for Dental Companies. Therefore the equipment belongs to them. The equipment costs a fortune to buy, there is loads and loads of paperwork to compliant with and the pay structure on the NHS is not fit for purpose.

Thanks, kittylester, why did I think the government would be paying for the equipment!

Apparently the NHS dentist can offer DGD an urgent appointment in May for an extraction but can fit her in next week privately.

I’ve not been able to comprehend for a long time where so little publicity has been given to the lack of NHS dentistry. I’m sure I read the other day that it’s easier to get affordable dental treatment in Ukraine and Rwanda than it is here. As a child of the drill and fill policy when I was a child I was so pleased that my kids and grandchildren would have a full set of filling free teeth but we’re now going to have a generation of people with dental problems. The first thing my NHS dentist does is check my lymph glands etc so how many illnesses aren’t being picked up because people can’t see a dentist? We’ve just sleep walked into this situation.

Apparently the NHS dentist can offer DGD an urgent appointment in May for an extraction but can fit her in next week privately

As far as I am aware, dentists can't do more NHS treatment than their allocation. Maybe his is used up till then.

Dentistry has been being privatised by the back door, by successive governments, since at least the 70s.

Private dentists will also check lymph glands not just the NHS ones Maybee.

I think a lot of dental practices are now owned by larger places in much the same way that vets are. I do know of a dentist whose practice is being taken over by a concern and he’s leaving because he doesn’t feel he’ll be able to work to his current standard.

kitty isn’t it unconscionable to ‘use up NHS allocation’ when folk are queuing up for appointments the length and breadth of Britain. I’m not disagreeing with you btw. I’m just pointing out the farcical caps imposed (by who? The government? Or the NHS Boards?).

Whatever and whoever sets the rules it’s not working.
Literally.

These new dental practices are given zingy names like ‘Kiss’ or ‘Smile’. And promote ‘teeth whitening’ or ‘same day corrections’ for wonky teeth. Costing a fortune. All good for folk interested in their selfies I’m sure.

But what about the basics? You know. Good old dentistry to keep us healthy (if not exactly photogenic).

kittylester

^Apparently the NHS dentist can offer DGD an urgent appointment in May for an extraction but can fit her in next week privately^

As far as I am aware, dentists can't do more NHS treatment than their allocation. Maybe his is used up till then.

Dentistry has been being privatised by the back door, by successive governments, since at least the 70s.

That's why, then.

Yes, it has been happening for years.

This is from the BBC website, looks like the Government is doing something regarding English dentistry.