Aid for Gaza

GrannyGravy13

The Israeli war cabinet have given Hamas an ultimatum release the hostages immediately or we will continue to attack

Makes sense to me, Hamas have to release all remaining hostages, to do so condemns more citizens of Gaza to injury, homelessness and possibly an untimely death.

(Source BBC and ITV morning news reports)

How does anyone know where the hostages are or even if they are alive? Nearly 30,000 dead. Over 7000 missing. Over 68000 injured.
This statement proves one thing though. Israel is directly targeting civilians and so is guilty of war crimes
The rules of war

5. Everyone shall be entitled to benefit from fundamental judicial guarantees. No one shall be held responsible for an act he or she has not committed. No one shall be subjected to physical or mental torture, corporal punishment or cruel or degrading treatment.

6. Parties to a conflict and members of their armed forces do not have an unlimited choice of methods and means of warfare. It is prohibited to employ weapons or methods of warfare of a nature to cause unnecessary losses or excessive suffering.

7. Parties to a conflict shall at all times distinguish between the civilian population and combatants in order to spare civilian population and property. Neither the civilian population as such nor civilian persons shall be the object of attack. Attacks shall be directed solely against military objectives.

That’s why I used the word ‘most’ about the marchers.

Hamas won’t release all the hostages as it fears what comes after and will already have murdered some of them.It will say of course that they were all killed by missiles.

The Israeli war cabinet have given Hamas an ultimatum release the hostages immediately or we will continue to attack

Makes sense to me, Hamas have to release all remaining hostages, to do so condemns more citizens of Gaza to injury, homelessness and possibly an untimely death.

(Source BBC and ITV morning news reports)

No one has suggested anti-semitism should be tolerated. But no form of racist or religious discrimination should be tolerated. However there are a number of posts appearing on GN which show that discrimination against Muslims is very active and that labelling and blaming them is not only casually accepted but is widespread.
As for
and have a go at Israel are either Palestinians, Muslims, the rabid left or well meaning naive liberals
All I can think is thank goodness for those people willing to go out and stand up for the ordinary people of Gaza driven from their homes and being slaughtered. If no one does this, if no one marches, then the message being sent is that no one cares. And if it can be done to the people of Gaza without protests, without the marchers, then it can be done to other groups. The prospect for humanity is grim.

I still believe that anti-Semitism has been rife for centuries, and is still rife in the UK

And there should not be any level of tolerance for it just because it’s gone on for centuries.

The anti Semitism is becoming very frightening now. These Jewish people living here have nothing whatsoever to do with Netanyahu but they are having their workplaces defaced and suffering abuse. Just as in the 1930s. Somehow the police are turning a blind eye and letting those marches by aggressive pro Palestinians continue. I am not Jewish myself but I know of a few, including a family member and they are afraid now to go into some areas. Disgusting and totally unacceptable.

growstuff

Oreo

Grany you say ‘what happened on October 7th was very wrong by hamas’ clearly you’re a master of understatement.
Teenagers vandalising a church hall was ‘very wrong’ but what hamas did was beyond words, they brought nightmares and a vision of Hell.
In the news today a friend of the hamas leader says that he had no idea what it would lead to in terms of retribution! Too late for selfish regret now tho.
I find most people keen to play things down and have a go at Israel are either Palestinians, Muslims, the rabid left or well meaning naive liberals.Plenty of all of those on the marches in London.

I'm critical of the actions by the Israeli state, but I'm none of the things you describe Oreo.

Nor me, growstuff.

There's a distinction, surely, between "having a go" at the incumbent apparently ultra-nationalist Israeli government under Netanyahu, and the Israeli people

My feeling, for what it's worth, is this: The Hamas attack on 7th October was so unspeakably, almost unimaginably, barbaric - it's so hard to comprehend human beings are capable of such atrocities - and now the Israeli State feels it has carte-blanche to do whatever it wants to do.

But even a legitimate war has rules, otherwise it becomes just a brutish, ruthless slaying of anyone and everyone.

Or, are we to believe that all Palestinians are savages who rejoice in Hamas and therefore deserve everything they get?

People point to the fact that Hamas secured a majority of seats in the legislature and formed a government. Perhaps this might have had something to do with the fact that they promised and delivered the provision of social services in healthcare and welfare?

But they (Hamas) also, reportedly, ruled with an iron fist.

Hamas has used strict and authoritarian methods of control, applying its own interpretations of strict sharia law, enforcing gender segregation in public, controlling the media, repressing any political opposition and eliminating all mechanisms of transparency and accountability. ("The Conversation") **

**
theconversation.com/uk/who-we-are

This is food for thought.

However, I still believe that anti-Semitism has been rife for centuries, is still rife in the UK... Jewish people have been abused and attacked (particularly in certain parts of London) long before Israel declared war on Gaza.

Oreo

Grany you say ‘what happened on October 7th was very wrong by hamas’ clearly you’re a master of understatement.
Teenagers vandalising a church hall was ‘very wrong’ but what hamas did was beyond words, they brought nightmares and a vision of Hell.
In the news today a friend of the hamas leader says that he had no idea what it would lead to in terms of retribution! Too late for selfish regret now tho.
I find most people keen to play things down and have a go at Israel are either Palestinians, Muslims, the rabid left or well meaning naive liberals.Plenty of all of those on the marches in London.

I'm critical of the actions by the Israeli state, but I'm none of the things you describe Oreo.

I’m another in agreement with Dickens

Dickens a good post that I totally agree with 👍

This is now- to me - beginning to feel like it's more about Netanyahu and his Nationalist right-wing hawks.

You don't judge a nation by its leaders - even though the saying is that "we get the government(s) we deserve" which is clearly not the case if you look at past and recent history.

But it is also, most definitely, about anti-Semiticism - because all anti-(whatever-religion-race-etc) built on sheer prejudice and ignorance, is always on the look-out for something, big or small, to justify its xenophobia. It's there permanently, simmering away until it can find an excuse to explode.

And let's not pretend that up until now Jewish people were happily going about their lives here in the UK until 7th October. I have an acquaintance who is a news reporter who is a friend of my Jewish step-brother, and she has told me about numerous incidents of verbal abuse that she and others in general have suffered over the years.

I am critical of Netanyahu - but I think it's naive to believe that if he were to agree a ceasefire (highly unlikely now), and the Jewish hostages were released... that the anti-Semiticism would end.

maddyone 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

This is what I wish for:

The release of the hostages
The end of hostilities
The end of missiles being fired into Israel
Aid being delivered quickly into Gaza
Hamas defeated (but I know that won’t happen) so therefore Hamas being so depleted that they are unable to mount such a sadistic and depraved attack in the foreseeable future

We have a lot of white British non-Christians in our country

Yes we let a lot of non Christians into our country so no surprises where their loyalties lie unfortunately.

Grany you say ‘what happened on October 7th was very wrong by hamas’ clearly you’re a master of understatement.
Teenagers vandalising a church hall was ‘very wrong’ but what hamas did was beyond words, they brought nightmares and a vision of Hell.
In the news today a friend of the hamas leader says that he had no idea what it would lead to in terms of retribution! Too late for selfish regret now tho.
I find most people keen to play things down and have a go at Israel are either Palestinians, Muslims, the rabid left or well meaning naive liberals.Plenty of all of those on the marches in London.

There nearly was a two state solution, in 1993/4.

Peace to Israelis and Palestinians
Two state solution

No-one can argue with that.

Israel wants all of Gaza and are pushing people to Rafa where there is nowhere for the people of Palestine to go for safety.
The IDF are putting on Tik Tok evidence of their war crimes against Palestinians, including children, laughing about what they are doing, because they know that UK USA western governments are on their side.
There are some IDF who feel guilty for terrorising Palestinian families and talk of their shame and have changed now to talk and highlight what is happening. There are some youngsters who refuse to serve in Israeli military as IDF soldiers, instead serving a term in prison, to keep up the apartheid

UK and US are complicit in Israel war crimes and the on going genocide even after the ICJ ruling say Isreal must abide by humanitarian laws we are still sending arms to Isreal which are used to kill and mame innocent Palestinian citizens. What is happening the atrocities daily if you can bear to watch you can see live on SMedia, over 100 journalists have been killed, but you can still see what's happening.

What happened on October 7th was very wrong by Hamas. They tried several times to reach compromise talks with Israel but Isreal said no. These Palestinians are held captive with no way out by Israel, ilegal occupation, and apartheid. IDF fired on and killed several of their own on the day.
The story about beheaded babies was untrue has never been proven. The media here ran with the story without any verification, very poor journalism.

Lots of Jewish people are on the demonstrations that are happening around the world to call for a desperately needed cease fire. We must not forget Palestine.

Peace to Israelis and Palestinians
Two state solution.

I won't be posting on here anymore.

Whitewavemark2

Labours position

I think most of us would agree with that.

Glorianny

Even if you regard them as hostages Hamas probably consider the soldiers POWs.
I'm interested in those who think women soldiers should get special treatment.
If you were the mother of a captured 18 year old boy just doing national service, and an officer several years his senior and an officer in the regular army was released before him, simply because she was a woman would you agree with that?

Personally I do not think women should be on the front line of any war situation.

Hamas have used rape in this war, the Russias in Ukraine have used rape.

Women should never be left in a situation were they can be raped and abused.

Even if you regard them as hostages Hamas probably consider the soldiers POWs.
I'm interested in those who think women soldiers should get special treatment.
If you were the mother of a captured 18 year old boy just doing national service, and an officer several years his senior and an officer in the regular army was released before him, simply because she was a woman would you agree with that?

Labours position

POWs can be held until conflict ends

But the hostages are not POWs!
They are hostages.
Don’t you understand the difference?

Glorriany I see the Hamas PR has sucked you in…