Azar Ali

Does anyone realise how many warnings Israel gets from intel sources about hamas attacks? Lots, is the answer.
Sure, they will need to make their borders even more secure than normal from now on and an investigation held into security failings.
What this Labour candidate said was a disgrace and better late than never that Starmer has removed him from standing as a Labour MP.Never a good look to waver tho.
The worry is that huge numbers of Muslims think this way simply because of their religion.
I see a number of posters on this forum also think that way, and that’s worrying too, possibly not Muslim but left wing.

The lack of action spoken of here is the government of Israel
allowing the massacre of Israeli citizens

I agree with you 100% Dickens. Ali was a fool to say what he did because there is no proof as far as I know. Nevertheless, I don't agree that criticising any action (or lack of action) by the Israeli government is anti-semitic.

Black September Munich Massacre.

Surely, when we are critical of a nation's government, we are not condemning all the people governed by it?

The West is at loggerheads with Iran (for example) - are we reviling its people, many of whom appear also to be opposed to its own government? Are we censuring Islam because we denounce an administration that has appropriated the religion for its own ends?

Even within governments, there are factions that disagree, we've seen it with our own government.

Are we then to keep quiet, not question, not hold governments accountable?

Azhar Ali was wrong to say that Israel planned to "get rid of [Palestinians] from Gaza" and "grab" some of the land - because he is presenting it as a fact, and as far as I know has offered no evidence to support it. If you are in the 'public eye' you cannot make inflammatory statements like that and not be held accountable, and the Labour Party should have withdrawn its support for him as a candidate immediately.

In the interests of free-speech and Democracy, one can still ask the question though of why - if the Israeli government was made aware of the intelligence that indicated Hamas might be planning an attack (and such intelligence allegedly came from more than one source) - they appeared to ignore it. Surely those whose family members were slaughtered so barbarically in the attack have a right to know and will want to know if it could have been prevented? Governments have a duty to protect their citizens - as far as is possible anyway.

Urmstongran

Surely though Israel represents the ‘safe space’ in the world for the Jewish people who need a place where they can’t be hounded out from. Imagine how they must feel trying to live in places when anti-Semitic demonstrations run riot. Why are we so mean to the Jews?

Where is the "safe space" for the Palestinians? Where was the safe place for Hind Rajab and all the other Palestinian children who have been killed in this "war"? Imagine how Palestinians must feel thrown out of their own land, caged up in Gaza or living on the West Bank, where they get harassed by Israeli settlers and made to leave their homes. Palestinians should have the same rights as Israelis but they don't.
I am not anti semitic but I am most definitely anti Netanyahu and the actions of his right wing government. There's a huge difference between allowing Hamas to build it's strength so that it was a creditable challenger to Fatah and deliberately allowing Hamas to enter Israel to commit atrocities but Netanyahu should be held responsible for the consequences of his actions and it is certainly not anti semitic to ask questions about what he knew and chose to ignore. Azar Ali is a politician and should understand that he should have chosen his words very carefully and it seems that didn't.

BBC News - They were Israel's 'eyes on the border' - but their Hamas warnings went unheard
www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67958260

Is this proof?

Good riddance I say. Galloway stands for the Islamists, if he is allowed to be voted in then Rochdale gets what it deserves, because believe me the only agenda will be for the minority, no one else.

Anniel

I am shocked that anyone would think that Israel allowed the massacre on On October 7th. Nobody in the normal political parties thinks that this crazy idea is true. I never realised that antisemitic views like that were believed by some Grans.

Anyone who disagrees with the Israeli stance, will automatically believe this. It suits their agenda. Why has America or Eygpt not released documentation to prove, disprove this. Hearsay and say so is not proof.

Katie59

There are plenty of voters that share his views, it remains to be seen if Labour put an official candidate against him in the GE. If they do it could well split the vote and let another party in

Under our electoral views, they are not allowed to stand another candidate for this by election.

He will stand, but won’t receive the Labour Whip, if he wins, so will sit as an independent.

It’s a short term issue, as Labour, and every other party, will pick a candidate for the GE, so Labour can choose someone else then.

He won’t be representing Labour at the GE.

Anniebach

Annie1 I fear George Galloway, lots of film of him singing
From The River to The Sea to a very happy crowd

Put George Galloway in the corner with a saucer of milk and he'll be fine.

What an unholy mess. The position set out by the candidate puts responsibility for the Hamas murderous assaults on 7.10.23 on the Israeli govt and its security services. It states that Netanyahu deliberately allowed this so he ‘could do what he bloody wanted’ in response.
This belief is expressed by the left in the LP, by some posters here and by every Muslim person I’ve discussed it with.
Councillor Ali repeated this it a Labour Party meeting - it seems the challenge within the party comes largely from Jewish members.

He apologised but further concerns arose leaving Starmer with no alternative but to say if elected, he’ll stand as an independent. I hope he beats Galloway. Starmer is doing the best he can in challenging circumstances

Pity the safe space was stolen from other people though?

Surely though Israel represents the ‘safe space’ in the world for the Jewish people who need a place where they can’t be hounded out from. Imagine how they must feel trying to live in places when anti-Semitic demonstrations run riot. Why are we so mean to the Jews?

Anniebach

The pograms , the Holocaust were persecution of Jews bringing
the birth of Israel

But it was the countries who were criticised for those just as Israel is being criticised now.
It's really nothing to do with Judaism. Trying to claim it is is an insult to all the Jewish people who oppose Israel.

The pograms , the Holocaust were persecution of Jews bringing
the birth of Israel

From the IHRA definition of antisemitism
However, criticism of Israel similar to that leveled against any other country cannot be regarded as antisemitic
Russia was said to be complicit in the pograms
Germans were complicit in the holocaust.
It isn't unknown to criticise a country for massacres. Why is Israel an exception?

In a situation that is crying out for diplomacy, he could have been a bit more discerning with his choice of words .... the swearing bit at the end isn't very subtle.

God there's some serious nonsense here.

Worried about the number of Muslims on politics? Er no,I'm worried about the utter lack of integrity shown by the present government and I don't hold out much hope for the other lot either.

The attacks in Israel,something doesn't add up. I expect time will tell.

I think that the point is that there is no doubt that the Israeli government has questions to answer.

Now, whether they can convince the Israeli people that they (the government) are innocent of all charges remains to be seen.

But the questions must be asked and answered.

Anniebach

To claim the government of Israel allowed the massacre of its
people is anti semantic

How on earth do you come to that conclusion?

To claim the government of Israel allowed the massacre of its
people is anti semantic

The Labour Party is recovering from its anti semitism years with Corbyn

Whatever happened to free speech?
Here's what he said
The Egyptians are saying that they warned Israel 10 days earlier … Americans warned them a day before [that] … there’s something happening. They deliberately took the security off, they allowed … that massacre that gives them the green light to do whatever they bloody want
It isn't anti-semitic to criticise Israel.
It isn't wrong to question the reasons a country is committing genocide.
I suspect a lot of people will vote for him because they support the people of Gaza. The LP may well get a shock

The Labour Party-

We understand that these are highly unusual circumstances but it is vital that any candidate put forward by Labour fully represents its aims and values.