Lee Anderson has joined the Reform UK political party!

Who were the conservatives who defected to UKIP? They sunk without a trace. A few weeks ago Anderson was calling Tice a poundshop Farage . Seems like someone who changes his mind as often as his underpants, still some folk hear what they want to hear and can only grasp a limited range of information. Probably won’t want to hear they approve of smoking in pubs.

Freya5

Chocolatelovinggran

I think that this is the perfect place for 30p Lee.
The Reform Party seems very clear on immigration, but rather hazy on other matters, such as the economy, the NHS, education, defence etc. I believe that all of these matters are important and will impact hugely on the life of all of us, perhaps as much as immigration.
Maybe he does say " what a lot of people believe" : that doesn't necessarily make him right. There are groups would deny women safe termination of pregnancy, there are folk who will tell you that the death penalty deters crime. Are these people right ? Or do they simply share a viewpoint?

Perhaps you should download and read their policies and plans, instead of just following the far left tropes.
They are even in favour of PR in elections, many on the left also advocate this.

All minority parties are in favour of PR Freya5, because it benefits them, it’s their chance of having MPs. However, it’s not Labour Party policy.

"I tire of the political inertia in tackling this and in particular the £13 billion a DAY (just let that settle for a moment - it’s mind blowing) that this is costing us. "

Where do you get this information Urmstongran? Your figures are highly suspect and of course, the Conservatives were using the foreign aid budget until they decided to designate migrants arriving without asylum status as "illegal" Shot themselves in the foot really but the foreign aid budget was never intended for this purpose!

Labour will win the next election. What happens after that is more unpredictable, it depends what the Tories do I think, and who leads them. Those who say reform will disappear are in my view overly confident, they are the same people who were blindsided by Brexit and Trump. Their political predictions are not usually reliable.

Good for him, he’s nothing to apologise for.

Allsorts

Good for him, he’s nothing to apologise for.

He has if he doesn’t stand down so that he can contest Ashfield as a candidate for Reform. His constituents did not vote for him to represent them as a member of Reform, did they, and they may have strong views either in favour or against him doing so? They should be allowed to vote for who they want.

CoolCoco

Who were the conservatives who defected to UKIP? They sunk without a trace. A few weeks ago Anderson was calling Tice a poundshop Farage . Seems like someone who changes his mind as often as his underpants, still some folk hear what they want to hear and can only grasp a limited range of information. Probably won’t want to hear they approve of smoking in pubs.

That's what populists do. They make promises people want to hear. Those people close their ears to anything which might be morally repugnant - if, of course, they have any moral values at all and don't just care about their own selfish aims.

Freya, why are you so sure that I haven't read the manifesto of the Reform Party? I am not sure what "far left tropes" are, perhaps you could explain how you feel confident they are my source.
Their declarations of the NHS waiting lists being cut very promptly doesn't explain how this will be achieved with such a significant shortfall of staff.
There is , also, lots of promises to cut taxes in every way , with no details as to how this might be managed.
I repeat, the manifesto is hazy and I have read it.

Latest figures I could find (full fact) were £8m per day on accommodation for asylum seekers, not £15m as claimed on here. Still a lot of money of course, but accuracy is essential.

Cossy
The government figures and the Runnymede Trust disagree with your claim Re benefits and white people.

From this Runnymede Trust report.
Those receiving any income related benefits from the government stood at:
17% for white groups.
22%for mixed groups.
29%for black groups.

committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/1857/html/#:~:text=In%202019%2C%20a%20government%20statistical,at%20claimants%20of%20child%20benefit.

Chocolatelovinggran

Freya, why are you so sure that I haven't read the manifesto of the Reform Party? I am not sure what "far left tropes" are, perhaps you could explain how you feel confident they are my source.
Their declarations of the NHS waiting lists being cut very promptly doesn't explain how this will be achieved with such a significant shortfall of staff.
There is , also, lots of promises to cut taxes in every way , with no details as to how this might be managed.
I repeat, the manifesto is hazy and I have read it.

Sorry to contradict you, but Reform does explain. Most NHS frontline workers wouldn't pay income tax, which would cost about £7 billion, but would apparently have former workers returning in droves. Add another few £billion to pay for the returnees.

Even if that worked, there's no explanation about boosting the number of scanners and beds the NHS desperately needs. Of course, non-clinical staff (HR, payroll, cleaning, IT, bed management, appointments, etc) wouldn't be eligible for this amazing deal because it doesn't fit the populist narrative. It's a pie in the sky initiative.

petra

Cossy
The government figures and the Runnymede Trust disagree with your claim Re benefits and white people.

From this Runnymede Trust report.
Those receiving any income related benefits from the government stood at:
17% for white groups.
22%for mixed groups.
29%for black groups.

committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/1857/html/#:~:text=In%202019%2C%20a%20government%20statistical,at%20claimants%20of%20child%20benefit.

So what's the reason for that? Could it be that non-white people are discriminated against and receive lower incomes on average?

For which nobody in their right mind would waste their vote.

That was in response to growstuff 19.16.

Or more likely a complex mix of a variety of factors, rather than the identity politics explanation of discrimination only.

I'm not sure I understand you correctly GSM. In my opinion, nobody in their right mind would waste their vote on Reform. Their ideas are ridiculous and appeal to a narrow group of blinkered people.

My blood is still boiling about the skin colour comments - as you know, I have a personal reason, apart from the ethical and moral issues.

I only wish I could have "my country back" too. I'd like to return to a country where people were usually tolerant and didn't "reward" people such as Anderson, who really isn't the sharpest knife in the box. I'd like to think our politicians were competent, even if I don't agree with all their ideas and aims.

Yes growstuff, of course I did read that on the NHS staffing and, like you I felt that, as with so many of the policies, the data seemed based on the use of magic fairy dust.

Galaxy

Labour will win the next election. What happens after that is more unpredictable, it depends what the Tories do I think, and who leads them. Those who say reform will disappear are in my view overly confident, they are the same people who were blindsided by Brexit and Trump. Their political predictions are not usually reliable.

Thank you Galaxy for expressing exactly what I think.

Galaxy

Or more likely a complex mix of a variety of factors, rather than the identity politics explanation of discrimination only.

Identity politics are often top of the agenda because these people don't have anything else to improve the country. It's the politics of the Dark Ages.

Chocolatelovinggran

Yes growstuff, of course I did read that on the NHS staffing and, like you I felt that, as with so many of the policies, the data seemed based on the use of magic fairy dust.

Mixed with a fair share of unicorn manure.

Re the discussion about skin colour; I have a grandchild who is mixed race, Arab/English (White English.) His skin colour is white, whilst his eyes are dark brown and his hair very dark. He does go very brown in the summer though, but he doesn’t burn. My pleas to his parents to put plenty of sun cream on him often fall on deaf ears although I’ve explained, his skin can still burn and skin cancer in later life is still a risk.

petra

Cossy
The government figures and the Runnymede Trust disagree with your claim Re benefits and white people.

From this Runnymede Trust report.
Those receiving any income related benefits from the government stood at:
17% for white groups.
22%for mixed groups.
29%for black groups.

committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/1857/html/#:~:text=In%202019%2C%20a%20government%20statistical,at%20claimants%20of%20child%20benefit.

I stand corrected, having worked in various locations in various job centres I was simply speaking from worked experience.

His inflammatory untrue hysterical comments about the mayor of London are dangerous nonsense

growstuff

I'm not sure I understand you correctly GSM. In my opinion, nobody in their right mind would waste their vote on Reform. Their ideas are ridiculous and appeal to a narrow group of blinkered people.

My blood is still boiling about the skin colour comments - as you know, I have a personal reason, apart from the ethical and moral issues.

I only wish I could have "my country back" too. I'd like to return to a country where people were usually tolerant and didn't "reward" people such as Anderson, who really isn't the sharpest knife in the box. I'd like to think our politicians were competent, even if I don't agree with all their ideas and aims.

Yes!

And Reform policy on policing seems heavy on upping the length of sentences, with no reference to where the offenders will be housed. My understanding is that prisons are already overcrowded.