Is there anyone who still thinks that Israel's actions in Gaza are justifiable?

Anniebach

Who gives figures to these sources ?

February sources claimed more civilian casualties in 4 months in Gaza than in Ukraine since the start of the war

The figures produced by the Gaza health authority have been questioned in past conflicts, subsequent investigations have always found them to be accurate.
But you are right. The figure of over 32000 is now questionable because the health system if breaking down. It will probably be more with over 11000 people missing and bodies lying under rubble and on roads made impassable by sniper fire.
The Lancet analysed the figures
www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(23)02713-7/fulltext
The problem with counting the dead
news.sky.com/story/israel-hamas-war-health-system-collapse-in-gaza-leaves-authorities-struggling-to-count-the-dead-13107279

No! Women are not more vulnerable to a bomb, collapsing building, or a bullet. All hurt, all kill.
If the numbers of women and children are added together, they will inevitably be more than men. The most vulnerable in a war are probably children and the old. However all are vulnerable if they are not in shelters and the only shelters are the tunnels underground, where Hamas hide like rats, popping up to fight and then running back into their holes. The poor civilian population are left defenceless in the open, or tents, or in remaining buildings.

Who are the authorities struggling to count the dead ?

maddyone

No! Women are not more vulnerable to a bomb, collapsing building, or a bullet. All hurt, all kill.
If the numbers of women and children are added together, they will inevitably be more than men. The most vulnerable in a war are probably children and the old. However all are vulnerable if they are not in shelters and the only shelters are the tunnels underground, where Hamas hide like rats, popping up to fight and then running back into their holes. The poor civilian population are left defenceless in the open, or tents, or in remaining buildings.

If only it was only bombs that killed women!
Here's the link again maddyone read about the starving pregnant women with no access to healthcare, whose newborns will die, as they themselves might. But of course you know better than the WHO
www.who.int/news/item/03-11-2023-women-and-newborns-bearing-the-brunt-of-the-conflict-in-gaza-un-agencies-warn

I entirely lost any faith in the WHO after the Covid debacle they engaged themselves in.

Anniebach

Why oh why are the alleged victims always women and children, are the men away fighting for Hamas ?

I now refer to the deaths of women and children because often when Palestinian men are mentioned there's someone who says, "Oh but they are all either members or supporters of Hamas" or some such thing. tbh I'm sick of challenging those responses.

maddyone

I entirely lost any faith in the WHO after the Covid debacle they engaged themselves in.

That must make looking at Gaza a lot easier.

No aid has arrived in Palestine since the deadly strike.

1.1 million Palestinians are in danger of starving.

Who has said there is a danger of starving, Hamas ?

Wyllow3

No aid has arrived in Palestine since the deadly strike.

1.1 million Palestinians are in danger of starving.

I am hoping Biden can make Netanyahu see sense.

See sense , allow Hamas to attack Israel

I was thinking similarly WWW2 that it needs very strong international pressure - probably the US could be the most effective.

There is a growing movement in the UK (pop into I player news) to limit arms to Israel, but this is hardly likely to make a difference in the short term.

Will Hamas listen to US ?

I hear you but I've posted a lot on this thread from the beginning and don't feel up to answer yet again today as its a complicated ceasefire/negotiations/how can Hamas and Israel continue to fight over occupied territory, and I do deplore acts of terrorism.
I deplore Hamas leaders sitting in comfort, and I deplore those Israelis who seek to rob the livelihoods of Palestinians.

Clearly only negotiations and cease fires can ultimately try to resolve matters.

Thats why for now, today I'm addressing humanitarian aid
*as without it I think armed action will harden resolve and just make matters worse and worse all round*

Freya5

growstuff

Candelle

Could someone please tell me how Israel was to deal with these murdering terrorists? Ask them nicely to please go away?

No, they hammer out a deal, which means making concessions.

Yes on both sides, something the terrorist Hamas does not want to do. I'll never forget what their leaders said about Jewish people.

Have you read what some Israeli leaders have said about Palestinians? That kind of accusation works both ways.

Anniebach

Who has said there is a danger of starving, Hamas ?

What a remarkably inane question!

What else happens to people when they have no food?

owstuff Thu 04-Apr-24 19:37:56
Anniebach
Who has said there is a danger of starving, Hamas ?
What a remarkably inane question!

What else happens to people when they have no food?

They are hungry, I do not know if they hunger

Anniebach, I don’t know if you watch any tv news. The best I’ve found is channel 4 at 7pm. If you haven’t seen the starving children take a look at ch4. It’s a reliable news channel. The images reduce me to tears

Thank you Iam so many lies, impossible to trust now

Images of a mother who has no breast milk or formula to give her baby and feeding the baby with water from a bottle. The baby is so thin. My goodness we have lost our way and humanity if we feel nothing for these children, or deny their existence.

I feel sorrow for hungry and thirsty children , and for babies whose little bodies have been penetrated by men

Anyone who supports Israel at this stage just turns over when the news reports on Gaza come on. They tell themselves that it's propaganda, the BBC / Press / ITV news have an anti-semitic bias, & so it's just not on their radar. I know this because otherwise compassionate individuals are hardening their hearts to the truly terrible ongoing suffering of the Palestinians which we have a hand in. Who is providing / validating the stats they doubt? They're trusted by the EU, by WHO, by ICJ, by the UN. "oh, they're all just fools" seems to be the counter to that. The genocide laws make it clear that, no matter what the behaviour of Hamas, Israel must apply the Geneva convention & the international laws for prevention of genocide. Israel must not starve "a group" they must not destroy health infrastructure (82% destroyed in Gaza), they must not indiscrimately target civillians, they must not torture them.31 recorded deaths of Palestinians from starvation so far (27 children) and Israel are continuing to block aid trucks and have created a situation (bombing the 3 trucks of the aid convoy) in which food by the sea route has been paused.

Whitewavemark2

Images of a mother who has no breast milk or formula to give her baby and feeding the baby with water from a bottle. The baby is so thin. My goodness we have lost our way and humanity if we feel nothing for these children, or deny their existence.

That’s one of the images that reduced me to weeping Whitewave. I think the last time I wept at tv news was 1984, the Biafran famine - I was breast feeding my own lovely , healthy 4 day old baby at the time

Anniebach

owstuff Thu 04-Apr-24 19:37:56
Anniebach
Who has said there is a danger of starving, Hamas ?
What a remarkably inane question!

What else happens to people when they have no food?

They are hungry, I do not know if they hunger

It goes further than hunger. People with no food starve and die. That's a fact!

If it's a lie that people in north Gaza have no food, where do you think they're getting it from?

Even before 7 Oct, Gaza depended heavily on imports for food. That's a fact! Since the war started, any capacity Gaza has to produce any food has been destroyed. That's a fact!

Gaza has depended on the delivery of food by aid agencies. That's a fact! Aid agencies have stopped deliveries because of the risks, so where do you think the food comes from now?

Maybe you'd like to explain which facts you don't believe.

The Biafran war was in 1967-1970. I remember it well and was deeply shocked by the TV pictures of starvation. It was the first time I'd seen such terrible malnutrition.