Is there anyone who still thinks that Israel's actions in Gaza are justifiable?

Are you saying the Ukrainians shouldn’t defend themselves? If you are not, then are you saying the Israelis shouldn’t have defended themselves? Maybe you’re saying no one should defend themselves because it’s uncivilised. Well yes, it is, but I’m unsure of the alternative. Do you think that if the Israelis hadn’t retaliated that Hamas would not have have fulfilled their pledge to do the same again, and again, and again?

Plus the Israeli war is not ‘our’ war. The situation in Northern Ireland was absolutely our was, it was actually happening in the UK.

My behaviour? I don’t understand.

maddyone

To my knowledge, although the IRA did the most appalling things, I’m not aware that they at any time abducted 240 British people and hid them in their houses, moving them from house to house, whilst raping the women amongst them, so that the British soldiers had to fight their way through the whole of Northern Ireland in order to try to find them.
Nor did the IRA, which committed the most heinous of crimes, set out on a murderous spree, involving more than a thousand IRA personnel, where they raped, burned alive, shot, and beheaded people, before taking the hostages as mentioned above.
I am in no way making any excuses for the bombings, knee cappings, or murders the IRA did commit.

Surely we behave in a civilised way or we don't? We don't change what is morally right because we're dealing with people who do dreadful things. That's what makes us civilised. If we don't behave like that we become as bad as the perpetrators. Basically you are using the behavior of one group of people to justify your own behavior. That's a very dangerous road to go down.

maddyone

^Netanyahu needs to keep this war going^

That statement in itself is biased. There is no acknowledgment that Hamas are also keeping the war going. As I said in my previous post, this war needs to end, but both sides need to stop simultaneously. The rockets need to stop being sent out of Gaza, Hamas are responsible for those. The bombing and destruction needs to stop in Gaza. Netanyahu is responsible for that. The hostages need to be released. Hamas is responsible for that. Until both parties are willing to stop and release hostages, this war will not end.

👏👏👏👏👏

Katie
The wars you mention are simply not important enough in the minds of many folk. Partly that is because the media show little to no interest in them, and rarely report from those areas of conflict.
We do get reports from Ukraine, but not daily, as in the case of Israel. I have frequently mentioned the lack of interest in Ukraine on these threads about Israel, in the way of comparing the level of interest. Ukraine generated huge interest and compassion at first, but now it has tapered off, even though the Ukrainian war is the one which threatens Europe far more than the Israeli war. The only thing I can put it down to is unconscious antisemitism. Our media may well be antisemitic. It would be denied of course, but denial doesn’t mean it isn’t so. We have had vast coverage of Israel since last October and we have much coverage of the pro Palestinian marches. There have been some marches drawing attention to the antisemitism in the country, but often they’re not covered. Last week a man carrying a banner saying Hamas is terrorist was arrested for assault! Then he was de arrested because he committed no assault. How could this happen?
The world is anti semantic. It always has been and probably always will be. That is why there is no interest in other wars. It’s really not the fault of the people, it comes down to the media’s preferences.

maddyone

To my knowledge, although the IRA did the most appalling things, I’m not aware that they at any time abducted 240 British people and hid them in their houses, moving them from house to house, whilst raping the women amongst them, so that the British soldiers had to fight their way through the whole of Northern Ireland in order to try to find them.
Nor did the IRA, which committed the most heinous of crimes, set out on a murderous spree, involving more than a thousand IRA personnel, where they raped, burned alive, shot, and beheaded people, before taking the hostages as mentioned above.
I am in no way making any excuses for the bombings, knee cappings, or murders the IRA did commit.

Well said!

To my knowledge, although the IRA did the most appalling things, I’m not aware that they at any time abducted 240 British people and hid them in their houses, moving them from house to house, whilst raping the women amongst them, so that the British soldiers had to fight their way through the whole of Northern Ireland in order to try to find them.
Nor did the IRA, which committed the most heinous of crimes, set out on a murderous spree, involving more than a thousand IRA personnel, where they raped, burned alive, shot, and beheaded people, before taking the hostages as mentioned above.
I am in no way making any excuses for the bombings, knee cappings, or murders the IRA did commit.

maddyone

Many people on Gransnet are not neutral.

I own up to being neutral,I detest Israeli expansion as much as I detest Islamist expansion they are both evil and have no regard for civilians that die in Gaza.
We concentrate on Gaza but there are many wars at present the worst by far is Sudan where 25 million are at risk of starvation, neighbouring countries across sub Saharan Africa are all fighting terrorism on a large scale. In the Caribbean how is Haiti going to be brought to order?.

Well said Vintagewhine

Totally agree Vintagewhine 👏👏👏

Oreo

We have Muslim terrorists here in the UK, so have other European countries, so have African countries, so have Middle East countries.
Are all these countries so awful that Muslim extremists have to rise up? They are dedicated to a Caliphate and will hate and kill all others who aren’t on the same page as themselves.
The naivety and worse are alive and well on these pages.

However, none of this makes it acceptable for a civilised democratic country like Israel to cause the starvation and deaths of innocent people. People who disagree with you are not naive they know what is right. During the troubles none of us would have agreed with the slaughter of Catholics on the basis that the IRA lived among them and would have been known. This is despite the bombing of innocent people on the mainland however I remember the backlash by some against Irish people living in England. Not a lot changes does it?

It’s generally accepted that that Netanyahu will keep the war going to protect himself from criminal prosecution.
Hamas has made an offer but this has been turned down by Israel.
There will be no peace until both parties agree. I wish they would.

maddyone 👏👏👏

Netanyahu needs to keep this war going

That statement in itself is biased. There is no acknowledgment that Hamas are also keeping the war going. As I said in my previous post, this war needs to end, but both sides need to stop simultaneously. The rockets need to stop being sent out of Gaza, Hamas are responsible for those. The bombing and destruction needs to stop in Gaza. Netanyahu is responsible for that. The hostages need to be released. Hamas is responsible for that. Until both parties are willing to stop and release hostages, this war will not end.

Well said. There seems to be ingrained biases on both sides of the fence. I think we should dial down the emotion, which is fueling racism and division here.

paddyanne54 ...according to which media outlet? Verified?

I don’t think anyone is truly neutral on here whatever they may say
Of course they’re not. It’s important to be aware of this, not merely accessing information which supports pre conceived ideas. Confirmation bias.
Do most do that??
I do try to obtain information from multiple sources, but am human and not immune to bias.

international Journalists want to be allowed in, they have said this time and time again.
Netanyahu needs to keep this war going because once it ends he will be tried ( and found guilty ) of the many outstanding criminal charges against him.

Israel will not want international journalists in Gaza because it is dangerous. It would be helpful to us all if they would allow them in.
There are journalists in Gaza. They are all Palestinians, so hardly neutral, but some choose to believe them but not Philippa.
The situation needs resolution.
The resolution needs to be simultaneous in my view, not that anyone in Israel or Gaza cares about my view. The destruction needs to stop and every single hostage needs to be released. However much we dislike Netanyahu he will not stop until the hostages are released.

They don’t want any civilians there to either get in their way, or to be shot by hamas or taken hostage by hamas .
I don’t think anyone is truly neutral on here whatever they may say.

Many people on Gransnet are not neutral.

Possibly Philippa is not neutral. She lives in Israel and supports Israel even if she does not support Netanyahu. I don’t know .
We hear that the media do not report on Gaza or if they do it’s sanitised and shows only Israeli soldiers, not the terrible carnage which has been created.
Israel will not allow international journalists inside Gaza, it woukd be helpful if they did, but clearly there are things going on there they don’t want international independent journalists reporting.

And now the children of Gaza are paying for their behaviour with their lives.

I can believe it GrannyGravy13 there aren’t many ‘innocent’
Gazans, most support hamas.