Changed my mind about voting for Reform uk

I think these fears are groundless. There will soon be a far left wing party, thankfully, equivalent to Reform - I’m surprised that the significance of Owen Jones leaving Labour hasn’t been picked up on more.

I found McDonnell’s views pretty frightening.

Many of the people involved were frightening though, authoritarian and with a disregard for the people they supposedly fighting for that was at times breathtaking.
However I think they hold such little power now I am not worried about them, they were floating around in Blairs day and were then as now without power.

I'm still not very clear on what Corbyn's Labour, as a whole, did that was particularly wrong as far as the policies they put forward in their last manifesto are concerned.

Corbyn himself was an inadequate leader, but Labour's policies weren't particularly frightening.

Quite. John McDonnell still lurks. He represents what I don’t trust about Labour.

Dinahmo, Of course we know that Labour can do nothing at the moment, but Labour has a track record of being inclined to lurch from centre left to extreme left and back again and after every change they demonise what went before.

Look how Tony Blair and Gordon Brown and the whole New Labour project is excoriated by its successors. The fact that it got Labour into power and kept them there for 13 years is nothing, compared with having offended the Labour purists.

Then we had the Corbyn years, the less said about them the better, but Laour completely turned round on a sixpence when Starmer became leader and is now centrist again. Now it is Corbyn and his acolytes who are on the naughty step, but for how long? And how much 5th column Corbynist activity will there be when Labour does get into power?

Dinahmo

Why do some on here state that they do not trust Labour? If it's because of their parliamentary track record there's little that they can do because they are the minority party and their opinion makes little difference to whatever the Tories are proposing.

I’m quite tired of hearing all the opposition parties criticised for “doing nothing” Johnston got in with a big majority, very little any opposition parties can do other than vote and challenge.

Starmer is clearly a centralist left winger.

If it’s the economy and spending then I don’t think we have much to fear there either.

Why do some on here state that they do not trust Labour? If it's because of their parliamentary track record there's little that they can do because they are the minority party and their opinion makes little difference to whatever the Tories are proposing.

Cherylrov

Agree with germanshephardsmum a reform vote is a wasted vote. I am thoroughly dissatisfied with the tories however feel cannot trust labour not to turn back to being corbenistas once in power!

100% certain that won’t happen.

Agree with germanshephardsmum a reform vote is a wasted vote. I am thoroughly dissatisfied with the tories however feel cannot trust labour not to turn back to being corbenistas once in power!

zakouma66

How does 1 in, 1 out work please? Who chooses the 1?

Who knows! It sounds like a multi storey car park!

Athrawes

I've got no idea who to vote for. They all seem to be as awful as each other. They are all talk and no - or very little - action. I'm very disappointed.

Look at their manifestos, their policies, their voting records. No one person or party is ever going to match up to you 100%, but at least this way you should be able to identify policies which rough align with your beliefs and priorities.

It’s not just about the “wants” it has to be fully costed and explain “why” & “how”

Hope this makes sense.

I've got no idea who to vote for. They all seem to be as awful as each other. They are all talk and no - or very little - action. I'm very disappointed.

It doesn’t work. None of their ‘policies’ work. As DrWatson said, back of a fag packet stuff.

How does 1 in, 1 out work please? Who chooses the 1?

"Greyisnot mycolour. "But rude seems to be your manner.

Surely it's the manifesto not the individuals people look at first when they think about voting? Look at individuals record in the HoC, what they voted for and against, not just personalities.

BevSec

Stella14, what is wrong with low taxes and spending as little public money as possible?

You cannot be serious??

Oh yes 🙂 I got the wrong end of the stick!

No I was thinking Australia, New Zealand, Canada and some Eastern Europe more . Brexit is possibly better for them, not so cliquey.

nanna8

And, just for balance sake, huge numbers of white people from across the seas.

Europe? They’ve all b….d back home after Brexit.

And, just for balance sake, huge numbers of white people from across the seas.

The Reform website and manifesto looks something like what a rocket enthusiast might build for a Mars Mission launched from the village green?

When in IT, we had a saying that some projects had apparently been designed "on the back of a fag packet". The Reform suggestions re Economic and Tax reform appear to have taken that principle to extremes.

And while they want to help the NHS and Waiting Lists, they don't seem to realise that without huge numbers of brown people (here now, and to come as replacements or the extra staff needed) the NHS would collapse like George Brown (one for history buffs) after a boozy night out.

*Utterbliss" you can read it yourself, just type Reform UK into your search engine and it will take you to their website. Don't ask others to explain it to you, do the work , read it and form your own opinions.

Certainly systems need fixing better.

However it is beyond me to understand why people are ignoring the fact we are short or both doctors, nurses, and other skilled staff: staff are leaving due to stress and inadequate pay, we are not training staff to replace those we lose.

With an aging population there is an increasing demand.
You get further cuts in NHS and Social Care.

I've read the "reform" one page statement on the NHS. It blames it all on bureaucracy.

This s the Labour Party manifesto on the NHS and Social Care

labour.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/Mission-Public-Services.pdf