Too many Union Jacks say Labour MP’s !

maddyone

Dinahmo
Another poster wrote I’m not proud to be British. I wanted to be European.

You replied Me too.

This exchange clearly shows a lack of knowledge about what/who is European.
Europe is a geographical area. The EU is a political construct.

My opinion only but it’s sad that British people ^don’t want to be British.^

I agree.
Mind you how many people feel European first ( in any European country) not many I bet.
It’s something certain people say as it sounds on the side of the EU and they can’t forgive British people for voting leave.

I’m English and still feel European. My ancestory dna is mostly north west uk, danish, Irish, Scottish and French. Like most Brits, I’m a real mixture.
I’m not ashamed of my heritage. I’m not ashamed of this country’s empire and involvement in the slave trade. I’m pleased it was active in ending its involvement in slave trade. Proud of the Industrial Revolution, despite my Manchester mill work ancestors lived an average age in their late 20’s. Proud that Rochdale just over the moors, had the first workers cooperative and a glorious town hall. Proud of my grandparents who worked 12 hour shifts in the mills and wanted more for their own children.
I find it odd that some people are ashamed of being British or English.

maddyone

Dinahmo
Another poster wrote I’m not proud to be British. I wanted to be European.

You replied Me too.

This exchange clearly shows a lack of knowledge about what/who is European.
Europe is a geographical area. The EU is a political construct.

My opinion only but it’s sad that British people ^don’t want to be British.^

River/sea pollution.People dying because they have to wait too long in A&E. No access toNHS dentists. Rwanda policy . Now attempts to put homeless people in prison. Politicians having to leave due to scandal after scandal. Schools falling apart. Two previous PM’s having to leave in disgrace. How can anyone be proud of this country these days?

Dickens

Mollygo

Maddyone, I wonder which bit of British they don’t want to be and what their contribution to being British is?

I've never quite understood the "I'm ashamed to be British" trope.

Go to any other European nation and there will be those who are disillusioned either with their government or the behaviour of some of the people in that country. I wonder if they go around saying "I don't want to be xyz" (whatever the nationality is)?

Or maybe it's a 'British thing' to say you don't want to be British?

When British hooligans on holiday used to behave badly abroad- particularly in Spain - it made me cringe, but I never felt I had to be ashamed on their behalf. Anyway, you don't need to make a study of it to observe that just about all nations have their share of troublemakers.

This is true.

I always appreciate being able to post freely on here.
There are countries where it is restricted or even dangerous to do so, especially as a female.

I'd just like to point out that nowhere have I said that I do not want to be British. It's a fact of live that by birth I'm English/British. What I'm not proud of is the way the country is headed at the moment, although it may change direction at the next GE. I for one will be voting for that change.

I am proud th

I'm not ashamed, I'm not proud. Its OK to be neutral I think maybe?

I do understand Geography as well. But its about feelings not just maps.

Iam64

I’m English and still feel European. My ancestory dna is mostly north west uk, danish, Irish, Scottish and French. Like most Brits, I’m a real mixture.
I’m not ashamed of my heritage. I’m not ashamed of this country’s empire and involvement in the slave trade. I’m pleased it was active in ending its involvement in slave trade. Proud of the Industrial Revolution, despite my Manchester mill work ancestors lived an average age in their late 20’s. Proud that Rochdale just over the moors, had the first workers cooperative and a glorious town hall. Proud of my grandparents who worked 12 hour shifts in the mills and wanted more for their own children.
I find it odd that some people are ashamed of being British or English.

This exactly sums up how I feel. I’m happy I’m British but also happy to be European. However I feel British more than I feel European as Europe encompasses so many countries and cultures. I don’t feel French, nor German, nor Italian, not any other nationality but I do feel European, that is not American or Canadian or wherever. I’m happy to visit my daughter in New Zealand, but no way would I ever want to live there, although it is a beautiful country and the culture similar to Europe.

Like Iam, I’m not at all ashamed of my heritage. Indeed I’m proud of the families I came from who struggled in difficult circumstances to do the best they could (one great grandmother was widowed with four young children and took in washing and baked tea cakes to sell in order to make a living. My grandmother started work at twelve years old in the mill.) I have nothing to be ashamed of, but I am proud that Britain was one of the the first countries to abolish slavery.

Iam64

I’m English and still feel European. My ancestory dna is mostly north west uk, danish, Irish, Scottish and French. Like most Brits, I’m a real mixture.
I’m not ashamed of my heritage. I’m not ashamed of this country’s empire and involvement in the slave trade. I’m pleased it was active in ending its involvement in slave trade. Proud of the Industrial Revolution, despite my Manchester mill work ancestors lived an average age in their late 20’s. Proud that Rochdale just over the moors, had the first workers cooperative and a glorious town hall. Proud of my grandparents who worked 12 hour shifts in the mills and wanted more for their own children.
I find it odd that some people are ashamed of being British or English.

I find it odd too.

It's an entirely different thing to dislike the Government of the day and want a change.

I think it's possible to be proud whilst disagreeing with the government in power.
As missadventure says freedom to speak and debate is something to be proud of, as are the freedoms for women and gay people. I am proud that the labour party has decided being electable is a good thing! I am proud that we dont as a country feel the need for individuals to be armed. There are many other reasons to be proud. Actually I think proud is the wrong word, I cant think of an alternative but I think that word antagonises some people.

I'm appreciative of the freedoms, I'd say.

It’s an entirely different thing to dislike the government of the day and want a change.

Absolutely. Being happy to be British has nothing to do with government. Governments come and governments go, but being British doesn’t change.

I appreciate living here and being born in a country which allows people to speak their mind without fear of being 'disappeared', but a country which also has laws prohibiting hate speech.

I'm quite happy to be British.

I also feel "European" in the sense that even though the language differs, the culture - both in the Arts and Politics is more to my liking than that across the pond, or wider still.

Although Americans speak the same language, I don't align with their (to me) brutal Capitalistic outlook, their gun culture, their 'every-man-for-himself' culture. My Swedish OH (though he's not the best judge - of anything) worked in America for some time and he believes their sense of humour quite often lacks the subtlety of British humour which he believes is the best in the world - we have (according to him) such a dry wit, which takes some beating.

Anyway, that's just a personal view.

A personal view that reflects my own Dickens
We are more like other European cultures than the American culture. We share language but in so many other ways have little in common

Your post at 16.07 exactly reflects my point of view too Dickens.

My daughter lives in New Zealand at the moment. She is trying to come home (long story.) She wants her children to understand and identify with their culture, the country they were born in. She is also teaching them about Maori culture whilst they are there, and I really enjoy learning about that too when we visit. However I don’t want to live in NZ, beautiful as it is. I really enjoyed being there on Waitangi Day this year and learning about the history. I like history and I’m interested in other cultures, but I always want to come home to Britain.

Talking of American culture and their love of their national flag, stars and stripes pretty visible everywhere. What was surprising and somewhat shocking to witness given its connotations, when we were in the Deep South over ten years ago, it wasn't unusual to see people driving around with the Confederate flag attached to their vehicles.

We did a self drive and self planned tour of the Deep South just before Covid. It was fascinating but I couldn’t begin to tell of everything I saw, learned, and experienced whilst we were there. Very, very interesting and eye opening is my description.

Actually in Mississippi, my description would be shocking.

Fire away? We have time.

I think I’d have to start a different thread on informative holidays zakouma. Suffice it to say on this thread, I absolutely loved our holiday, it was fascinating, but I would never in a million years want to live in the Deep South, especially in Mississippi.

I am genuinely very interested. We always wanted to visit the Carolinas but poor health makes it impossibe now.

We actually visited Louisiana, Mississippi, and Tennessee. So not Carolina. I’ll do a new thread tomorrow zakouma. I’m sure others will have interesting holidays to talk about.

Sorry you weren't able to get there zakouma, we visited Charleston, S Carolina when staying in Savannah, Georgia. Both beautiful places, we'd said we'd go back but I don't really enjoy long hauls anymore, but grateful for the places the places I've seen.