Five Bulgarian nationals plead guilty to falsely claiming Universal Credit over five years and storing wads of cash in ‘fraud factories’.

Callistemon21

My first language is English, btw.

My first language is also English. I also speak almost fluent German. I hadn't thought about trying it, but I'm sure my German would be good enough to defraud the German benefit system - if it's defraudable.

Chestnut

Primrose53

growstuff

Germanshepherdsmum

GrannyGravy13

I am coming to the conclusion that it is now politically incorrect to state the bleedin’ obvious.

These were Bulgarian nationals who deliberately set out to defraud the U.K. Government, why in earth should we pussyfoot around this fact

Posting that others should be in jail is pure whataboutery

How true - to the extent that the opening post has been amended by removing mention of the nationality of these disgusting fraudsters, despite it having been mentioned in the press and on the tv and radio news. But we mustn’t mention it on GN. What are we coming to?

The nationality isn't relevant. The massive amount involved and the fact that anybody could get away with it are the important issues.

The nationality IS relevant as I said in my earlier post. It is relevant because if people whose first language is not English can defraud the system then alarm bells should be ringing and making it watertight should be top priority.

Agreed as I said before, we need to know how many people from other countries are scamming us and robbing us. It is an important factor surely. There are our own home-grown criminals and then there are foreign criminals and it seems that nowadays most of these large scale organised gangs are the latter.

Ahem! I suspect that's not true. The public doesn't get to hear about many of the large scale gangs.

Goodness Chestnut that’s an assumption and a half. I suspect Brits are just as crooked as people from any other country, and are doubtless involved in crime all over the world.

With Google translate it's amazing how many languages we can speak. ]😅

Like Callistemon I had extensive dealings with the DWP.
Mine followed the death if my husband so I was bereaved and grief stricken. I’ve never dealt with such an incompetent, rude, inconsiderate organisation . My first language English, my work involved dealing with organisations and ‘difficult’ people

Every area I worked had a person that assisted benefit fraud

I don’t mean an official person

growstuff

Primrose53

growstuff

Germanshepherdsmum

GrannyGravy13

I am coming to the conclusion that it is now politically incorrect to state the bleedin’ obvious.

These were Bulgarian nationals who deliberately set out to defraud the U.K. Government, why in earth should we pussyfoot around this fact

Posting that others should be in jail is pure whataboutery

How true - to the extent that the opening post has been amended by removing mention of the nationality of these disgusting fraudsters, despite it having been mentioned in the press and on the tv and radio news. But we mustn’t mention it on GN. What are we coming to?

The nationality isn't relevant. The massive amount involved and the fact that anybody could get away with it are the important issues.

The nationality IS relevant as I said in my earlier post. It is relevant because if people whose first language is not English can defraud the system then alarm bells should be ringing and making it watertight should be top priority.

How do you know they didn't speak good English? What a load of *!

No-one has disputed that.

But, speaking excellent English but dealing with different UK accents, negotiating the system, takes some skill, as I am finding out.

DiamondLily

For five people, the amount they defrauded was pretty astonishing.

Yes!
They must be very clever.

The amount is staggering. I wonder how much we can find to reclaim?

When Bulgaria joined the EU our local co- operated farm was given €20 million to update the farm machinery.
Nothing was spent on the farm but some very expensive German cars appeared.
A Porsche was stole from Germany. It was apprehended at the Turkish border and take to Sofia. There, a judge decided that such a car shouldn’t be garaged until the court case was settled but driven around, so he did 😱
There are hundreds of stories like that that defy belief.
Billions of Euros have disappeared.

Grammaretto

With Google translate it's amazing how many languages we can speak. ]😅

Badly!! 😂

No one seems to mention that this government has cut the number of civil servants investigating benefit fraud and the training for new recruits is woeful.since austerity became the watchword, training has been siphoned off into private companies, including some big accountancy firms who are supposed to oversee them. So it’s all a myriad of unaccountability. So it’s not that the U.K. is a “soft touch” - it’s a “no touch” due to the lack of suitably trained staff , and a high turnover of staff they do have. I agree the lack of ID cards also makes it easy to adopt multiple identities and claim for numerous benefits - there is a huge fraudulent racket in claiming student loans by bogus students from various countries adopting fake identities, who take the loans then disappear. So whilst we must persue the criminal gangs, surely tightening up the system must be the first port of call - that means public money must be invested in the system.

Joseann

Grammaretto

With Google translate it's amazing how many languages we can speak. ]😅

Badly!! 😂

You can speak any language with AI!

People keep saying only five of them They had numerous claims

They also admitted money laundering offences made
thousands of false claims
for Universal Credit using either real people or hijjacked identities

These claims were supported by an array of forged documents, including fictitious tenancy agreements, counterfeit payslips and forged letters from landlords, employers and GPs.Once the claims were made, money was laundered around numerous bank accounts or withdrawn in cash.

growstuff

Chestnut

Primrose53

growstuff

Germanshepherdsmum

GrannyGravy13

I am coming to the conclusion that it is now politically incorrect to state the bleedin’ obvious.

These were Bulgarian nationals who deliberately set out to defraud the U.K. Government, why in earth should we pussyfoot around this fact

Posting that others should be in jail is pure whataboutery

How true - to the extent that the opening post has been amended by removing mention of the nationality of these disgusting fraudsters, despite it having been mentioned in the press and on the tv and radio news. But we mustn’t mention it on GN. What are we coming to?

The nationality isn't relevant. The massive amount involved and the fact that anybody could get away with it are the important issues.

The nationality IS relevant as I said in my earlier post. It is relevant because if people whose first language is not English can defraud the system then alarm bells should be ringing and making it watertight should be top priority.

Agreed as I said before, we need to know how many people from other countries are scamming us and robbing us. It is an important factor surely. There are our own home-grown criminals and then there are foreign criminals and it seems that nowadays most of these large scale organised gangs are the latter.

Ahem! I suspect that's not true. The public doesn't get to hear about many of the large scale gangs.

Beg to differ there. The difference being here, this is the biggest benefit fraud committed. Recently a Briish woman, was caught defrauding to the amount of 16,000, last year a British gang, were convicted for stealing 777,000. So we do hear about others stealing. It's not a war on foreigners, but if they are such it needs to be told where they are from, as in the previous British convictions.

Siope

zakouma66

All foreigners are baddies. There you go.

And so are black or brown Britons. Every single one.

Oh dear, how childish. My African heritage BIL would disagree, so would most people, including myself.

Freya5

growstuff

Chestnut

Primrose53

growstuff

Germanshepherdsmum

GrannyGravy13

I am coming to the conclusion that it is now politically incorrect to state the bleedin’ obvious.

These were Bulgarian nationals who deliberately set out to defraud the U.K. Government, why in earth should we pussyfoot around this fact

Posting that others should be in jail is pure whataboutery

How true - to the extent that the opening post has been amended by removing mention of the nationality of these disgusting fraudsters, despite it having been mentioned in the press and on the tv and radio news. But we mustn’t mention it on GN. What are we coming to?

The nationality isn't relevant. The massive amount involved and the fact that anybody could get away with it are the important issues.

The nationality IS relevant as I said in my earlier post. It is relevant because if people whose first language is not English can defraud the system then alarm bells should be ringing and making it watertight should be top priority.

Agreed as I said before, we need to know how many people from other countries are scamming us and robbing us. It is an important factor surely. There are our own home-grown criminals and then there are foreign criminals and it seems that nowadays most of these large scale organised gangs are the latter.

Ahem! I suspect that's not true. The public doesn't get to hear about many of the large scale gangs.

Beg to differ there. The difference being here, this is the biggest benefit fraud committed. Recently a Briish woman, was caught defrauding to the amount of 16,000, last year a British gang, were convicted for stealing 777,000. So we do hear about others stealing. It's not a war on foreigners, but if they are such it needs to be told where they are from, as in the previous British convictions.

You mean the biggest fraud detected to date, not the biggest fraud committed. Exaggeration doesn’t help.

Casdon

It’s probably by no means the only operation of this scale. The most important issue surely is improving detection and catching others who are running similar operations, bearing in mind this one was actually detected three years ago?
Does anybody know, has that happened?

Unfortunately it’s this kind of thing that’s being used as justification for government proposals to be allowed access to the bank accounts of all benefit claimants.

Vegansrock
Once upon a time in the dim distant past housing officers would visit a property when a housing benefit claim was made.

So if a gang based in a "nice" leafy suburb or village had been behind the fraud, would the headline have been "Five British nationals plead guilty to falsely claiming Universal Credit over five years"?

Good point Glorianny - I suppose the organised crime is more organised and harder therefore to spot?

Pammie1

Casdon

It’s probably by no means the only operation of this scale. The most important issue surely is improving detection and catching others who are running similar operations, bearing in mind this one was actually detected three years ago?
Does anybody know, has that happened?

Unfortunately it’s this kind of thing that’s being used as justification for government proposals to be allowed access to the bank accounts of all benefit claimants.

I guess detection is multi faceted process though, I was thinking in terms of checking out that there are full records of a person’s existence through information the state already holds, and also checking out the documentation that has been submitted, that’s why I suggested AI upthread. Somebody else mentioned ID cards too. I’m not in favour of access to private bank accounts myself.

petra

Vegansrock
Once upon a time in the dim distant past housing officers would visit a property when a housing benefit claim was made.

I suspect there are so many claims now that the cost of employing an army of housing officers wouldn't be worth it.

I receive housing benefit and had to provide my rental agreement, names of landlord and letting agent, evidence of ID and I have to submit bank statements every six months. I've lived in this area for decades and have always paid council tax. When I applied, I had to explain how my circumstances have changed over the years and I'm no longer able to pay the full rent.

Digitalisation should mean that everything can be cross-referenced with a click of a button and anything "dodgy" could be flagged up.

However, there are obviously cases where it would be much more difficult to check. For example, people new to an area won't have a history of paying council tax, some people still don't have bank accounts and there are those who rent from friends and relatives in "reciprocal" arrangements .. and many more.

Councils should have a team of housing officers who check out the more irregular rental agreements. Unfortunately, cutbacks mean that such teams are under extreme pressure and cut corners. I know somebody who was a housing officer but was mad redundant a few years ago and she was never replaced.

Of course, there will always be determined fraudsters who find all the loopholes and get away with it (just as there are some financial advisers who exploit the loopholes for a living).

Casdon

Pammie1

Casdon

It’s probably by no means the only operation of this scale. The most important issue surely is improving detection and catching others who are running similar operations, bearing in mind this one was actually detected three years ago?
Does anybody know, has that happened?

Unfortunately it’s this kind of thing that’s being used as justification for government proposals to be allowed access to the bank accounts of all benefit claimants.

I guess detection is multi faceted process though, I was thinking in terms of checking out that there are full records of a person’s existence through information the state already holds, and also checking out the documentation that has been submitted, that’s why I suggested AI upthread. Somebody else mentioned ID cards too. I’m not in favour of access to private bank accounts myself.

Casdon I might as well have an ID card because I've had to submit so much evidence of who I am. The council doesn't have automatic access to my bank account, but I have to submit statements from all my bank accounts every six months - it would actually save me time and printer ink if the council could just have direct access. I sometimes feel that "big brother" is watching me anyway, especially now that online platforms like EBay have to submit details of anybody with an income of more than £1000 a year.

Some of us are with you vegansrock on regularly pointing out the cost of austerity. Wreck public service and reap the rewards