The Republic of Ireland and their tensions with migrants.

Nevertheless but asylum seekers are not per se criminals and using this language is designed to foster hate and dehumanising individuals and has been use by politicians deliberately to denigrate those who seek genuine help.

Well said Wyllow; the voice of reason👏

MayBee70

Am I right in thinking that, prior to Brexit we could legally return migrants back to France but Brexit put paid to that? Was it the Dublin agreement or something like that??

If that were true surely France would simply ship them off to somewhere else. I'm sure there was some arrangement to disperse people around the EU.

petra

Growstuff There are more Vietnamese migrants arriving than Afghans.
Government figures.

www.gov.uk/government/statistics/statistics-relating-to-the-illegal-migration-bill/additional-statistics-relating-to-illegal-migration-march-2024#:~:text=6%2C265%20small%20boat%20arrivals%20compared,arriving%20so%20far%20in%202024

Those figures are only for the first four months of this year. I admit I hadn't seen them. Mine were for the whole of 2023. That's quite worrying because you can bet most of the Vietnamese have been trafficked.

And they have our UK values front and centre

Well, I'm British through and through - and Reform doesn't represent my values.

From ONS:

In 2021, people who identified as "Muslim" had the lowest percentage of people aged 16 to 64 years in employment (51.4% compared with 70.9% of the overall population); this resulted from the high percentages of people who were students or looking after home or family in this group.

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/culturalidentity/religion/articles/religionbyhousinghealthemploymentandeducationenglandandwales/census2021

What's wrong with being a student or looking after home or family?

Cossy

Urmstongran

Let’s all agree to just call them ‘migrants’. Who happen to pay human traffickers £££s to come over in rubber boats. They come (often) because France has turned down their applications for asylum. France only accept c.29% of migrants who wish to claim asylum, so they try their luck here. We by default accept over 60% of claims (? Why the discrepancy but that’s another conversation) and they KNOW that those who are refused asylum status are rarely sent back anywhere anyway - so for them it’s a win-win situation. Add on all the care and attention we provide - no tent city here, no siree - these migrants rock up on our shores pretty certain they’ve hit the supposed jackpot.

“Win win”? Interesting phrase!

Many only pay a “deposit” to their traffickers agreeing to work for them (they believe legitimately) once here, however of course if not picked up and properly “escorted” by our authorities they then disappear into our black economy, often into modern slavery. Those who are “housed” aren’t, in the main, housed in comfortable hotels and fed via the hotels. During lockdown they, along with our homeless, were housed in more than adequate accommodation, not quite so now.

I agree migration is a huge issue and much more should be done to control both those entering illegally and via legal means.

I wouldn't call gambling your life in a leaky boat, having spent you life savings on paying a known scoundrel for the journey, as a win-win situation.

Urmstongran

More ONS Stats : 40% of muslim men are not economically active.

85% of muslim women are economically inactive.

As many of the immigrants are muslim, that bodes well for the UK. Not.

Pretty easy from your statement to understand why you’re voting Reform!

Wiki:

"Before Brexit, the return of migrants to EU countries was governed by the Dublin Agreement, under which migrants could be sent back to a safe third country through which they had passed before arriving at their destination."

MayBee70, I believe you are right but for some reason we don't want to remind people about that...

Am I right in thinking that, prior to Brexit we could legally return migrants back to France but Brexit put paid to that? Was it the Dublin agreement or something like that??

The English don't have their own government unfortunately paddyanne. If we did maybe the English regions other than the south east would have more of a say.

You seem more than usually agitated paddyanne. Are things not going well north of the boarder?

Never mind we will all get a chance to have a say at the next GE.

ONS figures up until March 2023 show that 21, 000+ visa holders have gone on to claim Asylum.

Yes I’ve been to ROI paddyanne. I remember the days of the Celtic Tiger very well. Now (post Varadkar and with their own migrant problems) not doing quite so well I believe.

I agree paddyone our government have actively mismanaged what is now a decline that’s why I intend to vote Reform at the next GE.

They are not right wing. Just right. And they have our UK values front and centre.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

Oh dear URMIt appears every government bar your own is inept ,ineffective or just plain stupid! Maybe take a very close look at Westminster its one of the most corrupt parliaments in the western world .A place where paedophiles hide in plain sight ,MP have multiple jobs ,some work from abroad and STILL get paid.expenses claimed for houses they dont need because they live minutes from WM and much much more.But lets have a wee pop at any or every country ONCE ruined by the "great" UK ..is this your attempt at saying no country who gains freedom from the chains of a very bad "master " have done a very bad job ? You are wrong Ireland is a successful country...have you ever been there?
NONE yes thats none ,zero ,zilch of the countries who gained their freedom from the DIS united kingdom have ever wanted back...HOW Ireland rules its OWN country is begger all to do with you..much like how Scotland does.The problems
YOU have is the ENGLISH government,maybe try to do something about them!!
Preferably BEFORE they drag us into yet another ILLEGAL war!!

Urmstongran

Most of them probably didn’t get the memo petra in these small rural villages.

The British population, and the population of every single other Western nation, have known this about migrants for a long time. We have voted against it for years and for years, we have been ignored. Only an idiot believes a single mainstream party will do anything to stop immigration when the capitalist right love the cheap labour and the socialist left love the cheap voters.

Vote Reform.

No thanks! I’ll stay being an “idiot” thanks. I cannot say here what I feel about Reform and many of their supporters as I’d be banned!

Urmstongran

Let’s all agree to just call them ‘migrants’. Who happen to pay human traffickers £££s to come over in rubber boats. They come (often) because France has turned down their applications for asylum. France only accept c.29% of migrants who wish to claim asylum, so they try their luck here. We by default accept over 60% of claims (? Why the discrepancy but that’s another conversation) and they KNOW that those who are refused asylum status are rarely sent back anywhere anyway - so for them it’s a win-win situation. Add on all the care and attention we provide - no tent city here, no siree - these migrants rock up on our shores pretty certain they’ve hit the supposed jackpot.

“Win win”? Interesting phrase!

Many only pay a “deposit” to their traffickers agreeing to work for them (they believe legitimately) once here, however of course if not picked up and properly “escorted” by our authorities they then disappear into our black economy, often into modern slavery. Those who are “housed” aren’t, in the main, housed in comfortable hotels and fed via the hotels. During lockdown they, along with our homeless, were housed in more than adequate accommodation, not quite so now.

I agree migration is a huge issue and much more should be done to control both those entering illegally and via legal means.

Most of them probably didn’t get the memo petra in these small rural villages.

The British population, and the population of every single other Western nation, have known this about migrants for a long time. We have voted against it for years and for years, we have been ignored. Only an idiot believes a single mainstream party will do anything to stop immigration when the capitalist right love the cheap labour and the socialist left love the cheap voters.

Vote Reform.

If the dreadful fact that 39 Vietnamese died in the back of a lorry hasn’t deterred Vietnamese migrants I doubt the threat of being deported to Rwanda will hold any fear.

May 23rd at 09:30am will mark a worse day for Sunak than even the local elections on May 2nd. The day the ONS releases the net migration figures up to December 2023. Odds are it will be higher than even the year before (net 745,000). Awful timing (election year).

Growstuff There are more Vietnamese migrants arriving than Afghans.
Government figures.

www.gov.uk/government/statistics/statistics-relating-to-the-illegal-migration-bill/additional-statistics-relating-to-illegal-migration-march-2024#:~:text=6%2C265%20small%20boat%20arrivals%20compared,arriving%20so%20far%20in%202024

Let’s all agree to just call them ‘migrants’. Who happen to pay human traffickers £££s to come over in rubber boats. They come (often) because France has turned down their applications for asylum. France only accept c.29% of migrants who wish to claim asylum, so they try their luck here. We by default accept over 60% of claims (? Why the discrepancy but that’s another conversation) and they KNOW that those who are refused asylum status are rarely sent back anywhere anyway - so for them it’s a win-win situation. Add on all the care and attention we provide - no tent city here, no siree - these migrants rock up on our shores pretty certain they’ve hit the supposed jackpot.

I HAVE worked with asylum seekers! The minority are economic migrants, a smaller percentage are criminal. Of course the real criminals are the traffickers and corrupt govts.

In the last batch where a boat overturned a four year old child drowned. Many children come, some are unaccompanied. Women do come too, men of the family tend to come first for many reasons, men are more likely to have been the subject of persecution, they are more likely to survive the journey. How on earth do you think these people get to France??

,

NotSpaghetti

This is becoming a very unpleasant thread.

Asylum seekers are not illegal. If they are processed fairly and deemed to not need asylum then we should deport them.

The fault is us not identifying which people genuinely need help and which do not - leaving all people in a sort of limbo for ages before their cases are decided.

Please don't dehumanise.

For info, the current figures re cases we do look at as potentially needing asylum are such that more than half are proven to be genuine - 63% of those cases we have processed since 2021 were given grants of protection.

You are wrong JenniferEccles when you say the vast majority of those who pitch up here are not in genuine need - because the government thinks otherwise.

👏👏👏👏👏