Is Islamophobia In Europe A Growing Concern?

Wyllow3

It is, but not to assume (not saying you are!) that it is supported by most people of Muslim origin, who wish to lead the ordinary lives we've described.

You are correct, I would never and have never lumped all Muslims together.

As a family we have many Muslim friends, all different, some women cover their heads some don’t, some adhere to their faith more than others.

There are some men we know who have gone back to their birthplace (or that of their parents) for an arranged marriage. At least three of which I know for certain, that their wives have little English, do not venture far if at all without their husbands and the children do not attend preschool/nursery/playgroups before compulsory school age.

According to the men they are happy and have no desire to mix or interact locally.

growstuff

Oreo

growstuff says ( unbelievably!) ‘who’s perceiving the threat? And why?’
Unless you live in a cave why would you even write that?

Because they are genuine questions. I'd like an explanation from the people who write about such things. Maybe they should look at their own reasoning.

And, no, I don't live in a cave and I do follow current affairs quite closely.

Stop being disingenuous.

GrannyGravy13

A terrorist only has to get his job right once to cause mass mayhem, murder and injuries.

The secret services have to get it right every single time in order to prevent the above.

This is regardless of whatever organisation they belong to or whether their politics are right or left leaning.

The Muslim Brotherhood are an organisation to be taken seriously worldwide.

Of course it is, which is why their activities are monitored, in more ways than the public knows about.

Oreo

growstuff says ( unbelievably!) ‘who’s perceiving the threat? And why?’
Unless you live in a cave why would you even write that?

Because they are genuine questions. I'd like an explanation from the people who write about such things. Maybe they should look at their own reasoning.

And, no, I don't live in a cave and I do follow current affairs quite closely.

Katie590

“Who's perceiving the threat? And why?”

Many who fear the Islamic violence in the UK and elsewhere, otherwise we would not have Islamophobia would we

Incidentally, the security services monitor the activities of neo-Nazi, far right extremists. Should we all be paranoid about them?

Yes they monitor right wing groups criminals and sex offenders as well, it’s all done automatically and when a threat is flagged up by the system it is assessed and appropriate action taken.
It doesn't always work the Manchester bomber was being monitored but acted before it was escalated

Ah! So you do recognise that Islamophobia is a fear of Muslims!

Fear of just about any group can be whipped up by publicity and the media.

growstuff says ( unbelievably!) ‘who’s perceiving the threat? And why?’
Unless you live in a cave why would you even write that?

It is, but not to assume (not saying you are!) that it is supported by most people of Muslim origin, who wish to lead the ordinary lives we've described.

A terrorist only has to get his job right once to cause mass mayhem, murder and injuries.

The secret services have to get it right every single time in order to prevent the above.

This is regardless of whatever organisation they belong to or whether their politics are right or left leaning.

The Muslim Brotherhood are an organisation to be taken seriously worldwide.

“Who's perceiving the threat? And why?”

Many who fear the Islamic violence in the UK and elsewhere, otherwise we would not have Islamophobia would we

Incidentally, the security services monitor the activities of neo-Nazi, far right extremists. Should we all be paranoid about them?

Yes they monitor right wing groups criminals and sex offenders as well, it’s all done automatically and when a threat is flagged up by the system it is assessed and appropriate action taken.
It doesn't always work the Manchester bomber was being monitored but acted before it was escalated

the ones

The human beings you mean?

Katie590

growstuff

Oreo

All well and good but it’s not just about grooming gangs is it?
It’s mainly about terrorist attacks, often appalling like the Manchester Arena one, the bus attack in London, the London Bridge one and many others which are carried out by extremist Muslims.Not Irish/ Catholic/ Hindu/ Jewish or any other religion.Their aim in Europe is to sow fear and to further the cause of an Islamist Caliphate.
How many times travelling on the London tube has anyone eyed with worry a bearded young man with a backpack? So they are certainly sowing fear, phobia, and non irrational.

How many "terrorists" are involved? What percentage is that of the total number of Muslims in the UK?

The deadliest mass shooting to date in British history was carried out in Dunblane. Do we all go round scared stiff of Glaswegians?

It’s not a question of how many it’s the perceived threat and the recent attacks, not only that but the security service monitoring communications of suspected extremists.

If you access extremist websites you will attract attention and get your phone, email and web activity monitored and you will not know. Furthermore your online contacts will be investigated and if the threat is justified you will be physically monitored as well.

Who's perceiving the threat? And why?

Incidentally, the security services monitor the activities of neo-Nazi, far right extremists. Should we all be paranoid about them?

How this might attract women, I've no idea - unless of course they subscribe to the 'dominant' male ideology.

I think that's because many Muslims don't follow that kind of creed. I'm off to the dentist this afternoon. My dentist is female and covers her head completely. I assume she's Muslim. I've seen her qualifications, so presumably she wasn't prevented from having a good education.

My daughter's Muslim mother-in-law most definitely rules the roost in her household. Her husband has a UK degree and has always been employed, but she is the one who set up a business with branches throughout Manchester, which enabled them to send their three children to independent schools.

My daughter's own husband is one of the most easy-going, sensitive and thoughtful people you could ever meet. He was brought up as a Muslim, but now says he has no faith, although he still recognises his Arab heritage. My daughter is the boss in that household.

The above is what happens. Over the years people do integrate. If my daughter has children, it's likely that they will have some Arab physical features. They will probably be "labelled" as Muslim, even though they will probably have Mancunian accents and come from a very British household. If their father had been of European heritage, they would have European features and their heritage would probably be forgotten completely after a couple of generations.

growstuff

Oreo

All well and good but it’s not just about grooming gangs is it?
It’s mainly about terrorist attacks, often appalling like the Manchester Arena one, the bus attack in London, the London Bridge one and many others which are carried out by extremist Muslims.Not Irish/ Catholic/ Hindu/ Jewish or any other religion.Their aim in Europe is to sow fear and to further the cause of an Islamist Caliphate.
How many times travelling on the London tube has anyone eyed with worry a bearded young man with a backpack? So they are certainly sowing fear, phobia, and non irrational.

How many "terrorists" are involved? What percentage is that of the total number of Muslims in the UK?

The deadliest mass shooting to date in British history was carried out in Dunblane. Do we all go round scared stiff of Glaswegians?

It’s not a question of how many it’s the perceived threat and the recent attacks, not only that but the security service monitoring communications of suspected extremists.

If you access extremist websites you will attract attention and get your phone, email and web activity monitored and you will not know. Furthermore your online contacts will be investigated and if the threat is justified you will be physically monitored as well.

Namsnanny

I dont think all Glaswegians have a religious (or any) doctrine on common.

But somebody who was born there murdered many innocent schoolchildren and their teacher? How do we know when we walk down the street that there isn't somebody with a similar mindset and planning to do the same?

Religion has been misappropriated by extremists.

Neither do all people of Muslim origin!

Dickens Thank you so much for your intelligent and rational contributions to this thread.

Sorry, a Maybug has tangled its self in my hair, have to sort that out, may be a while

I dont think all Glaswegians have a religious (or any) doctrine on common.

Has everybody forgotten the Denmark Place fire, Hungerford, the Clerkenwell cinema fire, the Admiral Duncan nail bombing, the Cumbria shootings, the Plymouth shooting or the murder of Jo Cox?

Oreo

All well and good but it’s not just about grooming gangs is it?
It’s mainly about terrorist attacks, often appalling like the Manchester Arena one, the bus attack in London, the London Bridge one and many others which are carried out by extremist Muslims.Not Irish/ Catholic/ Hindu/ Jewish or any other religion.Their aim in Europe is to sow fear and to further the cause of an Islamist Caliphate.
How many times travelling on the London tube has anyone eyed with worry a bearded young man with a backpack? So they are certainly sowing fear, phobia, and non irrational.

How many "terrorists" are involved? What percentage is that of the total number of Muslims in the UK?

The deadliest mass shooting to date in British history was carried out in Dunblane. Do we all go round scared stiff of Glaswegians?

Katie590

“How this might attract women, I've no idea - unless of course they subscribe to the 'dominant' male ideology.”

If men walk around with machine guns and bullets strapped across their chest you look to them for protection. They are dominant and can take what they want, there is no other effective security. Not too different to the no-go areas in many cities.

Which cities are those? Specifically which areas?

Got an email this morning from our local interfaith forum - a long existing group meeting monthly.

(x City) Interfaith
Website and blog for (X city) Interfaith

This month
Women’s Interfaith Forum – Prayer: connecting beyond ourselves?
Sunday 19th May 1:00-3:00 pm (address) Please bring food to share if you are able. Open to women of all Faiths or none.
Read on ......

Contrast this with the bile spouted by haters (picture)
Which resembles cartoons from 1930's Germany. Found in an article about far right in the UK.

Choose to find what we have in common, do not be afraid of difference per se.

Dickens, I think those sort of memes affect young men of all cultures who feel insecure. Look at the video games and thriller movies with exaggerated violence and an us and them mentality. More obvious in the USA where far right hate groups openly claim their land is ‘sovereign territory’

Again, we are being directed towards what divides not what we have in common.

“How this might attract women, I've no idea - unless of course they subscribe to the 'dominant' male ideology.”

If men walk around with machine guns and bullets strapped across their chest you look to them for protection. They are dominant and can take what they want, there is no other effective security. Not too different to the no-go areas in many cities.

Oreo

All well and good but it’s not just about grooming gangs is it?
It’s mainly about terrorist attacks, often appalling like the Manchester Arena one, the bus attack in London, the London Bridge one and many others which are carried out by extremist Muslims.Not Irish/ Catholic/ Hindu/ Jewish or any other religion.Their aim in Europe is to sow fear and to further the cause of an Islamist Caliphate.
How many times travelling on the London tube has anyone eyed with worry a bearded young man with a backpack? So they are certainly sowing fear, phobia, and non irrational.

Terrorists by their very nature aim to terrorise, destroy and annihilate - that we know.

What better way to recruit young men (and sometimes even women) than to appropriate the faith they hold dear and re-fashion it to the extent that anyone outside of it can be considered the Godless heretic enemy of it?

How difficult is it to 'radicalise', for example, a young man whose own personal life might be such that his human frailties, his 'social inadequacies' leave him feeling powerless and insignificant - especially if he is from an impoverished background. When you see film footage of such men riding around in Toyotas with a magazine of bullets strapped across their chests holding aloft some enormous piece of weaponry - is this just about religion, or is it the age-old reflection of men's ego and its need to dominate? Isn't that why such men repress their womenfolk - because otherwise, they are a threat to their self-perceived, self-importance and self-worth?

What I mean is that Islam itself is, or can be, a very useful and powerful philosophy to give meaning and structure to inadequate men, basically. Which is not to suggest that all young Muslim men are ineffectual or 'lacking', but, in common with other men - their egos, their testosterone-fuelled need for 'power' does make them a buoyant pool from which to recruit by those who've commandeered Islam for their own agenda.

Don't shoot me - it's just a personal POV which I've arrived at through thinking about Islam as a religion, and also as a creed which can be distorted to fulfil an agenda.

How this might attract women, I've no idea - unless of course they subscribe to the 'dominant' male ideology.