Who is responsible for taking care of children’s teeth?

Ilovecheese

I don't see how we could realistically prosecute the parents for bad teeth in their children. How could it be proved? Especially as genetics certainly plays a part.

Has anyone suggested they should be prosecuted?
I don’t think so. It would be a waste of court time.

I asked a simple question, but it’s a complex problem. I agree that we shouldn’t take children into care because they have dental health issues, unless it’s part of a larger lack of care problem.
I dislike that some posters who have berated other posters as virtuous simply because they looked after their children’s teeth. It’s unnecessary and unkind. My mother made little effort to look after my teeth, but she did send me to the dentist regularly from age seven, but he drilled and filled relentlessly, and as a result, I have a mouth full of crowns and implants. I vowed never to inflict that on my own children. I wasn’t being virtuous, I was simply trying to avoid them having a mouth full of fillings by the time they were teenagers.

My own solution, were I the PM, would be to pay dentists properly for seeing children (and adults too but at least children) but also to go back to having school dentists, because not all parents will take their children to see a dentist. A letter from the school dentist would motivate most parents to take their child to a dentist if decay has been spotted by the school dentist. Cleaning teeth in school, as I mentioned upthread, isn’t going to solve the problem. Dental checks and prompt treatment would help to solve the problem. I think it’s absolutely terrible that children are having to go into hospital, and undergo general anaesthesia, and are having whole rows of teeth removed because parents can’t be bothered, and the government don’t provide the necessary care.

MaizieD I am fully aware that Dentists are self employed.

Of course if the priority of Universities were to stop taking more foreign students than U K students on these courses we would be able to train more, wouldn't we??
That isn't necessarily true. Foreign students pay substantially more in fees than UK students. If they go so does the money they bring in, courses would close and universities would struggle. The money they pay subsidises UK students.

Governments of all persuasion have ignored the recommendations of the Review Body into dental pay.

Dentists are self employed and have to provide their own premises, equipment and staff so need decent renumeration to enable them to do that.

And, they can't just start to see people on the NHS - they need a contract.

I don't see how we could realistically prosecute the parents for bad teeth in their children. How could it be proved? Especially as genetics certainly plays a part.

But those of you who think parents should look after their children's teethe, it is not that you are wrong, it is that you are asking for the impossible, you are asking for a perfect world.
Not all parents do this, therefore, we , as a society should step in to help the children.

GrannyGravy13

Exactly Germanshepherdsmum there is so much information in the public domain regarding sugary drink, sweets etc. and teeth (and obesity)

Figures from the last decade show an estimated 16% of adults have very poor literacy skills. From my experience working with children with poor literacy skills, and the fact that the mandated initial reading instruction hasn't had time to really affect the adult population, I would suggest that the numbers aren't much different now. So a significant number of parents can't access this information.

I could also point out that dentists have always worked as private practitioners, not employed by the NHS. Part of the problem for them is that the NHS payments they receive are in many cases not sufficient to cover the cost of the treatment. So they drop the NHS patients.

Sunak's 'idea' that they should work for the NHS for a number of years after qualifying isn't practicable.

Luckygirl
^Such paragons of virtue on Gransnet!!
Are we not to help those children whose parents might not quite live up to this^

Hear, hear! My daughter is in her 50s and has never had a filling because of regular brushing, dentist visits etc as a child … but, as a caring society, I believe we should protect and provide for those children who are not so fortunate.

Things are more than difficult if there is no dentist within a 50 mile radius who will see NHS patients.

My dentist said he would remain in the nhs after the government changes. 3 years later he told me it wasn’t economically viable. I took out Denplan. It’s clear that if the current govt remains, the nhs medical services will follow dentistry with anyone who can afford it taking out private insurance.

It’s obvious that parents are responsible for their children’s dental health. Equally obvious that generalising, the middle classes will have the resources, knowledge and determination to do this. The main reason for hospital admission in children is tooth related
GSM asks ironically should children in that group be taken into care. It can be part of a pattern of neglect and mentioned in care proceedings though on its own wouldn’t warrant proceedings

Surestart - Cameron set about closing them arguing they were used by ‘families like mine, nit people who need them’. Pity he didn’t come to Blackburn Bolton Wigan Accrington Rochdale and more. Sure start was supporting hard to reach families. Gordon Brown was talking about the current evidence on the outcome for the children who were part of the surestart programmes. All positive as research at the time predicted.

Finding an NHS dentist for your children is like the needle in the haystack. My grandchildren all get nhs treatment as part of their parents Denplan with our dentist. The families I worked with simply couldn’t get nhs treatment.
We also lack the school dentist and school nurses. Children;a weight is also the responsibility of,parents but we have an obesity problem in parents who have overweight children

It's down to the parents. No question in my view. I realise things are difficult now with regard to dentists but children should be taken regularly (if possible). If you can't see a dentist, make sure they brush their teeth, avoid too many sweets etc.

I will play my broken record with apologies. We were neglected children. We never owned a toothbrush, never cleaned our teeth. I will never forgive my parents for taking me to have all of my teeth out aged 11. Never. It ruined my school days and teenage years. I was never going to let that happen to my child. She has a lovely smile. I can honestly say that in all my 74 years I have never smiled properly or confidently.
As Anniebach says 'What if the parents don't care?'. I have not posted this for sympathy just giving my view.

Sarnia

A few months ago Rishi Sunak said the Government were going to make newly qualified dentists work in the NHS for 5 years before they could go private. They are trained using NHS money so it's repaying that, in a way. A fairly simple solution to a shameful problem in a supposedly civilised country but, of course, nothing has happened since Sunak's statement. Starmer is right, for once, it is the Government's fault but they have private dentistry, no doubt.

Only some dental students receive financial help from the Government. Most pay their own fees around 46,250, plus of course their accommodation text books, not free, and utilities.
So unless we are willing to pay for each dental student to train, only then can the PM demand they must work for NHS for 5 years. The same could be said for medical students. Of course if the priority of Universities were to stop taking more foreign students than U K students on these courses we would be able to train more, wouldn't we??

We had to use those disclosing tablets once a fortnight, so my mum could check we were getting all the plaque.

My sister has nice, white, straight teeth with hardly any fillings, I have higgeldy piggledy teeth, with more fillings than teeth.

I’m another whose parents didn’t pay attention to dental matters until I was in pain and needed lots of fillings. That made me determined to do better for my own children.

The bottom line is that irrespective of availability of children’s dental care, their teeth need brushing every day. My dd has not been able to access NHS dentists for her children. She still cleans their teeth twice a day! I find it hard to believe many people don’t know the importance of brushing your teeth.

My son has never taken particularly good care of his teeth. I encouraged my children in the usual hygiene but when my son was old enough he only did it ina rudimentary fashion.
I remember one visit resulted in the dentist telling him he clearly kept his teeth clean and brushed them well, My son laughed on the way out saying, 'Haven't cleaned them for weeks mum!
I think diet is far more important than brushing. My children only had fizzy drinks on special occiassions and rarely ate sweets. Maybe this helped, I don't know.

SureStart was just reaping rewards when funding was cut.
It's a side issue I know - but the last of the SureStarts are not at all like the SureStarts early on.

The focus of SureStart has changed under the current government. Between 2010 and 2022, funding has decreased by over two-thirds and over 1,340 centres have closed. It’s not the answer to children’s dental health issues being improved of itself, but it’s one of the building blocks needed.

I'm sure school dentists would be more cost effective, in the long run.
Certainly better than how things are presently.

It took two years for my grandson to get to see a dentist. (No fillings, no problems, just for the record)

The Sure Start centre on the same site as the school where I taught closed through lack of use when I was still teaching GrannyGravy.
I don’t think it’s the way forward. It has been suggested that more middle class families use Sure Start than the families that they were aimed at.
With regard to dentistry I think school dentists would be more effective.

We have very few NHS dentists in my area, but we as a family have seen one privately. My now grown up children still have good Dental care with regular have check ups, both have no fillings, no dental heath problems.
My daughter who has a 3 year old takes my GS to the same practice, all children under 5 get free check ups, not done via NHS, but free .
Once child over 5 the cost will be £23.

NotSpaghetti

Ilovecheese I'd vote for bringing back SureStart!

There are still 2,204 Sure Start Centres in England as of 2023, down from 3,620 in 2010.

The one local to me is considering closing through lack of use by parents…

Ilovecheese I'd vote for bringing back SureStart!

Of course it is a problem that so many children have bad teeth, and in a perfect world all parents would be taking on the responsibility for their children's dental health. We don't have a perfect world though. I think Keir Starmer in this instance (and I don't often agree with his priorities).
Bringing back Sure Start might be a good idea. Giving all families a decent wage and secure housing might also be a good idea.

It also lists not brushing.
The position of your teeth.
The surface of your teeth.
Frequent snacking.
Frequent sipping of drinks, and many more reasons.