Sovereignty not getting a mention!

Strange isn’t it. We are moving to the left when many countries in Europe are moving to the right. It seems more countries including Germany and the Netherlands are ‘thinking’ of leaving but will they? One of the problems I see with our Brexit vote was that divisions within the Tory party did not accept the majority vote in the referendum and threw all sorts of obstacles in the way of implementing it. In fact it seems to me we vote parties in whether it be local or National Government but they don’t actually do what they were voted in for and impose their own ideas whether we like it or not. This is particularly noticeable in Bath and North East Somerset.

Oreo

Am starting to get serious dejavu about this topic on this forum, 😂😬 don’t people get tired of moaning about it?
8 years down the line apparently not.
Of course Keir Starmer won’t be doing anything about ‘trying to re join the EU’ as he knows full well how divisive that would be, so do any future PMs.
In time all will be well and problems with it sorted out.I haven’t noticed anything personally that affects me or mine.I didn’t vote for it but more people did than didn’t so let’s continue to get on with it.

In my family we’ve noticed lots of negative aspects. Three out of the five of us need regular medication, without which our lives would be highly disrupted, and in the case of my DH possibly end. We have ALL have issues with supply, without exception our pharmacists have informed us it’s an issue getting them into our country, we never had these issues pre Brexit.

I also experience massive queues returning from Spain last year, I was at Malaga airport travelling alone and had left loads of time (as I always do), and the non EU queue was horrendous.

Imported food is much higher in cost.

That’s just our family.

I know of one or two businesses locally who’ve had tremendous issues with import/export costs and delays.

I have accepted it was a democratic “vote”, however, imo, it was based on highly misleading information, including EU grants being replaced with UK govt cash (didn’t happen), “savings being spent on the NHS, (didn’t happen) and control of our borders (didn’t happen), migration reduced (increased)

GrannyRose15

Wheniwasyourage

Any referendum or election result can be rethought and changed after time.

The referendum in which we voted to join what is now the EU was reversed in 2016.

Any General Election can lead to a change of government.

However, any suggestion that the referendum of 2016 could EVER be reversed is pounced on as a denial of the democratic will of the people!

We never voted to go into the EU. The vote in 1975 was to decide if we wanted to stay in the Common Market.

We never voted to go into the EU. The vote in 1975 was to decide if we wanted to stay in the Common Market.

If you read extensively and analyse all the information that is available, it is quite clear that what was then the European Economic Community would eventually - because of the process of 'market building' - evolve into the EU. Integrating the internal economic borders between the member states to lead to a fully functioning single European market.

In other words, it was inevitable.

And at that time, anyone who was against the principle of an 'EU' voted not to stay in the Common Market. I, and the majority of my family, at that time, voted against staying in.

And Margaret Thatcher's original enthusiasm for this new market place diminished somewhat around '88 when the then Commission President (the much-hated Delors) informed the TUC that - through the EU, workers could reassert rights that had been rolled back by the Conservative Government.

We have not successfully rolled back the frontiers of the state in Britain, only to see them re-imposed at European level, with a European super-state exercising a new dominance from Brussels.

So followed all the political argy-bargy about the EU 'telling us what to do'. And some of the very people who would have benefitted from EU directives on workers' rights became antagonistic towards it because of being 'ruled from Brussels' - which eventually led to a rather rude and vulgar headline in one of the tabloids... Up Yours, Delors.

... the roots of Brexit perhaps?

Started by Nigel Farage the biggest mischief liar on our shores! And now he has the nerve to stand as MP for Clacton (a place he doesn’t live in or probably even knows where it is)!
He should be tried for treason

Babamaman

Started by Nigel Farage the biggest mischief liar on our shores! And now he has the nerve to stand as MP for Clacton (a place he doesn’t live in or probably even knows where it is)!
He should be tried for treason

I suspect he will get considerable support in Clacton - may well be the chosen candidate and become an MP.

I think the location was a strategic choice.

Working out tactical voting to keep Farage out will be quite a task.

Cossy despite what the pharmacy have told you, there’s a worldwide shortage of certain medicines, I don’t think that’s anything down to Brexit.
Airport queues will be longer of course, especially at certain times and with EU countries.

Wyllow3

I can't understand the opposition to re-looking at tariffs, red tape, customs, trading standards as somehow "going against" Brexit.

Brexit was negotiated in such a hurry and the pressures put for a "hard" Brexit rolled over common sense on keeping our trade with nearest neighbours.

Its simply a renegotiation of targeted areas specifically to promote growth and ease trade hardly "threatening our sovereignty"

Actually Brexit was not negotiated in a hurry, it really took a long time though nothing much was done until the end. The EU was never going to give the UK what we wanted in any case.

Wyllow3

Working out tactical voting to keep Farage out will be quite a task.

Agreed, very difficult.
I don’t think Labour needs any help in this election, it’s getting clearer every day how well they’ll do, but voting for them instead of the awful Greens or useless Lib Dems is still the best thing to do.
If those who want to vote Reform switched to the Conservatives that would mean they wouldn’t lose as many seats, do voters really realise this?

Dickens

flappergirl

keepingquiet

I am still waiting after eight years to be told one single benefit of Brexit.

I am still waiting to hear of one international trade deal that has been made that will bring a direct benefit to these shores.

I am still flabbergasted that air time is still given to a man that was a significant driver in the worst thing that could possibly have happened to our country in generations, and people still seem to love him for promoting mass social and economic suicide.

What a complete joke of a country we've become...

Let us also not forget and he was a Remainer until he saw the light. The light being the door to number 10 of course. They all fell for it hook, line and sinker.

Let us also not forget and he was a Remainer until he saw the light. The light being the door to number 10 of course.

Yes, it's on record.

Him telling us that our problems were home grown and not the fault of "Bwussels" as he called it.

Yet, he was never, as far as I am aware, picked up on that and challenged.

I don't understand how people cannot see that he was a man with an ambition - not that ambition is a bad thing... but if you forsake your principles to achieve it.

... or maybe he just speaks and writes the first thoughts that enter his head?

Either way, he's a fraud.

Sadly he's simply a typical politician, they say what they think will get them elected, regardless of whether they're completely revesing a previously stated opinion. Personally I would trust very few of them, from any party, as their ambition is stronger than their ability to steer a straight path.

Oreo

Cossy despite what the pharmacy have told you, there’s a worldwide shortage of certain medicines, I don’t think that’s anything down to Brexit.
Airport queues will be longer of course, especially at certain times and with EU countries.

You are wrong.

The EU have stock piled the drugs that are likely to be in short supply.

Many are manufactured in the EU

So indirectly Brexit is to blame because as a member we would be able to draw down on this stock pile.

The U.K. does not have sufficient clout of its own, and so will experience shortage.

Whitewavemark2

Oreo

Cossy despite what the pharmacy have told you, there’s a worldwide shortage of certain medicines, I don’t think that’s anything down to Brexit.
Airport queues will be longer of course, especially at certain times and with EU countries.

You are wrong.

The EU have stock piled the drugs that are likely to be in short supply.

Many are manufactured in the EU

So indirectly Brexit is to blame because as a member we would be able to draw down on this stock pile.

The U.K. does not have sufficient clout of its own, and so will experience shortage.

Brexit-related challenges that are affecting drug supply include customs checks at the border and additional regulation faced by manufacturers, requirements linked to the UK’s medicines regulator leaving the European Medicines Agency (EMA).

These shifts have led some companies to remove the UK from their supply chains.

Report from Nuffield Trust health think-tank, highlighted by the FINANCIAL TIMES. Which goes on to report that:

The UK Medicines and Healthcare Regulatory Agency (MHRA) has also struggled to approve drugs at the same rate as the EU, making it difficult for makers of generic medicines to enter the UK market.

The UK set up a "Critical Imports Council' with 23 industry leaders to advise on supply chain resilience for vital goods - including medicines, etc.

The report found that the UK's exclusion from EU 'solidarity' mechanisms meant that it could not rely on European neighbours to insulate it from future shortages.

So, yes - it's a global problem, but it is exacerbated by Brexit.

But what you haven’t mentioned and is relevant, is that regardless of any Brexit problems all the EU countries along with the rest of the world are experiencing shortages of medicines / antibiotics.
Whitewavemark2 seems to be under the impression that EU countries are fine and have stockpiled so all is hunky dory for them. It isn’t.

Granny23 Didn't Scotland when campaigning for Independence 2014 keep shouting about the income to be had from North Sea gas and oil. Then, of course they want it banned now. Europe did suggest Scotland, if Independent, could apply to rejoin EU but would estimate it could take abouf 20 years and finances would need to be significantly improved. And if in EU contracting would have to be adhered to in accordance with the rules. Same as at the time, the contracts for the notorious ferries were issued. If you join the club, you play by the rules.

Oreo

But what you haven’t mentioned and is relevant, is that regardless of any Brexit problems all the EU countries along with the rest of the world are experiencing shortages of medicines / antibiotics.
Whitewavemark2 seems to be under the impression that EU countries are fine and have stockpiled so all is hunky dory for them. It isn’t.

But what you haven’t mentioned and is relevant, is that regardless of any Brexit problems all the EU countries along with the rest of the world are experiencing shortages of medicines / antibiotics.

... which is why I wrote...

So, yes - it's a global problem, but it is exacerbated by Brexit.

I think most know that EU countries are experiencing problems. There are supply-chain issues.

I don't know how far they've got with it because I haven't been following matters since last year, but the EU was to set up a Critical Medicine Alliance, where they will be looking at supply-chain problems, establishing listing of critical medicines, procurement, etc, etc.

I believe it was worse last year, so they've taken, or are taking, steps to alleviate the situation.

... the stock-piling might be this - I've just this minute Googled it...

The EU is setting up two separate reserves: one for protective gear, drugs and vaccines against so-called chemical, biological, radiological and nuclear (CBRN) threats; and a second one for decontamination material which will be deployed to decontaminate people, infrastructure, buildings or vehicles that have been exposed to CBRN agents.

Which is not quite the same thing, of course. I don't know if the stock-piling reference refers to that though.

"Scotland's dependence on subsidy from the UK suggests it would not be a net contributor to the EU budget."

I despair that this old mistruth is still so often bandied about.
Scotland is currently a partner in the United Kingdom. Scots pay income tax and NI, VAT and tax on petrol, Cigarettes, whisky etc. all of which goes to the treasury in London. Then Westminster decides how much of this revenue will be returned to Scotland to fund the devolved powers of the SG. This is not a "Subsidy" as you claim but simply a return of some of Scotland's own money, earmarked for specific purposes. Meanwhile, taxes raised in Scotland are spent on projects e.g. High Speed Rail, which are of no benefit to Scottish Residents, while the Scots had to pay all costs for the New Forth Road Bridge and even the Glasgow Commonwealth Games received nothing from UK funds while the Olympics received Millions from the UK pot.

There is a shortage of certain drugs here,too but we have absolutely nothing to do with the EU . I think it is a worldwide thing.

Oreo

But what you haven’t mentioned and is relevant, is that regardless of any Brexit problems all the EU countries along with the rest of the world are experiencing shortages of medicines / antibiotics.
Whitewavemark2 seems to be under the impression that EU countries are fine and have stockpiled so all is hunky dory for them. It isn’t.

No that is exactly what I didn’t say.

However, what I did say was that the EU is better placed than the U.K. to stock pike because of economic clout.

That is exactly what they have done. Members can draw on this stock pile.

We can’t and in many instances have no stock at all.

Sovereignty was simply a Pied Piper fantasy to lure those who thought they were patriotic into throwing away the advantages of being in the EU single market and getting the Buffoon elected.

Wouldn't it be nice if our, voted for, MP's could do a decent job in return for all the money they get. We need to go back to basics. Get a proper functioning public transport in place, proper support for the Nhs.

My point upthread ( which I can’t get a quote from) was that people insist on saying we voted to join the common market in 1975. We didn’t. The question put to us was did we want to STAY in the common market. The point is pertinent because I believe there is a tendency towards maintaining the status quo in any vote. That was certainly true for me as a first time voter. Had I had any inclination at all of what the common market would become I would have voted to leave as I eventually did 40 years later.

We are still waiting for the benefits of Brexit…I’m not holding my breath,