Child poverty is overwhelming teachers & GPs!

I didn't say it was acceptable Cossy, just stating the figures.

As a teacher (retired) on Scotland, there is a category known as 'failure to thrive'. We certainly would take note of a pattern of unwashed clothes, unbrushed and matted hair and children who were dirty.

I could ask you if you were taking a dig at independent school children?

Sorry luckygirl was busy typing so didn't see your excellent post.
And primrose53 while "explosion" of imported drugs in the 80's was no doubt deleterious it hardly compares to the devastation wreaked on huge areas of the UK.

Yup. Thatcher started the decline, although for some the 80s were boom years. She encouraged selfishness and the’ I’m alright Jack’ attitude that underpins so much of the division in the society she didn’t think existed.

Policemen waving wads of notes at striking miners, 3 million unemployed, many of whom were as Nannee describes - once proud, hard-working people with community values - encapsulates the divisions in the working class that have never been healed.

Those who were able to cling to jobs were sold council houses, shares in energy companies, consumerism and credit, whilst others were left behind, and the UK went back to being two nations. Worse was the populist attack on the ‘Moaning Minnie’s’ who tried to complain.

People were told to get on their bikes to find work away from their children, and of course many who felt safe in their newly bought council house bought into the feelings of superiority over those whose lives had been ripped apart. The ‘we have worked for everything we have’ smugness of many who just happened to live in the right place at the right time, with its subtext that those who didn’t are a feckless, lazy underclass persists to this day.

Of course that sowed the seeds of the homelessness and energy poverty we have now, and the North/South divide that stagnates the economy. Many of those whom Thatcher persuaded were in the new ‘middle class’ are now in the ‘precariat’ - work that doesn’t require overalls but is far more precarious than the life it’s replaced. A world of zero hours, minimum wage, short-term contracts and limited prospects. The personal shares have been sold and energy companies are now in foreign hands. Our water (on a rainy island ) is polluted and the trains don’t run on time. People can’t afford to put the heating on.

I’m not religious but if there’s a Hell, Thatcher should be in it.

Well said Doodledog👏👏👏

Joseann

I could ask you if you were taking a dig at independent school children?

I think she's taking a dig at inequality, don't you?

We still don't seem to have decided, in the UK, whether all lives are of value and should be enabled to be lived with at least a modicum of comfort (i.e adequately fed, housed and clothed) or if life is all about dog eat dog and let the weakest go to the wall.

The 1834 Poor Law Act was based on starving the poor into submission; either find work at any price or live in inhumane conditions in the workhouse. Modern day 'welfare' has been based on much the same principle, with the approval of a significant part of the electorate.

Defending wealth and privilege when there is grinding poverty co-existing with it has always seemed wrong to me, but that's just my opinion...

LizzieDrip

Well said Doodledog👏👏👏

I second that 😆 👏👏👏👏

There's a charity called Sal's shoes which collects and refurbishes children's shoes. They were then sent to countries abroad where children were without shoes. I believe they have been contacted by head teachers of schools in this country and now send shoes to these schools. Children are doing without .
It should not be happening.

Joseann

I didn't say it was acceptable Cossy, just stating the figures.

I know

MaizieD

LizzieDrip

Well said Doodledog👏👏👏

I second that 😆 👏👏👏👏

Thirded. If there is such a thing.

And fourthed

I think she's taking a dig at inequality, don't you?
Yes, and I'm totally with all of you on this, that every child should have a top quality of living and education.

MaizieD

Joseann
“I could ask you if you were taking a dig at independent school children?
I think she's taking a dig at inequality, don't you?

We still don't seem to have decided, in the UK, whether all lives are of value and should be enabled to be lived with at least a modicum of comfort (i.e adequately fed, housed and clothed) or if life is all about dog eat dog and let the weakest go to the wall.

The 1834 Poor Law Act was based on starving the poor into submission; either find work at any price or live in inhumane conditions in the workhouse. Modern day 'welfare' has been based on much the same principle, with the approval of a significant part of the electorate.

Defending wealth and privilege when there is grinding poverty co-existing with it has always seemed wrong to me, but that's just my opinion”

I am indeed having a dig (and a very large one), at inequality and the ever increasing gap between rich and poor.

I have no issue with wealth, I have no issue with those choosing to spend said wealth any way they choose.

However, it physically sickens me that in our country and across the world there is immense, almost obscene wealth, and, irrespective of the root cause, there are children suffering at all levels.

I’ve always tried to do my little bit, I support our local food bank, I do what I can in our local community, I ensured my own children (and indeed some if their friends) never went to bed hungry or set off to school in dirty clothes.

If we ALL just did a little bit for our own community AND our govt cared, perhaps we wouldn’t be in this situation.

Btw, as I’ve stated before I worked for years with these “useless parents”!

“Useless parents”, who themselves may have been brought up in care, maybe the product of heroin addicted parents, may be victims of domestic violence or sexual abuse, maybe carers themselves for unwell parents as children, may have missed out on a decent education for a myriad of reasons. Honestly, I know some GNs may nor accept or believe it but there but for the grace of god…

“Useless Parents” are often far from useless and simply need guidance, support and education.

I suppose it must be quite good fun to sit in your comfort and slag off useless parents.
And anybody who challenges this rhetoric.

zakouma66

I suppose it must be quite good fun to sit in your comfort and slag off useless parents.
And anybody who challenges this rhetoric.

To whom is this addressed?

Joseann

zakouma66

I suppose it must be quite good fun to sit in your comfort and slag off useless parents.
And anybody who challenges this rhetoric.

To whom is this addressed?

Nobody in particular? I can see a certain satisfaction to be gained from calling whole parts of society " useless". Much simpler than actually grappling with the issues or funding things to give people a much needed leg up.

zakouma66

I suppose it must be quite good fun to sit in your comfort and slag off useless parents.
And anybody who challenges this rhetoric.

Seems to be the case.

My son works three jobs and still can't afford to rent a place.

He pays all his CM but only gets to see his son once a week.

His ex comes from a very wealthy family and has never been out to work. She lives in a house a friend has provided for her and pays minimal rent in a well-off suburb. She claims every benefit she can, yet my son is the 'bad guy.'

My GS has an adult older sister to another father who also doesn't work and rarely went to school.

Meanwhile my GS is very small, behind in his development and no one is noticing. He will probably rarely go to school either,

One hell of a crazy country we live in!

Poor wee GS, sorry for your difficulties.

Isn't it interesting that those closest to the problem are not believed by those observing from a safe distance?

These type of threads always go the same way.
The “deserving and undeserving poor”.

It’s easy from a comfortable situation to criticise those who for various reasons struggle in this life. They may not have had the advantages or life chances that some have had. As Cossy says. I have also seen, working with disadvantaged people, there but for sheer bad luck, any of us can end up in a similar situation.

I don’t understand where all the judgment and moralising comes from, as there is good evidence that it is not by sheer hard work alone that people succeed in our unbalanced, unequal society. I just wish those who succeed weren’t so damn smug about it.

Thankyou Doodledog, I was very moved by your post and feel the weight of all you have said . Decisions and repercussions....

Galaxy

I currently work in early years I am afraid as is usual with these issues it is much more complex than the rowntree trust has presented. Complex situations such as the current situation in schools can rarely be reduced to one cause. I am quite tired of complex issues being presented in this way (I dont necessarily blame the Rowntre Trust for that, that is their specific focus) but it doesnt help any of the children in those situations.

That’s the problem with SM discussions on a bite sized bit of info from, in this case, the Rowntree Trust.It allows everyone their own hobby horse to ride on whether it’s mining villages in days of yore , which incidentally are not now filled with despairing locals without a penny in their pockets, these places have thankfully moved on, or talking of deserving versus undeserving poor.
Of course there is useless parenting btw and I see examples every day around me.The reasons are various of course but that doesn’t change the outcome.
As to the much quoted phrase ‘ the gap between rich and poor is widening’ well, no it isn’t.What is widening is the knowledge about who has what and how much and who has very much less.
Things could be better but even in the moneyed Blair years and Sure Start and other initiatives the problems for some families remained.Teachers were still seeing hungry kids, unwashed clothes, knew that parents drank or took drugs or any other social ills.None of that went away.It would take major State intervention for things to really change.Most people wouldn’t want that am guessing.

Child poverty has been around since the year dot and probably will be until the end. It was certainly around post war during my childhood. A lot of children didn’t get enough to eat and wore tatty clothes then. Constant green candles from noses was more or less permanent. It would be nice if things had improved but it seems they haven’t. Why is the country funding foreign wars when its own children are hungry? Why are they taxing the cars of people who can’t afford more modern ones ? Why are they deliberately letting more and more disadvantaged people enter the country and paying for their food and shelter ? Why are they paying huge salaries to people who run banks and sit on their bums all day ?