Police car flipped over and bus on fire in Leeds as riots break out.

Thanks AGAA4 for keeping reality in this thread. The fire crews took the decision not to go in for the same reason, their presence would add to the hostility and criminal damage from the crowds.
As Casdon says, the Roma community is nomadic, they have been persecuted and ostracised, as a result they band together if as they have in this situation. Their mistrust and hostility to authority figures adds to the difficulties and tensions where safeguarding is concerned. They see themselves as strong families and don’t welcome what they see as interference from agencies. I’ve just seen on line (daily mail) that the parents are on hunger strike with the aim of getting their children returned to them
It’s all very high emotion in the Roma community. The family have done nothing wrong - they’re being persecuted seems to be the belief system

GrannyGravy13

Roma people originate from the Punjab area of northern India.

At last, someone knows where the Roma originated from 👏👏👏
I lived in Bulgaria for some years and employed quite a few Roma over the years so I got to know their way of life pretty well. They are very hard workers.
My friend in Bulgaria owns 4 gold and silver shops in the holiday resorts. The best employees she’s ever had.

We had a holiday rental property in Brasov, that’s in Transylvania where Dracula’s Castle is.
We lived not too far from the border with Romania so we could get to our property there in about 5 hrs. If we couldn’t a Roma family would be there to meet renters.
The Roma/ non Roma situation is very complex. Chicken and egg comes to mind.
Not enough space here to explain.

Mt61 the police withdrew because their presence was making the situation worse. They won't have just run away as they will have been ordered to leave.

Mt61 did you see the Police running away from the scene the other night and then the fire service refusing to go in?

They did so because they are well aware of what the Roma are like. They feared for their lives.

Mt61

Then after all that time would you not have though they could have assimilated better to British values and ‘way of life’?

They don’t assimilate with native communities anywhere in the world Mt61. They are nomadic, they speak their own language, and don’t mix. There are Roma populations in all European countries as far as I know, they are definitely in Italy, Spain, Portugal as well as the more eastern countries.

Mt61

Rioting breaks out in Leeds so let’s look into Social Services, the police, the Government. Anyone but the rioters. Whatever the reasons for taking the children, right or wrong, will come to light in due course, but does that justify what then unfolded? Of course not. Surely we can all agree on that? Someone said the footage showed a white person throwing stones. How about the vast majority who were there who were non whites with lighters in their hands setting fire to the bus, throwing far more than stones and perpetrating the riots? If anyone thinks the vast majority of rioters were white then I’m afraid you have lost the plot. If they had been white I’m pretty sure they would be all over the MSM as far right people running riot. Why are people so scared to have a proper conversation about this? If it’s grooming gangs, rioting, whatever, it needs to be called out as should any violence from far right extremism’s. Yet people continue to make excuses, sweep it under the carpet. The legacy this is leaving for our children and grandchildren is frightening, and our generation will be to blame. But, that’s just my opinion, and no doubt I will get called all the usual names, but I’m sick and tired of all the excuses and worst of all the failure to even be able to discuss it.

You won’t get called any names from me Mt61 - completely agree with you. What is happening to our country at the moment is frightening and I see no end to it. It was bad enough when Conservatives were in power but under this Labour government it is just going to go from bad to worse.

Then after all that time would you not have though they could have assimilated better to British values and ‘way of life’?

Many years ago at the school in which I taught, a Roma child came in one morning with very severe bruising on her legs. She said her father had beaten her as she wouldn’t eat her’grub’. Social services came and they involved the police. They were just on the point of taking the child to the police station when they realised she was Roma. Everything stopped, and nothing was ever done .

tickingbird

This isn’t about where they originate from. I don’t need educating on the origins of the Roma or any other gypsies.

I pointed out that some believe Roma to be from Romania because of the name, but, hey, let’s digress so we don’t have to confront any uncomfortable truths eh?

Sorry tickingbird. I know the difference as you obviously do too but whitewavemark2 thinks people don’t.

The Roma who moved into your road sound pretty typical. Even their kids are mini hooligans. The friend I mentioned who lived in Romania and was frightened of the Roma who took over their accommodation had two teen nieces with her. Their kids came round on the pretext of being friends but pinched make up, deodorants, hair clips etc.

tickingbird

This isn’t about where they originate from. I don’t need educating on the origins of the Roma or any other gypsies.

I pointed out that some believe Roma to be from Romania because of the name, but, hey, let’s digress so we don’t have to confront any uncomfortable truths eh?

You clearly do, or you wouldn’t have ignored the reality that many of the Roma in the UK are in fact as native as you are yourself, with family origins here going back 500 years.

On local facebook... 'Roma people are from Rome which is the capital of Romania'

This isn’t about where they originate from. I don’t need educating on the origins of the Roma or any other gypsies.

I pointed out that some believe Roma to be from Romania because of the name, but, hey, let’s digress so we don’t have to confront any uncomfortable truths eh?

GrannyGravy13

Roma people originate from the Punjab area of northern India.

We know that too. thanks.

tickingbird

Roma are a gypsy tribe and not all from Romania. Many are from Poland.

We know that thanks. They have settled all over eastern europe.

Indeed a measured account. Vast experience in safeguarding children tends to give people the ability to understand situations such as this.

Roma people originate from the Punjab area of northern India.

tickingbird

Roma are a gypsy tribe and not all from Romania. Many are from Poland.

Roma are nomadic tickingbird. They don’t consider themselves to be ‘from’ Europe at all, and the first recording of Roma in the UK was in the sixteenth century. They are not all immigrants.

Indeed Iam. A very measured account from you.
Thank you.

Freya5

Iam64

News reports today indicate the baby had a fractured skull after being dropped on the head. The parents say the injury was caused by one of the older children. Four of them had been left for a period of time whilst their parents were out. The decision to remove the children followed the parents decision to leave the country

The news spread quickly through the Roma community in the area. Spokesperson said they get persecuted at home, all over Europe and now in the UK

Persecuted, so you don't expect any investigation by authorities when a child presents with a skill fracture, possibly caused by a sibling, really. They should just be left alone to carry on, just because they are an ethnic minority. REALLY

Freya I don’t know why you conclude I don’t expect any investigation by authorities with a skull fracture etc
My post presented the facts as they were known at that time. In no way did I imply * they shoulf be left alone to carry on, just because they’re an ethnic minority* I simply repeated what was said by a spokesperson from the Roma community.

Peadiatricians, social workers and police who work in safeguarding will be very familiar with parents who explain injuries to infants as being caused by an older sibling. They will also be familiar with complaints from various ethnic or minority groups that they’re being picked on, bullied, treated differently as a result.

SHOUTING as you did towards me doesn’t add to discussion. This is a very significant safeguarding issue. Investigations will have taken place. No doubt the parent intention to leave the country meant action had to take place. I’ve no doubt the family spread the word with the result their friends neighbours and families turned out. Others followed and we all saw the film of police forcibly removing two older children and the riot that followed .
Before anyone shouts at me, I’m not criticising the action the uniformed officers took. Emotions were obviously escalating inside the house as well as outside. Awful circumstances for all

Roma are a gypsy tribe and not all from Romania. Many are from Poland.

Mt61

I agree 100% with your comment and will add that I once lived in a multi ethnic area, mainly Pakistani and some Indian. Then the Roma moved into our road. If you think the Pakistani community were happy about it you’d be wrong.

Roma are truly awful. Yes there may be a few exceptions but there were running brawls on our small road. Thieving, drunkenness, wife beating, children running amok. I once rang the police as a boy of about 10 was running around with a large knife. The police used to come and quieten things down but never any arrests. One police sergeant just advised me to move as it’s only going to get worse!

With respect, many on here have no idea and just have this fuzzy, wuzzy vision of multi cultural utopia. I fear for my grandchildren and have for a long time and you sneer and label people that voted Reform as racists.

I voted Reform because reform is what’s needed in the UK. Something, many things have to change but when I read some of the excuses on here and from politicians I despair.

Oreo

Whitewavemark2
It’s reported that the family are Roma people who come from Romania as are many others in that area, some even from the same village there.
Having some experience with Roma people I can tell you they are very difficult to deal with at times.

Correct Oreo. There have been severalTV progs in recent years about Roma folk who have moved to Romania. Basically they live in hovels and their lives have barely changed in centuries. It showed a couple of their menfolk coming to theUK to earn money to send home so they can build their mini mansions that they love.

whitewavemark2 because they are!

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Whitewavemark2

The home secretary has condemned violent disorder that broke out on the streets of Leeds, describing it as "audacious criminality".

Ms Cooper said: "I've been talking to West Yorkshire Police officers and also to local community leaders about the action they are taking in response to these unacceptable scenes of disorder and criminality that we saw last night.

She’s not wrong.
It needs nipping in the bud before becoming another Croyden.

Whitewavemark2
It’s reported that the family are Roma people who come from Romania as are many others in that area, some even from the same village there.
Having some experience with Roma people I can tell you they are very difficult to deal with at times.