Older drivers. Should we take a test at 75?

Farzanah

A better idea is for a simulated, by computer, driver assessment. Cognitive assessments may be unsuitable to fully test driving ability.

I think this is the way forward, when I took my test the current theory one didn’t exist and is now mandatory. A similar AI driven test could be introduced for people over a certain age, the resources needed wouldn’t be that huge.

It is a fact that most serious accidents are caused by younger drivers, elderly drivers have a lot of minor bumps and scrapes because of poor judgement/vision.
My own opinion is that poor vision is the most dangerous,
because it’s easy to miss a cyclist or motorcyclist at a junction and cause a serious injury or death.

Farzanah there's no reason we can't have a comprehensive system incorporating both/all eventually- these things could come in in stages.
As there are increasing numbers of us on the road it does make sense.

Musicgirl is right though. Not everyone knows when to relinquish
the keys.

A better idea is for a simulated, by computer, driver assessment. Cognitive assessments may be unsuitable to fully test driving ability.

I don’t think anyone is questioning the fact that young male drivers can be extremely reckless. As for the assertion that their driving will not improve, this is patently not true as they will improve and become safer as they get older as long as they have not killed themselves first. The next age group is much safer, which would appear to show that the boy racers have become better drivers. Anyway, it is not a competition to the bottom. It is also not a slur on safe older drivers, many of whom have posted here. It is a fact, though, that our faculties deteriorate as we get older. Eyesight, physical strength, reactions and, yes, cognitive ability can all be affected. It appears that many older drivers do not realise themselves when they are no longer capable of driving safely and reliably, which is why something really needs to be done to counteract this. It is not simply hearsay, either. I would imagine that every single one of us here knows good, safe older drivers and someone who is still driving who really should not be behind the wheel. In the next twenty years, the potential number of elderly drivers will increase exponentially. The tragedy in Edinburgh was entirely preventable and should never be repeated. This time, the accident resulted in death, but there must be many more near misses. As I grow older, hope that if my driving gets to the point where I am a danger to others that someone will tell me.

Surely the problem is younger drivers, who will probably continue to cause 50% of all accidents.
Four times as many accidents as the rest of the whole driving population of all ages. Their driving won’t improve.
It’s not us, it’s the male under 30 s who don’t seem to be bothered.

Well, something has to be done. So many here have assured us that they are excellent drivers and will know when it is time to stop driving, yet judging by the number of people we know and see collectively who are still driving even though they are very obviously no longer fit to do so, l am not sure that this will really be the case. Cognitive tests would be the first step to ensuring that we are still capable and, most importantly, safe to drive.

NotSpaghetti

The tests would presumably cost the driver.
It sounds like a good idea to me.

Yes, I'd assumed the drivers would pay for them, but there's still the issue of finding and training enough people to administer them.

The tests would presumably cost the driver.
It sounds like a good idea to me.

M0nica

But still much easier to administer a cognitive test than expect them to all take their driving test again.

The deduction from all your objections to cognitive tests growstuff is that things should continue as they are with no formal checks on over 70s ability to drive, beyond a self declaration.

No, MOnica I don't think that nothing should happen. However, I doubt very much whether anything will happen as a result of the resources (ie person hours) needed for so many people.

But still much easier to administer a cognitive test than expect them to all take their driving test again.

The deduction from all your objections to cognitive tests growstuff is that things should continue as they are with no formal checks on over 70s ability to drive, beyond a self declaration.

I've just looked it up.

"Data from the DVLA shows that this age group now makes up 4% – or about 1 in every 25 – of all full licence holders in the country. According to the same data there are now 5.97 million full licence holders aged 70 or over, including 510 aged 100 or over."

www.racfoundation.org/media-centre/some-1-6-million-drivers-now-aged-80-or-over#:~:text=Some%201.6%20million%20drivers%20now%20aged%2080%20or%20over25%20Mar%202023&text=Data%20from%20the%20DVLA%20shows,510%20aged%20100%20or%20over.

Musicgirl

growstuff

But MOnica GP surgeries are stretched enough as it is without having to do goodness how many cognitive tests. I don't know how many people reach 70 every year and still want to drive. About half a million are born every year. Obviously they don't all have a driving licence, but if they are to be tested every couple of years, that's millions of tests every year.

For those of us born between 1945-1970 ( the vast majority on GN), the birth rate was far higher than half a million a year. The full impact will be seen in the next ten to fifteen years as the year l was born, 1964 (l squeezed in in December), there were over a million of us born - the highest number of births ever in a single year. Resources across the board will be stretched to breaking point.

I wrote half a million because I didn't know how many people over 70 still have a driving licence. I know that there about 600,000 live births in the UK every year. Some people never learn to drive and some will already have decided to give up driving. I opted for a figure towards what I thought would be the bottom end.

MOnica I agree with you about the wait for driving tests, which is why I doubt very much whether tests for over 70s will become routine. I think (but could be wrong) that most people over a certain age have eye tests anyway, which is why it wouldn't be too much expense/hassle/extra resources to require people to produce some kind of certificate.

However, I do disagree with cognitive tests for everybody. The expense in terms of resources would be enormous. Even if the tests only take a few minutes and can be administered by non-medical staff, the number required every year would be in the millions, if everybody were to take them routinely.

There is no problem with straightforward cognitive tests. I have done more than enough in the past year. There are several used and approved international. There is even a scoring system that measures levels of cognitive function and aligns it with capapciity to do things like drive.

If you are diagnosed with dementia these tests are part of the assesment used to decide whether your dementia is severe enough for you to need to stop driving. As with the dementia assessment, there would be an appeal system so that anyone failing it can appeal.

As for tests making people nervous. They would not make anyone more nervous than they would be when they had to retake their driving test.

Farzanah, I think you are very optimistic if you think careless young drivers improve as they age! Rather, their bad habits are ingrained and they will just continue to be bad, inconsiderate drivers who think the road is theirs.

Well then, maybe we do need driving tests!
I was thinking along Monica's lines of making it simple and cheap.
I suppose there could be a driving test as well as vision/reactions etc!

There could be dedicated centres for the whole lot!

growstuff

But MOnica GP surgeries are stretched enough as it is without having to do goodness how many cognitive tests. I don't know how many people reach 70 every year and still want to drive. About half a million are born every year. Obviously they don't all have a driving licence, but if they are to be tested every couple of years, that's millions of tests every year.

For those of us born between 1945-1970 ( the vast majority on GN), the birth rate was far higher than half a million a year. The full impact will be seen in the next ten to fifteen years as the year l was born, 1964 (l squeezed in in December), there were over a million of us born - the highest number of births ever in a single year. Resources across the board will be stretched to breaking point.

I think a simple cognitive test would be problematic because apart from causing anxiety amongst older people, it would not necessarily be diagnostic or possibly even ethical. Additionally if not carried out by a suitable qualified health practitioner, may require further follow up and support.

A few cognitive tests wouldn't show up true behaviour behind the wheel. Yes to eyesight and reaction times. No to other issues.
As I hinted beforehand I needed to sit in the car with the old person driving to witness any deterioration.
Family members could play a part here initially.

growstuff if this became law then there would probably be some dedicated centres which would be a good idea - with maybe an actual driving test available too.
The cognition tests probably wouldn't need a GP to run them.

It would weed out those with poorer cognition/reaction times which has to be a good thing - and some would probably give up driving voluntarily rather than do it!

The knock on effect would be cheaper insurance premiums.

and so are driving test centres. You do not need to wait 6 months to see your GP but waiting lists for driving tests are far more than 6 months in places and add all the over 0 retests. How often? every 3 years? and driving test lists will be into years.

If young drivers have to wait two ir three years fot tests we will then see an alarming rise in young people driving with no licence, ubtaxed and uninsured. and much more police time will need to be spent running those vans that check speed and whether you are taxed and insured.

Cognitive tests are not difficult to adminster. It would not need a GP, a nurse or medical assistant of some such could administer them.

Whatever you do whether compulsory eyye tests, cognition tests or driving tests it is going to need more staf,.more time, more training.

The solution I have suggested is what I would describe as the minimum cost, minimum time and most efficient alternative to cumbersome retesting that would be immensely disruptive, and would require a major expansion, possibly doubling or more of the driving test infrastructure and very expensive.

But MOnica GP surgeries are stretched enough as it is without having to do goodness how many cognitive tests. I don't know how many people reach 70 every year and still want to drive. About half a million are born every year. Obviously they don't all have a driving licence, but if they are to be tested every couple of years, that's millions of tests every year.

I won't agree with older drivers retaking a test still something is done about young boy racers who are far more dangerous.

We went in a car yesterday driven by a male friend we hadn't seen for a while. He is 75 +. It was like a fairground ride. Too speedy, too jerky, with him snarling at other drivers. It seemed a bit of a macho thing.