Labour caves in to Union demands

TbhI wish they hadn’t got off the blocks but the reality is that they’ve dived off it too fast.They need to take time to reflect.

I think its a case by case question Oreo.

(Junior doctor pay)

What should they have done? Allowed everyone to just strike?

Luckygirl3

Junior doctors, trained by the UK in the UK have been leaving the service for years because their pay and working conditions have been so bad. Whilst at the same time ignoring this problem, the Tories have been denigrating and trying to limit the very immigrants who now dedicate their lives to running the health service in our clinics and hospitals.

Were Labour to do nothing? .... to let the situation continue as their predecessors had?

I think you'll find it's "helping run," not running.!!!

I'm fine with the decision to pay the traindrivers and driver-only trains was wrong. Have you any idea how much Airline pilots are paid? Carrying a lot of passengers is a big responsibility.

Boz

I'm fine with the decision to pay the traindrivers and driver-only trains was wrong. Have you any idea how much Airline pilots are paid? Carrying a lot of passengers is a big responsibility.

Comparing a Train Driver to a Pilot?

A train driver goes along on tracks, observing trackside lights/directives.

A Pilot is 35,000 feet in the air, has to be constantly aware of the space, height, weather conditions etc. etc. …

Well, bully for Labour. It is, after all, supposed to be the workers' party, and your junior doctors are grossly underpaid.

Boz

I'm fine with the decision to pay the traindrivers and driver-only trains was wrong. Have you any idea how much Airline pilots are paid? Carrying a lot of passengers is a big responsibility.

I saw somewhere a list of what other professions are paid.

I think traindrivers are overpaid by a lot.

The article[i will find it] listed what traindrivers have to do. It wasnt a lot compared to other jobs!

www.telegraph.co.uk/money/jobs/career-advice/people-become-train-driver-87k-salary-love-working-alone/

British train driver salaries, which are the highest in Europe, far surpass averages for roles such as: an Army officer (£27,273-£42,009), nurse (£27,055-£40,588), firefighter (£24,191-£32,244) and air traffic control officer (£18,001-£43,469).

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13750091/strike-wage-bump-train-drivers.html

Easy Jet Pilot £43-£85 K

Major Airline (long haul) up to £140 K

Train Driver £45 - £87 K

Source Google

Boz

I'm fine with the decision to pay the traindrivers and driver-only trains was wrong. Have you any idea how much Airline pilots are paid? Carrying a lot of passengers is a big responsibility.

Are you comparing driving, on the ground, on tracks -- to flying in the air? I'd hope air pilots ear a decent wage.

GrannyGravy13

Boz

I'm fine with the decision to pay the traindrivers and driver-only trains was wrong. Have you any idea how much Airline pilots are paid? Carrying a lot of passengers is a big responsibility.

Comparing a Train Driver to a Pilot?

A train driver goes along on tracks, observing trackside lights/directives.

A Pilot is 35,000 feet in the air, has to be constantly aware of the space, height, weather conditions etc. etc. …

That's odd. I thought that most modern aircraft are flown by automatic pilot apart from at takeoff and landing. So, although pilots have to be aware of conditions throughout the flight and alert to notification of changes it takes a considerable amount of physical and mental stress out of the task.

Train drivers need to be physically handling the train all the time as well as being alert to changes in the warning signals and directives. They also have to be aware of the physical conditions on the lines, such as maliciously placed and natural obstacles on the lines.

There is also the additional traumatic possibility of encountering suicides. These may be more common than people realise. In the last 3 months there have been to my knowledge three suicides on the LNER line on the stretch from Newcastle to Darlington alone. We were seriously affected by one and I was horrified to find that they were not exceptional incidents.

I think it's wrong to dismiss train driving as being easy because trains are on tracks...

I'm still not understanding what is so offensive about workers being well paid for responsible jobs.

MaizieD

I'm still not understanding what is so offensive about workers being well paid for responsible jobs.

I am not being offensive about any salary, just pointing out anomalies.

I don’t think anybody said train driving was easy, but they are already paid handsomely.

MaizieD

I'm still not understanding what is so offensive about workers being well paid for responsible jobs.

It's not offensive to be well paid -- people should be paid well in responsible jobs. Lives in their hands/vehicle - pay them well.

MaizieD

GrannyGravy13

Boz

I'm fine with the decision to pay the traindrivers and driver-only trains was wrong. Have you any idea how much Airline pilots are paid? Carrying a lot of passengers is a big responsibility.

Comparing a Train Driver to a Pilot?

A train driver goes along on tracks, observing trackside lights/directives.

A Pilot is 35,000 feet in the air, has to be constantly aware of the space, height, weather conditions etc. etc. …

That's odd. I thought that most modern aircraft are flown by automatic pilot apart from at takeoff and landing. So, although pilots have to be aware of conditions throughout the flight and alert to notification of changes it takes a considerable amount of physical and mental stress out of the task.

Train drivers need to be physically handling the train all the time as well as being alert to changes in the warning signals and directives. They also have to be aware of the physical conditions on the lines, such as maliciously placed and natural obstacles on the lines.

There is also the additional traumatic possibility of encountering suicides. These may be more common than people realise. In the last 3 months there have been to my knowledge three suicides on the LNER line on the stretch from Newcastle to Darlington alone. We were seriously affected by one and I was horrified to find that they were not exceptional incidents.

I think it's wrong to dismiss train driving as being easy because trains are on tracks...

My son lives close to a level crossing and suicides and accidents are far from rare. I can't remember who it was that told me once [there was a train driver at my gym; it might have been him] that people don't realise how suicides affect train drivers; they really struggle to get over it. And also people don't realise how long it takes for a train to stop. With the recent news about attacks on women on trains I'm relieved that the planned closing down of ticket shops on stations and reduction of guards on trains [not sure what is happening about that?] doesn't seem to have happened. If I was travelling alone on a train at night I'd really want someone else to be on that train in an official capacity even if it does reduce any profit the train company might make. I'm sure that's part and parcel of the negotiations.

MaizieD

GrannyGravy13

Boz

I'm fine with the decision to pay the traindrivers and driver-only trains was wrong. Have you any idea how much Airline pilots are paid? Carrying a lot of passengers is a big responsibility.

Comparing a Train Driver to a Pilot?

A train driver goes along on tracks, observing trackside lights/directives.

A Pilot is 35,000 feet in the air, has to be constantly aware of the space, height, weather conditions etc. etc. …

That's odd. I thought that most modern aircraft are flown by automatic pilot apart from at takeoff and landing. So, although pilots have to be aware of conditions throughout the flight and alert to notification of changes it takes a considerable amount of physical and mental stress out of the task.

Train drivers need to be physically handling the train all the time as well as being alert to changes in the warning signals and directives. They also have to be aware of the physical conditions on the lines, such as maliciously placed and natural obstacles on the lines.

There is also the additional traumatic possibility of encountering suicides. These may be more common than people realise. In the last 3 months there have been to my knowledge three suicides on the LNER line on the stretch from Newcastle to Darlington alone. We were seriously affected by one and I was horrified to find that they were not exceptional incidents.

I think it's wrong to dismiss train driving as being easy because trains are on tracks...

How can you possibly compare train drivers to pilots, even with automatic pilot, they still have to take off and land the plane and their training is a lot longer than driving a train. Your argument doesn't hold water.

Also compared to bus drivers who earn considerably less, are not on tracks, also have to be alert to warning signals (traffic lights), be alert to other road users, traffic jams, being public facing (which train drivers are not), I think train drivers have a cushy overpaid job. I certainly don't think they had the public sympathy for their strike as say the junior doctors or nurses

Labour have definitely caved in to the unions. Such an easy 'fix' What happened to the 'black hole'?

I only posted on this thread due to the comparison between a Train Driver and a Pilot.

I will leave it now

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.