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Sick of Starmer relentlessly using the words"difficult " & "painful"

(356 Posts)
mae13 Sat 14-Sept-24 04:32:31

Not for you Sir Keir or Rachel Thieves!

But I expect you know exactly what the words "I am a 5 star liar" mean......

GrannyGravy13 Thu 19-Sept-24 19:18:04

Just because it is what it is doesn’t make it ok, especially when you were elected on your pledge to do away with cronyism and donor gifts!

I was dismayed at the Boris’s tenure, appalled at Truss’s, Sunak tried his best but his party were not behind him.

Starmer, well I was giving him the benefit of the doubt, unfortunately so far it’s just another same old same old government.

Mollygo Thu 19-Sept-24 19:11:30

Have a go at you Casdon? No more than you have a go at me or anyone else who dares to criticise Starmer. But if that’s how you feel . . .

Casdon Thu 19-Sept-24 19:08:05

news.sky.com/story/westminster-accounts-how-to-explore-the-database-for-yourself-12781065

One B Johnson made £6.4million in donations, gifts and other benefits from the 2019 election until he lost his seat. He isn’t included in the figures because he is no longer a MP. The average MP makes £24k. Check it out.

I’m not stupid either eazybee, nor am I denying that some people are genuinely upset and disappointed, and that some are using this as an opportunity to have a go because they ‘didn’t expect anything else’. It’s wrong that Starmer has accepted donations and gifts after criticising Tories for doing the same. That’s not to say he is wrong for accepting them, because it is the norm in Westminster, it is custom and practice. It’s not something I agree with in principle, but it is what it is.

I am sick and tired of the whinges nonetheless, because this is fluff in comparison with the actual business of the government. I know you won’t agree with me, and that Mollygo will have a go at me for not accepting her view of the world either, but that’s my opinion.

eazybee Thu 19-Sept-24 18:16:25

I’m sick and tired of the whinging rather than of Starmer, because he is right. It is going to be difficult and painful.

We are well aware things are going to be difficult; we are not stupid. What you do not seem to be aware of is the fury out there in the electorate, not that things will be difficult, but that the leader who has warned of this has been busy at the same time accumulating as much money and as many gifts for himself on top of a very healthy income as he can, while expecting others to bear the burden.
His Arsenal tickets and his wife's dresses won't redress the balance but they show an appalling lack of leadership by example and contempt for the public.

Mollygo Thu 19-Sept-24 17:35:41

Now it could have cost the country thousands if he hadn’t accepted tickets.

If I don't accept a gift of hospitality, I can't go to a game. You could say: 'Well, bad luck.' That's why gifts have to be registered. But, you know, never going to an Arsenal game again because I can't accept hospitality is pushing it a bit far," he said.

Oh dear, poor Kier.

Sometimes you have to give things you do not need up, for the greater good, is how the withdrawal of WFA for all pensioners is presented.

This would not be so noticeable if there had not been all the complaints about Tory freebies.

BevSec Thu 19-Sept-24 17:03:10

Yes I agree, it is all governments.

Allira Thu 19-Sept-24 16:43:13

BevSec

Allira, well put, it is just like re arranging the deckchairs on the Titanic!

Not just this government, they all think they have to make their mark.

Constantly rearranging everything doesn't always lead to more efficiency and often results in millions or billions of pounds lost in the process.

BevSec Thu 19-Sept-24 16:33:45

Allira, well put, it is just like re arranging the deckchairs on the Titanic!

GrannyGravy13 Thu 19-Sept-24 16:30:09

ronib

GG13 is this for real? 😧

opendemocracy.net

It is all over social media.

I am hoping someone will come on and disprove it 🤷‍♀️

ronib Thu 19-Sept-24 16:18:50

GG13 is this for real? 😧

ronib Thu 19-Sept-24 16:16:44

Dickens I am very surprised to hear this - I thought after Brexit the Uk wasn’t exporting much at all. To see that we are the fourth largest exporter of goods and services is astonishing…..

Dickens Thu 19-Sept-24 16:10:21

ronib

Dickens okay. Maybe we don’t have much stuff to sell/export these days?

In May this year, we were the world's fourth largest exporter of goods and services*, so we certainly do have stuff to sell!

(* SOURCE - "The Conversation - United Kingdom" - a non-profit, limited company and a registered charity.)

From what I can make out though, the goods zone lags behind the services sector.

... and Margaret Thatcher's 'de-industrialisation' of the north / north east means we're no longer big competitors in shipbuilding, steel and mining...

But, yes - we do have stuff to sell.

GrannyGravy13 Thu 19-Sept-24 15:44:51

Oh dear,

ronib Thu 19-Sept-24 14:35:49

Dickens okay. Maybe we don’t have much stuff to sell/export these days?

Dickens Thu 19-Sept-24 14:14:12

Can I make it clear to those who appear to believe that questioning Capitalism automatically assumes Communism or its variants is the only alternative - that there are, in fact, different forms of Capitalism?

Free-Market Capitalism isn't the only form.

Mt61 Thu 19-Sept-24 14:04:30

Allira

^Every five years we have the opportunity for the shop to be under new management. All Starmer is doing is moving the goods around onto different shelves, but it's still the same shop selling the same goods^

Looking around at the world today, it's more like rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

Well put

Dickens Thu 19-Sept-24 14:01:18

ronib

Cuba, North Korea, Laos and a few others are examples of non capitalist countries it seems. Interesting.

hmm... these countries are always touted as the only alternative every time anyone questions Capitalism!

You do realise it's possible to have a mixed-economy - healthy Capitalism and decent social and welfare services?

Capitalism is great for selling stuff, but commoditising essentials like health, water, energy, and other services, impoverishes the nation.

A government should invest in its people, a healthy, well-paid, comparatively content people are good for the economy.

Freya5 Thu 19-Sept-24 13:09:35

Wait for it, nothing definite in the budget yet, but the rumour mill is up and running, and producing results.Letter from my local council re single rate council tax, having to confirm wether I still am. Can imagine some will say yes, when they really aren't, I'm a cynic!!
Awaiting the budget outcome, when singles, wether old or young, will have to pay the same council tax as say, a family of four or more, to their local council.

Mt61 Thu 19-Sept-24 12:51:22

Casdon

I’m sick and tired of the whinging rather than of Starmer, because he is right. It is going to be difficult and painful.

Yes it is because he’s making it difficult & painful.
They can afford to pay these train drivers shit loads, who are already on a massive wage & foreign aid to the tune of millions- where is that going to end up, in some dodgy governments back sack ( pocket)?

GrannyGravy13 Thu 19-Sept-24 12:31:03

nightowl

GrannyGravy that’s great for those from a poor background who have made their fortune. Wonderful that they have made it. The problem is, it leaves a feeling that anyone can do it, and if you don’t then it’s because you didn’t have the ability/ knack/ work ethic or whatever. Many more people don’t make their fortune but work just as hard to keep the wheels turning.

I agree in part, but it is possible.

It is a fact of life that there will always be some that jog along at the bottom of society and I am in favour of a safety net via Government Benefits for them.

I am also in favour of a system that helps them get into paid work, as I think working and provide for yourself and family is beneficial mentally and financially.

Obviously I appreciate that some disabled (mentally and physically) are unable to work, they are in need of family and State support.

TerriBull Thu 19-Sept-24 12:23:28

Whilst I agree at times capitalism lets us down in many respects, particularly with the advent of the new great satans big kids on the block that have emerged, Amazon et al. The communist alternative has never worked, they're all pretty much failed states with very hard line oppressive governments, just look how many people have fled Venezuela. I had an interesting chat with a young Venezuelan guy who was waiting on tables in Seville when we were there, and I remember him telling us how desperate things were there for the ordinary citizen, whilst as ever with those that seize power in such places, Maduro and his corrupt cohorts were living high on the hog, whilst the ordinary citizen barely had enough to eat, we have the watered down version.

Having put my absolute faith in Blair when he swept to power, and ever since thinking we're just let down time and time again with his lies and successive governments, I asked my dear son, is there any politician out there who you feel is " a what you see, is what you get" he replied well "Jeremy (Corbyn) is pretty true to his principles imo, but I know you'd never vote for him" "damn right" said I, "look who he's in thrall to".

nightowl Thu 19-Sept-24 12:19:53

GrannyGravy that’s great for those from a poor background who have made their fortune. Wonderful that they have made it. The problem is, it leaves a feeling that anyone can do it, and if you don’t then it’s because you didn’t have the ability/ knack/ work ethic or whatever. Many more people don’t make their fortune but work just as hard to keep the wheels turning.

Allira Thu 19-Sept-24 12:19:26

Every five years we have the opportunity for the shop to be under new management. All Starmer is doing is moving the goods around onto different shelves, but it's still the same shop selling the same goods

Looking around at the world today, it's more like rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

nightowl Thu 19-Sept-24 12:15:27

ronib I did say I’m not suggesting a revolution. Nor am I suggesting there is a perfect alternative. Please don’t see everything simplistically hmm.

GrannyGravy13 Thu 19-Sept-24 12:12:45

ronib

Cuba, North Korea, Laos and a few others are examples of non capitalist countries it seems. Interesting.

We are fortunate that many of the richest people in the U.K. have come from poor backgrounds.

It is still possible to make your fortune here.

Much preferable to living under a regime like the ones you have mentioned.

I would add China to the list.