What do you hope for in the budget?

Can I make it clear that I do not suggest that working parents don’t nurture their children. The obvious point is that someone has to look after children when parents are working. At great cost to the parents too.
Also the school day ends around 3.30pm.

In reality, most young mothers I meet when out and about with my grandchildren do work. The cost of living under both Conservative and Labour governments means that it is no longer possible for average income families to survive on one income. But again for the wealthy, the choice is there.

ronib

Well if forcing mothers to go to work when they would rather be at home isn’t what you want, why are you suggesting it in essence? Doodledog

I'm not forcing anyone to do anything. What I am saying is that I would like to see the subsidy withdrawn. As it stands, parents who have to work are paying tax so that those who choose not to get their pension contributions paid. When some of those people retire from a lifetime of work they find they don't have enough contributions (eg if they worked term-time and didn't have complete years) whilst those who didn't were credited with full contributions.

Cossy, of course working parents nurture their children (mothers and fathers too). The suggestion that they don't is just designed to insult and get a reaction. Anyway, I am talking about people being at home when their children are at school, not nurseries.

Husbands (or wives if fathers are the main carers) don't pay contributions for their wives. There is no mechanism for that. All income tax is based on earnings, and they pay in accordance with their own salary, not the additional (hypothetical) one of a non-working spouse.

MayBee I agree that funding towards getting the nation healthier would be a good thing. Subsidies on fruit and vegetables would be a good start, I think.

ronib

*Cossy*just one last point - the feral children on the local buses are at secondary schools in a good middle class area. I am aware that the school motto at one school is compassion and kindness.
I might offer to go to the schools to engage with the children on this matter if they want.

I get your unease at the kids on the bus, but whilst I don’t think groups of pubescent teens being noisy, shoving, pushing, entering through the exit doors, is that unusual, not welcomed nor expected. I fully expect their parents, in the main, would also condemn their kids poor behaviour.

I haven’t read the full thread yet, but I heartily endorse this from Doodledog, with a few additions.
I would like to see some announcements about what is not going to happen. If the government doesn't intend to tax holidays and bingo tickets, or means test/take away bus passes or whatever the papers are pretending, I'd like to see that declared at the start, so people actually listen to the budget, and will possibly stop speculating quite so much going forward

Not only would that be a good platform to build on, it would have to be the truth, with no room for backtracking which would immediately be seized upon by anyone with internet access.

Cossyjust one last point - the feral children on the local buses are at secondary schools in a good middle class area. I am aware that the school motto at one school is compassion and kindness.
I might offer to go to the schools to engage with the children on this matter if they want.

Cossy that’s correct. Working mothers can’t nurture their children when they are at work. Someone else has to … logically. The nurturing will be there in out of work time. Hope you understand that?

ronib

Cossy it wasn’t meant to be insulting but I am exasperated by the fact that small children don’t miraculously morph into tax payers. Some care needs to be given by someone along the line and yet it does cost.

It’s OK, but your inference was working mothers don’t nurture their children.

I hope they make it clear how they’re going to make us a healthier nation. I’d like to see them working alongside people like Tim Spector. Jamie Oliver tried to get children eating more healthily but Theresa May wouldn’t have anything to do with him . I know the government have mentioned their long term plans for the nations health. I get reduced membership at my local gym and can use all of their facilities including the sauna and swimming pool for just over £20 a month. I do, sadly realise that a lot of illnesses are just down to bad luck because so many people who lead incredibly healthy lives get ill but it would still save the NHS a vast amount of money if people were more proactive in keeping themselves healthy. And I needs to start from birth ( even before birth). Free breakfasts for all schoolchildren will be a good starting point.

ronib

Doodledog I think the raid on vat and private schools will not result in 6500 extra teachers as in the next budget. So maybe spend it on providing school transport to protect the public and to teach some discipline to the feral children in State schools? BTW the private schools are a world apart in this respect and I think it’s time the State taught real consideration and respect for others.

Goodness, you are on one today!

So I have personal experience of both state and independent education

IMO, there are many independently educated children who can be just as, and sometimes more, ill mannered and badly behaved.

My eldest son attended a very nice, expensive prep school from 3-11.

Our other (different Dad, different circumstances) three children attended our local state school.

Families and parents are all different, irrespective of income, some are very hot on manners, others not so.

My daughter teaches in a Primary School, I can assure you teachers teach their pupils the importance of manners and being kind.

Cossy it wasn’t meant to be insulting but I am exasperated by the fact that small children don’t miraculously morph into tax payers. Some care needs to be given by someone along the line and yet it does cost.

ronib

Well if forcing mothers to go to work when they would rather be at home isn’t what you want, why are you suggesting it in essence? Doodledog

Doesn’t this very much depend on their partners (if there is one) income?

If the state has to fund, then mum’s should be in paid work!

ronib

Doodledog maybe you were unable to nurture and be a stay at home mother? Have you costed extra child care provision into your aim to stop families from organising a home life which is affordable to them?

I find that a bit insulting!

Many of us working mum’s nurtured our children, there’s plenty of evidence of “stay at home” mums not nurturing their children!

I don't mind the idea of the state paying NI contributions for mothers who want to stay at home to bring up their children.
If a man is earning enough for the mother of his children not to take paid work outside the home (I think bringing up children is valuable work, just not paid) he will be earning quite a high salary and his tax and NI payments will also be high. Perhaps greater than the joint contributions of a low paid couple.

I like the idea of children having a diverse range of upbringings, not all from nurseries, particularly when nurseries are regulated by the Government. I think this will give a more balanced population.

All actions have consequences

I don’t think there will be any good news for the ordinary folk ,they will continue to be punished for the last governments mess while energy bosses will continue with the rises and take massive profits and large companies will be subsidised to provide jobs while hiking their profits and avoiding tax .
It’s such a mess and Labour are following the tories on the same austerity route by blaming the wrong people.

Well if forcing mothers to go to work when they would rather be at home isn’t what you want, why are you suggesting it in essence? Doodledog

I am not forcing anyone to do anything 🙄

I am saying what I would like to see in the budget instead of complaining about what I have read, heard or suppose might possibly happen.

Doodledog glad to hear it. So what extra child care support is needed if you are forcing mothers into paid work as opposed to unpaid slavery?

ronib

Doodledog I think the raid on vat and private schools will not result in 6500 extra teachers as in the next budget. So maybe spend it on providing school transport to protect the public and to teach some discipline to the feral children in State schools? BTW the private schools are a world apart in this respect and I think it’s time the State taught real consideration and respect for others.

Ok, you would like to see free transport to state schools in the budget. And maybe more money for state schools to support a citizenship agenda?

Great - some positive ideas. Keep them coming?

ronib

Doodledog maybe you were unable to nurture and be a stay at home mother? Have you costed extra child care provision into your aim to stop families from organising a home life which is affordable to them?

I was perfectly able to nurture my children. My personal circumstances are irrelevant though - I am also perfectly capable of thinking beyond my own four walls.

Doodledog I think the raid on vat and private schools will not result in 6500 extra teachers as in the next budget. So maybe spend it on providing school transport to protect the public and to teach some discipline to the feral children in State schools? BTW the private schools are a world apart in this respect and I think it’s time the State taught real consideration and respect for others.

Dickens

Doodledog

When I’m on my phone I can’t always use the quote facility but in reply to Mt61 above, I also would like to see everyone have to contribute to society in the form of work and taxation. I have also said on this thread that it is wrong that employers get subsidies from working taxpayers that allow them to keep staff on low hours so they don’t have to pay NI or a living wage. It is also wrong that some have to work 40 hours to earn what others get in subsidies when working half of that. It creates divisions and resentments that allow governments and the media to play one group against another.

...also would like to see everyone have to contribute to society in the form of work and taxation

The problem with that is - it's like a form of Communism.

And it takes away personal freedom.

It might seem OK on paper, but I don't think it would work. Everyone, metaphorically, has to pick up a shovel and go to work for a prescribed number of years, either paid or voluntary.

Can you see the very wealthy elite taking part in this?

We'd have to completely restructure society in order for this to happen, to one of state-control.

A form of Communism? Isn't communism an absolute?

I'm not remotely communist. I believe that we should all benefit from our own work and be able to keep our savings, but I also object to state support for some lifestyles over others, particularly when the result of those policies is that the poor are forced to support the better off.

Nobody should be forced to pick up a shovel, but equally, nobody should be able to choose to take from society in the form of NHS care, education, roads, defence etc etc at others' expense. How is that fair?

Doodledog maybe you were unable to nurture and be a stay at home mother? Have you costed extra child care provision into your aim to stop families from organising a home life which is affordable to them?

Cossy

ronib

Cossy okay. I am always more vulnerable when out with my 4 year old….

As I said, we just need to agree to disagree.

I really think that parents and young people get a really bum wrap these days.

I absolutely agree NO ONE should feel vulnerable in their own areas.

I agree too.

But unless people are saying that the police should get more funding in the budget, that is really for a different thread.