Real concern - New white supremacist group in UK

Cumbrianmale
Thousands of Vietnamese people are still being trafficked into this country.
Tragically 39 of them suffocated in the back of a lorry.
Vietnam is one of the top 5 countries mentioned Re immigration into the UK.
Young girls are put to work in nail bars or sex work.
Young men ( and boys) are put to work in cannabis farms

HousePlantQueen

nanna8

I think there is a feeling that the indigenous people are being neglected. Which,in some instances, is probably true.

What is your understanding of "indigenous people"?

Well they are varied indeed- Celts, Romans, Angles, Saxons, Picts (and a few more), a variety of Vikings, Normans, Huguenots, oh, the list is endless. But for some, new waves of immigration became 'non native' as their skin was coloured.

I suppose one of the less well remembered immigrations into this country was the Vietnamese boat people in 1979/80. It was small compared with the previous waves of immigration in the 1960s, but around 50,000 Vietnamese people came to this country. I wonder if many chose Birmingham as their home as I saw several Vietnamese restaurants in the city earlier this year.

I am of good immigrant stocck - half Irish - but I have northern and southern Irish blood and the northeren Irish side has a Scottish surname and would have migrated to Northern Ireland from Scotland after the Flight of the Earls in the early 17th century when the British government offered land in northern Ireland to people of good Protestant stock in the rest of the UK. The offer was mainly taken up by highland Scots, whose living conditions and tenure made anything an improvement.

I think what no one has taken on board in this modern age is that movement of people in large groups from one part of the world to another has been happening throughout human history.

That is now Homo Sapiens became universal, by moving out from Africa to the rest of the world and movement of people has been going on every since, whether it is the movement of the beaker people who brought Bronze technology to Britain, or Vandals, Alanas and Goths whose movement round Eurasia put paid to the Roman empire, or the Mongols, or Vikings and Germanic people coming to Britain after the Romans, or Europeans moving onwards to populate North America and Australia, to the Irish, to those coming to Britain today. It is inevitable and there is little we can do stop it.

At sometime in the future we may see the tide turning as people flee Brtain for whatever reason and start to move eastwards.

Nanna8 is in oz so means aboriginal? Presumably
They’ve been treated appallingly and it’s had generational consequences

I’m relieved others are asking nanna8 what she means by Indigenous people. My understanding was as Wyllow sets iut at 20.31 today yet my reading of nanna’s comment suggested she meant white British in the UK. We surely all know we are a country of mixed heritage. Our family history on dad’s side goes back to 1640, my dna says French, Danish, Northern European, Irish and Scottish which sounds about right,

I’m not convinced by the people who claim no one listens to them, they shouted loud and clear after the Southport murders

Went googling and found

"The preference is to use 'First Nations people', 'Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people(s)', or 'Indigenous Australians'. Choose one and stay consistent, including in data tables and graphs. Use capital letters, it's a noun – First Nations, Aboriginal Australian, Indigenous Australian, Torres Strait Islander."

www.apsc.gov.au/working-aps/diversity-and-inclusion/diversity-inclusion-news/first-nations-vocabulary-using-culturally-appropriate-language-and-terminology#:~:text=The%20preference%20is%20to%20use,Indigenous%20Australian%2C%20Torres%20Strait%20Islander.

But the question of what nanna remains confusing to me.

M0nica

MayBee70 The proper description of the people who lived in Australia before the Europeans arrived is 'Indigenous people'.

This also applies to the indigenous people in North America and other countries. The use of names like 'aborigine' 'red indians', 'pygmies'. Is now no longer acceptable because of the negative assumptions about the people being called by those names is so institutionalised.

So can nanna 8 explain who she means by indigenous people?

Cossy

Cumbrianmale56

The problem is people are becoming increasingly turned off by the failed two main parties and their useless leaders and broken promises. I for one would never vote Conservative ot Labour again as they have no answers and never do much in office.

Don’t you think, despite a terrible start, we should at least give this govt 12 months?

I suppose a lot can happen in the next 4 years. I would hope inflation stays low, wages rise, there is a house building programme and the economy grows steadily. These sort of things tend to keep extremists at bay and stop polarised arguments. However, time will tell and the government so far has proved to be just as unpopular as the one before.

MayBee70 The proper description of the people who lived in Australia before the Europeans arrived is 'Indigenous people'.

This also applies to the indigenous people in North America and other countries. The use of names like 'aborigine' 'red indians', 'pygmies'. Is now no longer acceptable because of the negative assumptions about the people being called by those names is so institutionalised.

eggplant

*indigenous people are being persecuted*

Persecuted? How exactly? Ignored, excluded, left behind, undervalued. Yes I see that.

How is any of this connected with immigration?

I can’t work out if you’re really this naive or goading.

HousePlantQueen

nanna8

I think there is a feeling that the indigenous people are being neglected. Which,in some instances, is probably true.

What is your understanding of "indigenous people"?

Aborigines?

biglouis

*Perhaps they feel ignored and threatened. Perhaps they feel there are not enough jobs available for them. Perhaps they feel no one listens to them. Perhaps they feel other groups are being favoured and given more than they are. Perhaps they feel indigenous people are being persecuted and they are treated more harshly than non indigenous people*

All of this>

And this is exactly the propaganda that Reform uses.

nanna8

I think there is a feeling that the indigenous people are being neglected. Which,in some instances, is probably true.

What is your understanding of "indigenous people"?

not knowing what an MP does, or even a local councillor does?

Well that’s risible in some cases Wyllow hence some folk/voters feeling disenfranchised. Remember Brexit? Red Wall voters lending their votes to see it actioned? Then ‘said MPs’ a merry band of rogues indeed of all stripes going against their constituency majorities and not only ignoring their wishes but actively standing up in the HoC to promote thwarting them. I do!

And then we wonder why the people feel the need to form groups to take action.

I do not condone them. But I can understand their frustration when politicians promise stuff then swivel 180° once they are comfortably ensconced!

It is scarey that these groups are here & gaining such support. I do think some political/ economic awareness classes in schools would be good. My parents were, I guess racist in that they looked down on people of colour, but in their defence they didn't know any individuals.I always challenged their views, due to a grammar school that encouraged me to think for myself, made me aware there's propoganda all around, & "never to believe unquestioningly what you read in the paper". Which my mum still does. There have been many equal opportunities initiatives in the last 40 years, and that's helped some disavantaged citizens, but the ones that have had no initiatives at all seem to me to be white, male young people (not so young now some of them) from working class areas that by & large did not manage to "get on their bike" like Thatcher thought they should, & have seen an ever-increasing opportunities gap since.

It is very worrying I do think social media has a hand in this.

I'm not really sure how much genuine white supremacy groups - such as the one in the O/P - have ever paid much attention to what the major parties do.

For a start, they wouldn't countenance any party that has any people of colour or are Jewish in them, nor do they give much thought to women except as Andrew Tate would have us. They'd like gun ownership.
The O/P brings to attention that these groups now have international contacts and manipulation never possible before SM.

Cumbrianmale56

The problem is people are becoming increasingly turned off by the failed two main parties and their useless leaders and broken promises. I for one would never vote Conservative ot Labour again as they have no answers and never do much in office.

Don’t you think, despite a terrible start, we should at least give this govt 12 months?

The problem is people are becoming increasingly turned off by the failed two main parties and their useless leaders and broken promises

Agreed.

The problem is people are becoming increasingly turned off by the failed two main parties and their useless leaders and broken promises. I for one would never vote Conservative ot Labour again as they have no answers and never do much in office.

Aldom

'The only thing necessary for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing'.

👏👏👏👏

Cumbrianmale56

It's interesting that young people seem to be drifting to the Right after the Corbyn era, when the majority of first time voters voted Labour and there was considerable support among the under 25s for Jeremy Corbyn. Now that this era has passed and it's probably a distant memory for first time voters, Reform are now the second most popular party among under 25s. Also apathy is another big issue with this age group as half never bothered to vote at the last election.
Maybe another thing that might be radicalising teenage boys in particular is the EDI culture most schools seem to be promoting that probably leaves many of them cold. I did hear someone of school age referring to a rainbow flag at school as a f----t flag.

I do think an awful lot depends on both parental and peer pressure.

Reform paint a great picture of how our lives would be under them, if only it was true!

Totally uncosted policies and pie in the sky comments about immigration and stopping the small boats, then our country will be great again.

As for pushing the EDI culture, it’s shameful if has to be pushed! With two gay daughters, autism and mental health conditions in our immediate family, my children have been subjected to discrimination in both their schooling and at work, this shouldn’t still be happening in our (so called) civilised society.

I don’t know what the answers are, but I’d hate to go backwards in terms of Equality, Diversity and Inclusion.

Trump seems hell bent on taking the USA backwards, let’s not do the same.

It's interesting that young people seem to be drifting to the Right after the Corbyn era, when the majority of first time voters voted Labour and there was considerable support among the under 25s for Jeremy Corbyn. Now that this era has passed and it's probably a distant memory for first time voters, Reform are now the second most popular party among under 25s. Also apathy is another big issue with this age group as half never bothered to vote at the last election.
Maybe another thing that might be radicalising teenage boys in particular is the EDI culture most schools seem to be promoting that probably leaves many of them cold. I did hear someone of school age referring to a rainbow flag at school as a f----t flag.

In the context of the British Isles, who would you consider to be indigenous? For how long would your bloodline have to have lived here?