The former prime minister of New Zealand has been made a Dame by the Prince of Wales despite being a republican.

Rosie: "You do realise that the vast majority of transwomen never undergo any surgery, most are far too attached to their penises?There have been less than 9000 GRC issued in the UK ."

Rosie, I respect your right to your feelings and opinions but just wanted to comment on a possible factual confusion. The GRC is granted to trans people regardless of surgical status (they only have to have lived as the other gender for 2 years), and many people who have had gender surgery do not apply for the GRC so the statistics of these two situations are not actually linked. Typically people apply for a GRC if they want to marry as the other gender (ie be Husband rather than Wife) or if they have a burning desire to get their birth certificate changed. The majority of trans people don't need these things so GRC numbers will never give an idea of actual number of transgender people.

In any community or organisation sadly there will be some rotten apples as they say, but the majority of us are as responsible, caring and law-abiding as any normal member of society

My daughter lives in NZ and we visit her and talk to other people whilst we’re there. It’s correct that Jacinda Ardern is not so well thought of in NZ, hence the change of government in the last election. She resigned a while before the election; she probably realised that the winds of change were blowing. She certainly didn’t help the economy with her over prescriptive lockdown, and many people are not happy about that.

If you’ve not visited NZ, it’s absolutely huge, with a tiny population. For comparison Auckland has a population of just over a million and a half, whilst London has nearly ten million. Wellington, the capital city of NZ, has a population of only a little over 200,000 thousand. The lockdown in NZ was only able to be so strict because of the comparatively isolated position of the country. However the benefits or otherwise of lockdowns are a subject that could make a thread of its own, because anyway, lockdown did not appear to be the only cause of discontent with her government, according to people we have spoken to.

It’s very easy to wax lyrical about a political leader in a country that is twelve thousand miles away, takes a minimum of 24 hours to travel to, and who has no direct effect on your life, particularly if that leader has politics that you agree with. There’s nothing that can beat the real life experience of travelling there, and talking to the the real people who live there. That way, you learn much.

It’s very easy to wax lyrical about a political leader in a country that is twelve thousand miles away, takes a minimum of 24 hours to travel to, and who has no direct effect on your life, particularly if that leader has politics that you agree with. There’s nothing that can beat the real life experience of travelling there, and talking to the the real people who live there. That way, you learn much.

👏👏👏

Allira

No-one is nasty
We are not all alike.

But understand biological fact

Being accused of being ‘nasty’ seems a common theme on this forum if anyone dares to disagree and it’s taken personally.
Beyond bizarre.

A PM saying ‘Be kind’ is also bizarre, it’s a position of leadership not a knitting circle.

Interesting Maddyfour I knew NZ had a very small population but didn’t realise how small.

Oreo

A PM saying ‘Be kind’ is also bizarre, it’s a position of leadership not a knitting circle.

Visions of crafters sitting poking each other with knitting needles - "She's needling me, Miss"

And is utterly utterly meaningless. One persons 'kindness' is another persons 'cruelty'.

Oreo

Interesting Maddyfour I knew NZ had a very small population but didn’t realise how small.

The only traffic jam we came across was in Auckland but drive a few minutes and you were out in the countryside 🙂

😁Never annoy a woman holding a knitting needle.

Wasn't there a Death in Paradise where a knitting needle was the weapon of choice?

julieray

I was on holiday in New Zealand this time last year and was shocked by how different our perception of her was to theirs. I didn’t meet one person who could say a good word about her - and we travelled right across both islands. A common theme was that her husband was allegedly involved with some shady people. Its a shame as she was someone I admired albeit from the other side of the world

I have some friends in NZ, they do still like JA, they agree the lockdown resulted in some economic damage and don’t agree with the length of it, but in other ways they found her to visible and compassionate and straight to the point.

I have to agree with their views.

Oreo

A PM saying ‘Be kind’ is also bizarre, it’s a position of leadership not a knitting circle.

Actually disagree and applaud someone holding high level positions advocating this, to me kindness is akin to fairness and acceptance.

Better to advocate being kind than some of the utter twaddle some of our leaders have come out with over the years!!

Oh I expect she came out with a fair bit of twaddle herself over the years.

Saying be kind is what’s said to kids.Being kind is up to the individual, it’s easy to go round saying it.

Everyone has their own interpretation of kindness which renders the phrase meaningless. Many think its kind to champion sex work, many think its cruelty, many think it's kind to pretend men are wonen, many think its cruel. What it generally means is think like I think.

We met up with our NZ friends who live in Auckland a couple of years ago, and their opinions of JA were pretty much an echo of those posted by Maddyfour and Cossy, particularly in relation to the lockdown.

Yes TerriBull, it appears that the lockdown was not well thought of in NZ, but many here thought it was the best way forward. As I said up thread, lockdown as a way to control a virus is worthy of it’s own thread, and not only do people hold different views, many people have changed their views since the pandemic.

My own judgement is that people in NZ were fed up of JA, and possibly that was at least in part, brought about because of the very strict lockdown. Nonetheless she their PM for a time, and was in power during Covid. With regard to the Damehood, I’m unsure exactly why she has been awarded it. Do all PMs get an honour in NZ? I don’t know the answer to that, but it’s possibly the usual thing to do. Otherwise I’m not sure exactly why she’s got it. It certainly can’t be because she once said ‘be kind.’

It’s a bit hypocritical to accept it if she believes NZ should ultimately become a republic, but I find that little different to all the lords and ladies sitting in the House of Lords, but who actually disagree with royalty and titles!

Now I must get on with finishing the lunch because the family will be arriving soon (obviously not the ones who live in NZ) The Great South Run was cancelled today due to bad weather and so we’ll cheer them up with a bit of home cooking. No doubt, as ever, our much missed family in NZ will be one topic of conversation. (Last year they were here and all three ran The Great South Run.) That was a lovely day.

Well this is very Northern of me, but I had no idea that there is a Great South Run, how insular of me. So sorry it was cancelled. I watched the start of the Great North Run in Sept as my son was running, it poured!

Some apparently did the run anyway, despite storm Ashley which was the reason for the cancellation. Conditions were awful, but not quite as dangerous as was predicted I think.

julieray

I was on holiday in New Zealand this time last year and was shocked by how different our perception of her was to theirs. I didn’t meet one person who could say a good word about her - and we travelled right across both islands. A common theme was that her husband was allegedly involved with some shady people. Its a shame as she was someone I admired albeit from the other side of the world

I can't imagine going halfway round the world to holiday in a country which I've heard is very beautiful and spending my time discussing a previous prime minister.

I suppose we all enjoy different things but I don't think I've ever holidayed in another country and talked to people about their politicians.

theworriedwell NZ people seem to talk to everybody about everything. I remember going to buy some flowers, and after 5 minutes the florist (lovely young woman) had told us all about her recent hospitalisation!

I didn’t know the Prince of Wakes could make anyone a dame. I thought it was the prerogative of the King and his parliament.

Chardy

theworriedwell NZ people seem to talk to everybody about everything. I remember going to buy some flowers, and after 5 minutes the florist (lovely young woman) had told us all about her recent hospitalisation!

Not quite the same as a discussion about your feelings about the former PM, she wasn't even the last PM was she. Are any of us really spending time talking to tourists about Liz Truss?

I think everyone should like or dislike individual people not just like or dislike everyone because they are in a certain group, ethnicity or gender. If someone is a nice, kind person I like them, if they are mean, spiteful hurtful people I don't.
I actually know 3 transgender people and all have had surgery. One deeply regrets it, the others don't.
Recent research surveying trans people found 80% had pain for 5years after trans surgery. Also 50% regret having trans surgery.