Assisted dying bill

biglouis...I respect your right in the method you choose to end your life, but finding somebody who has committed suicide is quite traumatic.

The concoction needed is 3/4 of a pint of very caustic fluids, which need to be taken quickly, I saw yesterday.

It's important that people also know the facts regarding this, so that they don't imagine floating gently away.

BTW, I pay about £40 a year, and if ever- proper support before and on the day, would be totally free, and in my own home, or in hospital or Care Home or palliative care centre. With every single safeguard, interviews before and on the day recorded, and me accepting the deed would be final also recorded, and handed to police and the Judge straight after.

I have made advanced directives too, my GP has a copy, and so has my DH and our solicitor.

biglouis

I believe passionately in the right to end my own life and have enough barbiturates to do it several times over. I dont need to go to court and ask doctors and judges to authorize it.

When the time comes I will make my own arrangements. When you live alone its not a problem as you dont involve anyone else and put them at risk. You just tell people your going away for a few days. The great thing about mobiles is that no one knows where you are calling from. So you can tell them you arrived safely at "your friends" house. By the time they realise they havnt heard back from you the deed is done.

I respect that. Most people do not have access to barbiturates however, and the method they choose often involves others unfortunately, who have to live with it for the rest of their life (train drivers come to mind). And 'home made' methods, which will probably involve family finding them- and they have to live with those images and feelings forever.

If I ever feel that there is no onger hope, but just more pain and more loss of dignity- I'd want my children to have the choice to be there or not, and would never want them to find me (will not use describing words here). We have always been open in our family- and we have discussed the 'what ifs' with our ACs and older teenage GCs- and they all totally respect our wishes and agree.

Fortunately, this choice would be open to us, in our own home, and just as we would wish. They have said they would wish to accompany us, but of course could change their mind, which we would respect.

I hope to die in my sleep, but knowing that the choice would be mine if ever - is a huge relief. DH feels the same, and he has seen some truly awful deaths in his past career.

My father died of terminal cancer aged 55. He was in hospital and a room was put aside for us to stay in. I was visiting him when he had a fit and was told that he probably would die that night.In fact he last for 7 days and we took it in turns to be with him.

This was 40 years ago and I still remember that week. When the morphine wore off he would be distressed until given another a dose. He was like a bag of bones. I think that in the end the doctors did over dose him. The notes on the end of the bed said "Family TLC" and the staff were certainly very kind to us.

For myself, whether palliative care was excellent or not, if I had a terminal illness with a short time left to me, I would want to end my life. The life force varies so much from person to person that we cannot say definitively what should happen to everyone but each person should have a choice.

When my FIL reached 90, having been widowed some years before, he suddenly said that there should be a dispenser where you could put in some money and receive the appropriate drug. He was not ill at that point but a year or so later he was discovered that he had cancer, related to asbestos from WW2. The doctors wanted to do more tests and were shocked when we said no. There is no point in putting him through further treatment at his age. He certainly didn't want it.

I believe passionately in the right to end my own life and have enough barbiturates to do it several times over. I dont need to go to court and ask doctors and judges to authorize it.

When the time comes I will make my own arrangements. When you live alone its not a problem as you dont involve anyone else and put them at risk. You just tell people your going away for a few days. The great thing about mobiles is that no one knows where you are calling from. So you can tell them you arrived safely at "your friends" house. By the time they realise they havnt heard back from you the deed is done.

Anniebach

It is deliberate killing, a person wants to die so their life will be
taken

The idea is that the person will self administer the necessary drug. At the moment is intended for those with 6 months or less to live and so many life threatening diseases are excluded.

I would far rather they get the current system up to standard, no one should die in pain, the drugs are available to prevent this.

I don't think they are made available all the time; there are too many reports of agonizing deaths to believe this. And what if a person is feeling so much pain that the dose to alleviate it would hasten their end? The patient would be refused it if this bill doesn't go through.

And don't forget there are some cancers where the drugs just don't work - bone cancer, or when a cancer spreads to the bones, for example. Palliative care isn't the answer for a lot of people. So they should have the choice.

There are other factors, too. I had breast cancer 15 years ago now. I went for a chemo session and on my way in to the hospital, saw a woman outside clinging on to her drip chatting to her friend. She was Green. It reminded me of when I came round from my op - some of my skin was green and the nurse told me it was just a reaction to the morphine.

This led me to assume I would go green if I was ever in that woman's position, dying and hooked up to morphine. And it horrified me that my grandchildren would see me green.

Besides the pain, I don't want that to happen. No few months longer left on earth would be worth that.

AGAA4- I am so so sorry you had to witness you father is such pain and that the morphine didn't help in the end.

But I truly do not understand your last sentence at all. Sincerely and with all my heart, I do not. Why?

Fleurpepper

One aspect which is rarely discussed, is the fact that once people know they will eventually have the choice, and especially without the need to be fit enough to travel to Switzerland, they will very often actually choose to live longer, to bear with the pain and loss of dignity longer- safe in the knowledge that the final choice will be theirs, if, and when. The fear of a horrible, painful death, and long period of extreme loss of quality of life and dignity- is taken away, and allows to sustain the above much longer than otherwise.

Exactly, that is a very good point indeed. And of course, not everyone has the financial means to be able to go down the Switzerland route.

I saw my DH suffer in agony with secondary bone cancer. The morphine didn't help. Whether he would have chosen to die sooner I will never know but he may have decided to do that to end our suffering. He knew that we were all going through hell with him. I'm glad that he didn't have the option to end his own life.

One aspect which is rarely discussed, is the fact that once people know they will eventually have the choice, and especially without the need to be fit enough to travel to Switzerland, they will very often actually choose to live longer, to bear with the pain and loss of dignity longer- safe in the knowledge that the final choice will be theirs, if, and when. The fear of a horrible, painful death, and long period of extreme loss of quality of life and dignity- is taken away, and allows to sustain the above much longer than otherwise.

Freya5

Smileless2012

It has nothing to do with deliberately killing anyone and no doctor would be forced into taking part against their wishes.

Well what would you call it. So who will "volunteer"
Euthanasia
"Depending on the circumstances, euthanasia is regarded as either manslaughter or murder. The maximum penalty is life imprisonment."
From NHS site on this subject.

No-one, as it will have to be self administered.

Anniebach

Very much mine GrannyGravy, a widow/widower moves into a nursing home, their house will be sold !

That happens anyway at the moment, so I'm not sure what that has to do with assisted dying. Having had to watch both my mother and mother in law die long, slow drawn-out deaths from dementia, it is not something I would wish to put my own children through. We do not allow our beloved pets to go on suffering when there is no hope left - in fact, to do so would be classed as neglect - so why do we find it acceptable to allow humans to suffer? Excellent palliative care is, as others have said, a bit of a lottery, and under the proposals, no medical professional would actually be 'killing' anyone. I am totally in favour of this. If I could have put my mother out of her misery, I would have. Should I find myself in that position, I'd like the option to die with dignity.

I plan to horde as much prescription medication as I can in case this bill doesn’t get through. I might in any case as it only covers terminal illness and not living with intolerable suffering.
I believe strongly that I have the right to end my own life if it becomes unbearable. I love life but fear dying slowly and in fear even more. There are clearly enough safeguards in the bill that people aren’t coerced and request to end their lives of their own free will.
I’ve seen both parents linger and suffer and I don’t want to do that to my daughter.

Very much mine GrannyGravy, a widow/widower moves into a nursing home, their house will be sold !

Anniebach

There will be strict rules, have rules never been broken ?

That is my fear Annie

There will be strict rules, have rules never been broken ?

The thinking behind the bill is that people shouldn't have an either/or situation.

They shouldn't have to feel that death is a better option than being pain-free, comfortable, and suffering.

It should be an option alongside excellent palliative care.

If only...

I wish I had your trust in the NHS here in the U.K. Fleurpepper

There have been far too many cases of doctors, nurses and other healthcare professionals being anything but professional. I personally have little trust that there would not be coercion in some circumstances.

Each time there is a case against a hospital, doctor, nurse the same old phrase is trotted out lessons will be learnt unfortunately to date they haven’t been.

I would far rather they get the current system up to standard, no one should die in pain, the drugs are available to prevent this.

Excellent palliative care is a lottery. I want to be able to make my own decisions about the end of life. I support the Bill but I would like to see the 6 months life expectancy clause removed. I reject any religious control of people's end of life choice.

Smileless2012

It has nothing to do with deliberately killing anyone and no doctor would be forced into taking part against their wishes.

Well what would you call it. So who will "volunteer"
Euthanasia
"Depending on the circumstances, euthanasia is regarded as either manslaughter or murder. The maximum penalty is life imprisonment."
From NHS site on this subject.

Rosie51

While I understand the feelings behind those who fully support this bill, does it not concern you, even a teeny tiny bit, that some people may be pressured, coerced, or just feel they are such a burden, into taking this route?
From what I understand the patient is going to have to be able to administer the lethal dose to themself, so not respite from suffering for those physically unable to do so.
Canada is indeed a very worrying example. The numbers applying, or being offered MAID, is increasing at an alarming rate.

For those withsuch physical disability that they cannot reach, hold and swallow the drug- a drip can be put up and a tiny gesture from the patient can activate it.

No-one, but no-one, is talking about a Canada style option.

keepingquiet

The bill is 47 pages long! It is badly conceived and I will be writing to my MP to vote against it.

No one should die a painful death, but there are no guarantees in this life. Even assissted dying can go wrong.

We have to work harder to improve palliative care, to respect the sanctity of human life and to see death as a natural process and not a production line.

The bill is horrible, insidious and poorly thought out.

No doctor can say whether someone has one day or six months to live. It's madness.

How can assisted dying go wrong if properly done? Can you give any links to any real exemple?

And no, Annie, this is not 'killing someone', it is supporting and assisting someone, who has made a clear and final decision about the amount of suffereing they can continue to take- to do it themselves, safely and properly, rather than in the terrible ways we know some people take when there is no safe, supported options.

Forcing someone to live with unbearable pain, even with the best of paliative care, knowing it will get worse, and in some instances will result in choking to death- as no sanctity or dignity. It is just inhumane and cruel.

Doctors are perfectly able to give a fairly accurate estimation- and it will be entirely a choice, for the person themselves.

A few years ago I would have strongly disagreed with this - but having listened to my mother begging to be allowed to die I have changed my mind. She is paralysed due to a stroke, can do nothing for herself and has no quality of life or dignity. Unfortunately as she now has advanced dementia even if this becomes law she would not be considered mentally competent enough to make the decision, so her suffering will continue