The Farmers Fight

Seems to me that people are very vocal in their support of the farmers. And yet many of the people who clapped for NHS workers during the pandemic are complaining about the fact that the Labour government have given them a much needed pay increase. There are some strange double standards going on here.

Well said maybee
Miners, steelworkers and wrecked communities

It’s because we rely on farmers to provide our food.

I didn’t complain about doctors being given a much deserved rise. It was years overdue.

MayBee70

Seems to me that people are very vocal in their support of the farmers. And yet many of the people who clapped for NHS workers during the pandemic are complaining about the fact that the Labour government have given them a much needed pay increase. There are some strange double standards going on here.

Are these the same many of the people?

Or different many of the people?

Do posters keep a tally of who said what so they can compare what they said in different situations or is it an unfounded generalisation?

There are some strange double standards going on here

Unless posters keep spreadsheets of who said what how can they possibly know?

It was some people the other day.
Are some people the same ones as many of the people?

Just curious.

Why is being supportive of one section of the U.K. who produce upwards of 54% of our food make posters assume that I do not support other sectors?

For what it’s worth I think closing Port Talbot before the new eco blast furnace is up and running foolhardy. All this has done is increase our carbon footprint and line the pockets of other countries, along with job losses.

If I remember correctly the current Labour Government have vetoed any new mines along with drilling for gas and oil in order to reach net zero. Again we shall be importing these resources adding to our carbon footprint not decreasing it in the short term along with job losses.

The Doctors needed a pay rise, but they are not gods, they are human like the rest of us and chose their profession.

(My neighbours one side are NHS nurse and high management, we clapped the first week of lockdown and then stopped as their house was party central, dope smoking in the garden so much so we had to keep our GSs bedroom window closed during hot nights, BBQ’s with folks who definitely did not live there, I could go on but you get the picture)

Why is being supportive of one section of the U.K. who produce upwards of 54% of our food make posters assume that I do not support other sectors?

Because it is a simplistic and unfounded assumption, GrannyGravy.

Assumptions do not make a truth.

Allira I love this "spreadsheet of views" idea!

I just remember what people say, particularly when it’s something interesting or outrageous, I would think most people do, because there are many posters common on thread covering similar topics.

Well, without re reading everything I’ve read today I’m sure that someone accused the government of being weak and just caving into the health workers demands for a pay increase.

NotSpaghetti

Allira I love this "spreadsheet of views" idea!

I can hardly keep up with names, let alone who said what, NotSpaghetti!

Re Tata steel in S Wales: the decision to close down the two old furnaces in January 2024 was made a long time ago, because it had planned to open the new eco blast furnace (ie "electric arc furnaces" instead.

Unfortunately those planners for the eco blast furnace had not in their planning calculated whether our National Grid could supply enough power for their running.

It does not, and Tata steel could not predict whether it could.

*This was all done before the current government, including of course the closing of the old furnaces Jan 2024 as above which could have been kept going

had someone actually asked the question about the national grid.

Wyllow3 it does seem rather lapse by all concerned not to have covered supply of electricity in a due diligence survey.

Re Tata steel in S Wales: the decision to close down the two old furnaces in January 2024 was made a long time ago, because it had planned to open the new eco blast furnace (ie "electric arc furnaces" instead.
It was rushed in the end. The old furnaces should not have been closed until the new one was in commission.

Even then, redundancies were inevitable.

Coal, steel, other industries will come and go over centuries but food (and water) is essential to all life on earth.

Yes Allira what it does make me think re food, (bearing in mind all the discussions posted above re only larger farm units often being viable nowadays because of pressure from supermarkets/prices forced down, and the heavy imports of food we have)

That we need proper food policy instead of it just carrying on in the current pattern.

I suppose the powers that be could have foreseen that Tata was on borrowed time and attempted to put other employment opportunities in place.

I think the majority of farmers are being hoodwinked by the celebrity 'farmers'. Clarkson quite openly said he was buying land to avoid IHT. He is a hobby farmer at best. Dyson and his ilk don't farm their land, so it is not producing any food. The top ten land owners are dukes, not farmers. I have a great deal of sympathy for farmers who have been dealt badly by big supermarkets and who work very long hours at a hard and isolating job. Clarkson and Farage aren't fit to lick their wellies.

The old style furnaces will need to stay for some time in other places - look at this article on Scunthorpe - which includes just how long it could be till the National Grid is connected there, 2032.
www.energylivenews.com/2024/10/07/uk-green-steel-switch-to-electric-furnaces-delayed-until-2032/

The ownership of Steel is a curious one in this country - Sheffield Forgemasters for example is owned by the MOD (bought in 2021) and likely to be protected - Scunthorpe by a Chinese country

"

Grandmabatty

I think the majority of farmers are being hoodwinked by the celebrity 'farmers'. Clarkson quite openly said he was buying land to avoid IHT. He is a hobby farmer at best. Dyson and his ilk don't farm their land, so it is not producing any food. The top ten land owners are dukes, not farmers. I have a great deal of sympathy for farmers who have been dealt badly by big supermarkets and who work very long hours at a hard and isolating job. Clarkson and Farage aren't fit to lick their wellies.

Not all the case, Dyson does farm and farms very profitably, quote from upthread repeated:

but note - the cost of this success has been the loss of goodness how many small farms that used to be there

"Dyson Farming made a pre-tax profit of £5.2m in the year to 31 December 2023, up by £527,000 on the previous year.

Sir James Dyson’s farming business also increased its turnover by 16% to total £40.6m, according to the company’s accounts, with arable farming continuing to be the principal business activity.

It classes itself as the UK’s largest farming business, covering 14,600ha of farmland across Lincolnshire, Oxfordshire, West Berkshire, Somerset and Gloucestershire

The enterprise typically produces 40,000t of wheat, 9,000t of spring barley, 12,000t of potatoes, 29,000t of sugar beet and 1,250t of strawberries, alongside 2,000 sheep and 800 cattle".

Clarkson's business, yes is a hobby farm with visitors coming for the "Clarkson experience"

grannyGravy. True doctors are not gods and chose their profession, - as do farmers

My apologies for incorrect information regarding Dyson. I still think the majority of farmers won't actually be affected by this because their farms are significantly smaller than the large farms targeted.

Dyson doesn’t “farm” - he owns a huge amount of land which other people farm.

Could the farmers make a case for the agricultural land to be revalued? Surely if , say, land worth three million pounds can't provide a decent income from farming, then it is not worth three million pounds.
If farmers could demonstrate that they do actually, properly use the land to produce food, but they can't make a decent living from it, is there any way they could ask for a revaluation? Then that would reduce their liability for inheritance tax.

If we are looking at the future of farming and food security I'm afraid that the Dyson model is probably the one we have to follow. I'm sure it's been happening for quite a long time, small, unprofitable farms being swallowed up by bigger ones. Which isn't preserving the 'way of life' which is being extolled on here...

The only way I can see it changing is if the removal of the tax dodge by way of IHT makes land less attractive as a means of avoiding IHT and brings the absolutely crazy price of farmland down. And farmers start to be paid the better price for the food they produce.

Are supermarkets and big food processors making excessive profits on the back of paying farmers for their produce at prices which barely cover the cost of production is another question that has to be asked.

vegansrock

Dyson doesn’t “farm” - he owns a huge amount of land which other people farm.

But it appears to be farmed according to his directions.