Why do you support Labour?

I have found several threads attacking Labour "goady" and one particularly offensive one is still running.

I’d like you to show me an instance where my head is in the sand?

I’m not aware that I am guilty of that offence?

Whitewavemark2

I am pleased to see so many positive replies.

Sometimes the negativity on this forum is depressing, and I wonder at such short memories.

Positive, or trying to be but don’t put your head in the sand as the Government has done quite a few stupid things too in the six months in power.I’m puzzled as to why they have and hoping it’s not general incompetence.

LizzieDrip

^For a 'new' poster (as far as I'm aware) talk about 'jump right in'^

Rosie why shouldn’t a new poster be able to express their views immediately? GN is an open forum; all posters have equal rights, no matter how long they’ve contributed. There’s no hierarchy.

TBH, one of the things that bothers me about GN is the ‘clique’ mentality of a few posters (particularly on the N&P thread). On occasions it feels like ‘playground bullying’.

“And yet you’re still here” I’m sure someone will respond

New posters can contribute just like anyone else,but starting lots of threads with goady undertones, or even overtones is a red flag.
The moderators don’t take things down for fun and in that instance were spot on.

I support Labour because in childhood I was educated as a liberal Christian.

I am pleased to see so many positive replies.

Sometimes the negativity on this forum is depressing, and I wonder at such short memories.

FlitterMouse

I am an old-school Marxist-socalist so the Labour Party, as it is now, is not what I would want ideally but it is better than the alternatives. I wanted Labour to win the election. My heart is with the genuine compassion of the LibDems but Ed Davey does not have the steel necessary to lead a country whereas I think Starmer does.

I voted tactically last July to unseat a Tory who supported Truss but at the same time I was confident I was voting for the best candidate, a Lib Dem with long experience in local government who continues to work hard in Westminster for our constituency. Labour hadn’t won this prosperous seat since 1946 and didn’t put up a strong candidate.

Rousseau famously wrote:

Man was born free, and everywhere he is in chains. The English people believes itself to be free; it is gravely mistaken; it is free only during the election of Members of Parliament; as soon as the Members are elected, the people is enslaved; it is nothing.

I think that’s what many people think at the moment - not really knowing what Labour stands for after some early decisions that have left people concerned, decisions which seem far removed from the ethos of my heroes, Attlee, Bevan and Tony Benn - but I accept that government now is at the mercy of the Treasury and financial markets and needs to be prudent.

What I would really like to see longer-term is an end to the dominance of the two major political parties so that we have more cross-party collaboration. That is when Parliament is at it’s best, when MPs are working together, not opposing for the sake of it.

I would like an end to FPTP and implementation of the Alternative Vote system that we rejected in 2011. LibDems are most people’s second favourite party so they would win more seats. Reform is the least popular of all the parties. Other than with Reform voters, they are the very last choice for everybody else, so they would not do well under AV - unless they could secure more than 50% of the votes for a seat in the first place which even Farage couldn’t manage in Clacton. I believe the only party leader to win their seat in 2024 with more than 50% was Ed Davey.

As well as more cross-party collaboration, I would like to see more true Independents (who aren’t simply working as such after losing a party whip). I would also like to see the end of whipping so that MPs can vote for what is best for their constituents not what the Party wants.

I too see that the other thread has been taken down. I was going to post this link to a paper published in March 2024 (so before the election) by Professor Matt Goodwin for the Legatum Institute: Who’s Voting Reform? so I’ll pop it here if anyone interested:

li.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/WHOS-VOTING-REFORM-25.03.24.pdf

I gives a very clear analysis of who is voting Reform and why - better than taking a Vox pop on what is a very small platform which only served to stir up the usual, and by now very tired, sniping.

Excellent post. Thank you for the link. I like Professor Goodwin and will read his paper with interest.

^ but I accept that government now is at the mercy of the Treasury and financial markets and needs to be prudent.^

You see, Flittermouse, that's where I think that the government is utterly wrong, and I think that Marx, the economist, would agree with me. The government should be ignoring financial markets, primarily because 'the markets' are mostly speculators using their money to make more money instead of investing it productively.

Additionally, 'the markets' have shown little interest in investing in the UK. Which is a perfectly rational (for once) decision on their part because they cannot see any profit to be made from our impoverished population, and only a fresh depression in sight as the BoE keeps interest rates high and the PM and the Chancellor threaten savage cuts to public services.

Marx would also hate the pandering to the 'the markets' because the main effect of a market dominated economy is more and more upward concentration of wealth in the hands of the already wealthy.

I voted Green to keep a Green MP in our constituency, but I'm glad we have a Labour government rather than Conservatives..
I'd prefer them to be more left wing, radical and progressive but we shall see.

I am an old-school Marxist-socalist so the Labour Party, as it is now, is not what I would want ideally but it is better than the alternatives. I wanted Labour to win the election. My heart is with the genuine compassion of the LibDems but Ed Davey does not have the steel necessary to lead a country whereas I think Starmer does.

I voted tactically last July to unseat a Tory who supported Truss but at the same time I was confident I was voting for the best candidate, a Lib Dem with long experience in local government who continues to work hard in Westminster for our constituency. Labour hadn’t won this prosperous seat since 1946 and didn’t put up a strong candidate.

Rousseau famously wrote:

Man was born free, and everywhere he is in chains. The English people believes itself to be free; it is gravely mistaken; it is free only during the election of Members of Parliament; as soon as the Members are elected, the people is enslaved; it is nothing.

I think that’s what many people think at the moment - not really knowing what Labour stands for after some early decisions that have left people concerned, decisions which seem far removed from the ethos of my heroes, Attlee, Bevan and Tony Benn - but I accept that government now is at the mercy of the Treasury and financial markets and needs to be prudent.

What I would really like to see longer-term is an end to the dominance of the two major political parties so that we have more cross-party collaboration. That is when Parliament is at it’s best, when MPs are working together, not opposing for the sake of it.

I would like an end to FPTP and implementation of the Alternative Vote system that we rejected in 2011. LibDems are most people’s second favourite party so they would win more seats. Reform is the least popular of all the parties. Other than with Reform voters, they are the very last choice for everybody else, so they would not do well under AV - unless they could secure more than 50% of the votes for a seat in the first place which even Farage couldn’t manage in Clacton. I believe the only party leader to win their seat in 2024 with more than 50% was Ed Davey.

As well as more cross-party collaboration, I would like to see more true Independents (who aren’t simply working as such after losing a party whip). I would also like to see the end of whipping so that MPs can vote for what is best for their constituents not what the Party wants.

I too see that the other thread has been taken down. I was going to post this link to a paper published in March 2024 (so before the election) by Professor Matt Goodwin for the Legatum Institute: Who’s Voting Reform? so I’ll pop it here if anyone interested:

li.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/WHOS-VOTING-REFORM-25.03.24.pdf

I gives a very clear analysis of who is voting Reform and why - better than taking a Vox pop on what is a very small platform which only served to stir up the usual, and by now very tired, sniping.

Doodledog

I agree. It was a very telling thread.

That was in response to the comments about the Reform thread.

I agree. It was a very telling thread.

I voted Labour mostly to get the tories out, but I do incline to the left. The Blair and Brown governments were, on the whole, far better for the wellbeing of UK citizens than the previous and subsequent tory governments, even if they did make some bad decisions.

I think that a government should care for the wellbeing of all its citizens and look to promote a more equable distribution of resources. It should also be economically literate, but that is the counsel of perfection...

I don't regret voting Labour but I am very disappointed by the political ineptness and economic ignorance they have displayed since gaining power.

I appreciate that the hearts of most Labour MPs are in the right place, but the leadership frequently seems to be at odds with them..

LizzieDrip

What a pity that thread has been taken down.

I wonder if a thread in a similar vein, but with a less allegedly ‘goady’ title, might reap more insight about why people support Reform.

I, for one, am genuinely interested.

The thing to remember is that in this country we have secret ballots for elections, and nobody is required to declare where their vote went and why. Someone may decide to declare their allegiance but they still don't owe anybody an explanation as to why they feel that. It is not for others to then ascribe their own invented reasons. The assumptions and accusations made on that thread verged on bullying, and were frequently insulting and offensive.

It wasn't the title that caused it to be taken down it was the opening post by the OP that was goady and offensive.

NotSpaghetti it was you that brought up tax, I was responding.

It is nobody’s business who I vote for.

LizzieDrip

Barleyfields to answer your question see my post on this thread “yesterday 19.02”.

Thanks Lizzie. I did read and consider that post, but didn’t understand why given the events I mentioned you said you trust them.

LizzieDrip

What a pity that thread has been taken down.

I wonder if a thread in a similar vein, but with a less allegedly ‘goady’ title, might reap more insight about why people support Reform.

I, for one, am genuinely interested.

I was a bit goady as well. Shouldn’t have been but got carried away 😳.

That was to Rosie.

What a pity that thread has been taken down.

I wonder if a thread in a similar vein, but with a less allegedly ‘goady’ title, might reap more insight about why people support Reform.

I, for one, am genuinely interested.

Doodledog

Rosie51

I voted Labour (even though I despise my sitting Labour MP) but honestly if I'd seen the bullying, insulting posts of Beeches I would have been tempted to vote for anybody else. For a 'new' poster (as far as I'm aware) talk about 'jump right in'!!!

There are a few ‘new’ posters just now who have settled in very quickly, aren’t there?

And taken over the chairpersonship 😁
(Is that a word?)

LizzieDrip Rosie why shouldn’t a new poster be able to express their views immediately? GN is an open forum; all posters have equal rights, no matter how long they’ve contributed. There’s no hierarchy.

Of course all posters have equal rights, and anybody can express their views. What is surprising is how some new posters feel confident to harangue and insult other posters. I think it's rather telling that the thread demanding that Reform supporters explain and justify themselves has been removed by GN for being too goady in the opening post.

Barleyfields to answer your question see my post on this thread “yesterday 19.02”.

LizzieDrip

^For a 'new' poster (as far as I'm aware) talk about 'jump right in'^

Rosie why shouldn’t a new poster be able to express their views immediately? GN is an open forum; all posters have equal rights, no matter how long they’ve contributed. There’s no hierarchy.

TBH, one of the things that bothers me about GN is the ‘clique’ mentality of a few posters (particularly on the N&P thread). On occasions it feels like ‘playground bullying’.

“And yet you’re still here” I’m sure someone will respond

No reason at all. My own reply to Rosie wasn't about Beeches, whose threads asking about motives for voting are much needed, IMO, and far more useful than the sniping ones - or would be if there were more people willing to say what they like about Reform.

I was referring to the way 'new' posters often emerge and in no time start carrying on old grudges from previous incarnations. I see no reason why people can't have fresh starts (and if that happens we would never know) but very often it's pretty clear what's happening.

GrannyGravy13 The thread is about why people support Labour.

Are you a Labour supporter (other than the conglomerates tax issue)?

LizzieDrip

I think the single word that sums it up for me (which some of you have cited) is trust.

I trust Keir Starmer, the PM and the man.

I trust the Labour Party, as a whole, to do their best for our country - not perfect but trustworthy!

After the freebies scandal, the removal of WFA as soon as they came into office, the duplicitous statement about not raising NI, the imposition of IHT on working farmers, two thirds of businesses saying that increased costs resulting from the Budget will be passed onto consumers (which it was patently obvious would happen), and the likelihood that mortgage rates are going to rise, how on earth can you trust Labour?