Want to understand what Trump is doing?

MaizieD

^So you think it’s OK for government to be inefficient,^

What a shocking response to my post, David.

My question was ‘is a government justified in breaking the law to fulfil its mandate?’

You clearly think that it is.

What is more, you seem to equate abiding by the law with inefficiency.

I can’t find the words to express what I feel about people who subscribe to such a belief.

Perhaps you had better be specific and state how he or Musk is going to break any particular US law, I don’t know the US system but in the UK employees can be sacked for many reasons, some require compensation, some a redundancy payment, the courts decide.

As I posted previously I expect any employment rights to be respected. That’s not going to mean a place for all in the UK or US.

It wasn’t a sneer at all . I am not like that and wouldn’t ever do that. You don’t know me at all. I am stating a fact. We are not there.

nanna8

It is easy to criticise Trump from our lounge rooms but if you live in the USA things might be very different. He had a massive win and I always thought that wouldn’t be so good for Europeans and the rest of the world. If you live there you might see things differently. Perhaps we should not judge. Similarly I criticise Starmer and think he is a dreadful PM but I am going by what I hear, not lived experience. Perhaps he is a lovely, warm and compassionate man ??

I don’t think that imaround exactly qualifies for the ‘criticising Trump from our lounge rooms’ sneer. Had you not noticed that she is a US citizen who lives in the US and is experiencing the results of his actions at first hand.

There is also plenty of evidence that posters are getting information from diverse US sources.

But perhaps you’d like to keep your criticism in mind when you start criticising the UK government from your lounge room?

Chocolatelovinggran

nanna8, you repeat often your judgement of Mr Starmer as a dreadful Prime Minister, although you do not live here.
This is your view, to which you are entitled.
If he were to start breaking the law, undermining the judiciary, removing women's rights and listing banned words(?!) you might find that others would find this worrying.
Some GNetters have family in the USA.
Some GNetters trade with the USA.
Some GNetters holiday in the USA.

I agree. For heavens sake give Starmer the chance to prove that he can better this country without the need to constantly sag him off..

So you think it’s OK for government to be inefficient,

What a shocking response to my post, David.

My question was ‘is a government justified in breaking the law to fulfil its mandate?’

You clearly think that it is.

What is more, you seem to equate abiding by the law with inefficiency.

I can’t find the words to express what I feel about people who subscribe to such a belief.

nanna8, you repeat often your judgement of Mr Starmer as a dreadful Prime Minister, although you do not live here.
This is your view, to which you are entitled.
If he were to start breaking the law, undermining the judiciary, removing women's rights and listing banned words(?!) you might find that others would find this worrying.
Some GNetters have family in the USA.
Some GNetters trade with the USA.
Some GNetters holiday in the USA.

The banned word list includes -

Female
Woman
Women

I looked for
Male
Man
Men - not there.

I find your posts very interesting imaround. It is easy for us to judge from afar. Much better to hear how things are from someone who lives in the US.

You are spot on foxie

Trump is breaking the law. He can not fire civil servants. They are refusing to leave their jobs, forcing Musk to physically remove them.
They are posting data on Federal website despite a ban on it. They are leaking to reporters what is really happening behind the scenes.

There is no mandate for him to destroy the federal government. As President, he took an oath to defend the constitution. He has done nothing but violate the constitution since.

MaizieD

ronib

I am missing the point David49 what grounds can civil servants use to take action? Trump won the election so even in America, he must have some kind of mandate to enforce his election manifesto. Trump was very clear on what he wanted on the civil service and he is now pushing it through. Isn’t this democracy in action?

Do you seriously think that it is fine for a president, pm, or whatever a government leader is called, to break the law in the name of executing the mandate on which they were elected?

So you think it’s OK for government to be inefficient, of course any leader can ask for changes to be made to avoid wasting money. Technology, especially AI is going to result in many administration jobs being lost in business and government, that’s the way it’s going to be, I would expect any employment rights to be respected.
How any laws are interpreted is up to the courts, that is just as true in the UK as the US, until now the immigration laws have been interpreted very liberally and widely abused, todays news indicates that is going to be tightened considerably.

About time too!.

It is easy to criticise Trump from our lounge rooms but if you live in the USA things might be very different. He had a massive win and I always thought that wouldn’t be so good for Europeans and the rest of the world. If you live there you might see things differently. Perhaps we should not judge. Similarly I criticise Starmer and think he is a dreadful PM but I am going by what I hear, not lived experience. Perhaps he is a lovely, warm and compassionate man ??

Banned words in research? The end of this area of research, surely ?

ronib

I am missing the point David49 what grounds can civil servants use to take action? Trump won the election so even in America, he must have some kind of mandate to enforce his election manifesto. Trump was very clear on what he wanted on the civil service and he is now pushing it through. Isn’t this democracy in action?

Do you seriously think that it is fine for a president, pm, or whatever a government leader is called, to break the law in the name of executing the mandate on which they were elected?

Ronib the US has a constitution and laws and it's government is set up with a series of checks and balances designed to prevent a President behaving like a dictator. Trump is ignoring these instruments of government. The problem that the US has now is finding a way to enforce the law. This is a unique situation and it means politicians are struggling to know how to deal with it. That's my reading of the situation and no, it's most definitely not "democratic".

We don’t have to put previous names on our passports. Never have. Must be different.

I am missing the point David49 what grounds can civil servants use to take action? Trump won the election so even in America, he must have some kind of mandate to enforce his election manifesto. Trump was very clear on what he wanted on the civil service and he is now pushing it through. Isn’t this democracy in action?

We will see if civil servants take action because any disruption will hit them in their salaries immediately and the payment of benefits to others that are in even more need.

Although I support proper registration of voters a missing birth certificate should not be an obstacle, I’m surprised that it is not a requirement of citizenship or residence in the US.

It's coming.

Republicans are about to need Democrats to pass a budget in a couple of weeks. They can't pass a budget without them because of the Tea Party Republicans.

Until then, the effects of his decisions are already starting to harm his voters. They will accelerate in the next few weeks when the steel/aluminum tariffs hit hard.

The courts are catching up to him as well. There is still question on if he will follow court orders. They appear to be playing the game because they are filing appeals instead of flat out ignoring rulings, but this could go either way.

Underneath what we can see, is a rumbling that isn't quite so obvious. People are quietly mobilizing. You are going to start seeing more protests. More truth telling. More civil disobedience, especially from civil servants.

One thing I am confident about is this, we are Americans. We won't go down without a fight. It's in our DNA.

I just keep thinking, when will people top putting up with it - it will take time before everything hits hard I think. As for Musk and his contract, well...

Some Federal employees are being told that of they still have a job soon, they can expect 100% monitoring, from door swipes to keystrokes.

www.npr.org/2025/02/11/nx-s1-5293258/trump-gsa-budget-cuts-doge

Musk's Space X company was awarded a large government contract at the same time he was trying to puffer through our Social Security and Medicare. Attached photo.

The Associated Press has been banned from the Oval Office because they refuse to change the name if Gulf of America.

The employees that maintain election security have been placed on leave.

abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/us-cyber-agency-puts-election-security-staffers-worked-118671767

Thats the plan, Syracute, of that I'm sure.

Imaround thank you for the updates.

Shocked about the data removal, but most of all, the list of "forbidden" words. Totally "1984" Newspeak.

George Orwell describes it as

" the Party created Newspeak, which is a controlled language of simplified grammar and limited vocabulary designed to limit a person's ability for critical thinking. The Newspeak language thus limits the person's ability to articulate and communicate abstract concepts, such as personal identity, self-expression, and free will, which are thoughtcrimes, acts of personal independence".

David49

Do you think Trump is expecting married women to register withe dual names eg :- Hillary Rodham Clinton, it’s quite common to do that these days. If you have a passport you do have to include any other names you have used, what’s the problem registering to vote like that. It is difficult to track women when names change through marriage, it makes it very hard researching family history

One of the problems is the expense of getting a passport that not all poor people can afford . Then perhaps the birth certificate is lost . It’s a great way to disenfranchise the needy .

An update on the court orders. It appears they are somewhat complying with one of them and are returning removed science data to government websites. It is slow and inconsistent. Hopefully they will return the data in full.

Daily, Trump and Musk are getting multiple court orders against them. I heard there is a video that Musk says the Judicial branch should not exist, but I have not watching it yet. He might have said having a Judicial branch is tyranny based on reports I have seen.

They have appealed the order that applies a temporary restraining order against Musk accessing Treasury data, however it isnt typically allowed to appeal a TRO.

This is still a topic to watch because whatever happens here will determine how this plays out. I cant see a mechanism to remove him right now because his Congress is on his side, so no impeachment will happen.

Roberts from the Supreme Court issues a warning last month about ignoring court orders, so there is hope there. But I am doubtful. This is the most corrupt court we have ever had and they tend to do whatever Trump wants.

US Citizens can no longer rely on the courts or Congress to act in their best interest, or even legally, and we are being told by even Democrats that beating Trump may fall on us

Sorry, I got the Senate bill in there too. It is better, but still not good.

Pregnant women are dying because the total abortion ban states WITH "exceptions and exclusions" are STILL not allowing women to get the medical care they need. These women wanted their babies.

www.propublica.org/article/abortion-bans-deaths-state-maternal-mortality-committees#:~:text=Women%20have%20died%20after%20they,20%20hours%20while%20sepsis%20spread.

Texas and Georgia said they are no longer going to investigate the deaths.

www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/texas-georgia-women-deaths-abortion-ban-rcna182540

Still think I am over exaggerating?

Here is a good summary of how current (and proposed future) legislation harms women's rights.

www.americanprogress.org/article/women-paid-price-trumps-regulatory-agenda/

Let's not forget the Women's Health Protection Act that states:

"Whereas health care for women should also address the needs of men, families, and communities as they relate to women’s health care"

www.congress.gov/bill/119th-congress/house-resolution/7/text

www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/senate-bill/701