J D Vance Munich address today.

And Mr Trump has banned a certain news outlet from briefings because they continue to refer to The Gulf of Mexico.
And I really don't like, and do not use the phrase " wake up and smell the coffee" because I see the implication as " I am an intelligent informed individual and you are not" which is, in itself, ill informed, as no one knows the poster.

Dorrain

LizzieDrip
In 2023, the United States was the largest partner for EU exports of goods (19.7 %) and the second largest partner for EU imports of goods (13.7 %).
Among EU Member States, the Netherlands was the largest importer of goods from the United States and Germany was the largest exporter of goods to the United States in 2023. Your suggestion is basically what Trump wants, he wants Europe to stop relying on the US for defence and want them to start paying their own way.

Does that apply to Israel?
As far as I know the US pays more to Israel than all other countries combined as well as supplying state of the art weaponry.
And if the US wants to stop funding Europe/UK defence will it remove all its bases pronto? And stop dragging European countries/the UK into its illegal wars abroad?

LizzieDrip
In 2023, the United States was the largest partner for EU exports of goods (19.7 %) and the second largest partner for EU imports of goods (13.7 %).
Among EU Member States, the Netherlands was the largest importer of goods from the United States and Germany was the largest exporter of goods to the United States in 2023. Your suggestion is basically what Trump wants, he wants Europe to stop relying on the US for defence and want them to start paying their own way.

He wore his igorance like he recently wore a stars and stripes handkerchief in his pocket which is apparently a sign of disrespcting the flag he so strongly purports to love.

He claimed Europe has a free speech issue whilst supporting Putin??? Come on people, we Europeans aren't so stupid as to fall for this claptrap.

The US as we knew it is finished... you can keep your chlorinated chicken and your cheap burger bars.

Does the US not realise they are still the young 'uns on the world scene? Only just over 250 years old and falling like a lemmings off a cliff. The great experiment is over folks...

@Bevsec

This is widely reported by many news outlets, not just the independent -

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/utah-pride-flag-ban-schools-government-property-b2698466.html

You see this is the flip side to the brave new world Trump/Vance are promoting, a world where diversity is taboo but Nazi and confederate flags are ok.
I take it those supporting Trump/Vance also support this. After all you can’t just cherry pick, this is very much a part of the whole Trump/Vance/Musk circus.

BevSec

MaizieD

woodenspoon

It’s not stirring the pot. It’s called having an alternative point of view and being allowed to air it. That’s freedom of speech.

Is it like this 'freedom of speech'?

Pentagon school libraries closed so that the thought police freedom of speech lovers can weed out books containing banned words and ideas.

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/feb/13/pentagon-schools-closed-libraries-trump

I don't know how you lot manage to live with the hypocrisy

The guardian again….. sigh

Do you have a problem with the truth being reported, Bev Sec?

Try this:
www.military.com/daily-news/2025/02/12/schools-military-kids-ban-books-and-lessons-run-afoul-of-trump-orders.html

Or this:
www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2025/02/07/defense-department-hegseth-books-schools/

Or this:

taskandpurpose.com/news/department-of-defense-schools-pulled-lessons/

Or this:

citizenfreepress.com/breaking/pentagon-schools-close-libraries-to-remove-inappropriate-books/

Loads of variations of the same story... and lots more reports of it if you care to do a quick search.

Marydoll

www.thenational.scot/news/24937742.scottish-campaigners-respond-jd-vances-buffer-zone-lie

This is from the National.
In a speech in Munich, Vance argued that Europe was shifting away from democratic values and claimed the “basic liberties of religious Britons, in particular” are under threat, as he used the Scottish Government’s law as an example.
He should at least get his facts right.

A complete lie that people could not pray in their own homes in a buffer zone around abortion clinics. Just totally fabricated. I mean who would police that? Are specially trained anti-basic-liberties police raiding people’s homes to see if they are praying.
The simple fact is that the Trump administration knows precious little about Europe and the UK, which is made patently obvious whenever they open their mouths.
Perhaps they know just as little about the US, which wouldn’t surprise me.

jop.blogs.uni-hamburg.de/what-dictators-communicate-in-their-speeches-and-why-we-should-pay-attention/

MaizieD

woodenspoon

It’s not stirring the pot. It’s called having an alternative point of view and being allowed to air it. That’s freedom of speech.

Is it like this 'freedom of speech'?

Pentagon school libraries closed so that the thought police freedom of speech lovers can weed out books containing banned words and ideas.

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/feb/13/pentagon-schools-closed-libraries-trump

I don't know how you lot manage to live with the hypocrisy

The guardian again….. sigh

Sago

Chocolatelovinggran

I understand that you love Mr Vance's stance on immigration and free speech.
How are you with his opposition to all forms of abortion including the morning after pill, even following rape, and his plans to limit availability to contraception?

I do not agree with Vance re abortion just as I do not agree with Farage, Badenoch or Starmer on everything.

I just loved the key point, the elephant in the room or as he put it “ the enemy from within”.

There are many of us out here who feel exactly as I do and I believe we are welcoming our enemies, feeding, educating, homing and clothing them.

Then people act surprised when they turn against us.

Wake up and smell the coffee.

👏👏👏👏

FriedGreenTomatoes2

I think British and European politicians have betrayed the whole continent. I doubt any will be held accountable for the scale of the damage they’ve caused but there’s just a glimmer of hope that people will wake up and stop voting for these rotten liberals. Thank you to JDV for telling them they’re on notice.

So do I.

www.thenational.scot/news/24937742.scottish-campaigners-respond-jd-vances-buffer-zone-lie

This is from the National.
In a speech in Munich, Vance argued that Europe was shifting away from democratic values and claimed the “basic liberties of religious Britons, in particular” are under threat, as he used the Scottish Government’s law as an example.
He should at least get his facts right.

Here is a fun fact for those who think Trumps immigration plan is the greatest of all time.

A portion of them are being released after being arrested. Back I to the same communities they were picked up in.

It is called Catch and Release.

www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/people-caught-trump-immigration-crackdown-released-us-rcna186360

Well, what was all that hoohah about seizing back control and protecting our sovereignty if so many of you are going to start drooling over a rather odious American man who gives a speech that dictates to the UK and Europe how to run their countries, pointing out where we have been going wrong all along. A man slammed in the past for being anti semitic and racist among other things.
Perhaps those of you so beguiled by this piece of work simply because he speaks out against migrants and champions freedom of racist speech, would be perfectly happy to let the US run our affairs, dictating how our democracy should be run.
Tbh you need to think a bit above the ‘I’m against migration’ populist baloney and put the UK first, not America.

With regard to the truth of Vance's words, he put a very specific spin on the Adam Smith-Connor story.

Smith-Connor wasn't just a bereft man having a quiet pray for a son (who'd died 22 years previously) outside of the abortion clinic . He knew he wasn't meant to be doing it, there were posters telling him not to - he did it repeatedly - every time he did it he wrote to the council the day before he went to t tell them he was going to do it. On the day he was arrested police spent 40 minutes asking him if he would move on before he the arrest.

He might have been grieving the loss of his son, but he was also out to break the rules and to do so publicly time and time again.

Vance gave no hint of that.

That was a different America though wasn't it David49.

This America is making it very clear that our ongoing "friendship" relies upon us following their rules.
Given the way things are going there now we will have to lose a lot of what we consider our civilized, evolved, modern society to win their support. The lot of women, disabled, the sick, poor and ethnic people in the USA is looking pretty dire from here.

FriedGreenTomatoes2

It was refreshing to hear the unvarnished truth spoken by a politician. Are Vance and Trump the only politicians in the world who tell the truth?

Where would we be without them?

It's crucial to critically examine the accuracy and potential consequences of their statements. Just because something is said bluntly doesn't make it true. Vance and Trump are selectively highlighting certain facts while ignoring others, or even presenting outright falsehoods under the guise of 'telling it like it is.'

Even if they occasionally speak uncomfortable truths, the way they deliver those truths sets out to be divisive, harmful, or unproductive. Do the perceived benefits of their 'truth-telling' outweigh the potential damage caused by their words and actions? Surely we should be asking ourselves: are they truly serving the public good, or are they simply promoting their own agendas under the guise of honesty? Outsiders focus, on what they consider to be a truth, should not be an excuse for allowing harmful rhetoric or policies.

Yet again we come back to "where is the critical thinking in such posts.

“Europe (including the UK) tell Trump et al to p* off. We form a European Army to protect ourselves against Putin’s future aggression.”

The US had to come to the aid of Europe twice last century and defended us throughout the Cold War when the USSR was really aggressive.

Be very careful what you wish for, I really don’t have much confidence of Unity in Europe.

It’s not a private conversation dear. I replied to a post. You’ve replied to mine in the same way. Rules for me but not for thee?

Oh so the left arent in favour of censoring speech now, that's good to hear.

woodenspoon

MaizieD

woodenspoon

It’s not stirring the pot. It’s called having an alternative point of view and being allowed to air it. That’s freedom of speech.

Is it like this 'freedom of speech'?

Pentagon school libraries closed so that the thought police freedom of speech lovers can weed out books containing banned words and ideas.

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/feb/13/pentagon-schools-closed-libraries-trump

I don't know how you lot manage to live with the hypocrisy

You’ve lost the plot. I was replying to another poster and was commenting on my right, and those of others, to disagree. Sorry if that offends you. And your own hypocrisy.

We don't have private conversations on threads.

My comment was part of that lovely 'freedom of speech'.

This is the UK, not Trump's US

I can't believe what I'm reading on here. Trump "the new sheriff in town" according to Vance is being applauded for being a dictator. Why would women think the misogynist, Vance will do anything good for women.

Book banning? Lists of banned words? No women in key positions? Flying Nazi flags perfectly OK? Abortion illegal? Ignoring the law?

What lovely people they are who support that sort of thing... 🙄

MaizieD

^Wake up and smell the coffee.^

I think it's time people woke up and smelled the sewage that's coming out of the USA

It’s Kopi Luwak. Tastes good until you understand its origins.

MaizieD

woodenspoon

It’s not stirring the pot. It’s called having an alternative point of view and being allowed to air it. That’s freedom of speech.

Is it like this 'freedom of speech'?

Pentagon school libraries closed so that the thought police freedom of speech lovers can weed out books containing banned words and ideas.

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/feb/13/pentagon-schools-closed-libraries-trump

I don't know how you lot manage to live with the hypocrisy

You’ve lost the plot. I was replying to another poster and was commenting on my right, and those of others, to disagree. Sorry if that offends you. And your own hypocrisy.