Israel to "conquer" Gaza

David49

So you support Hamas holding all the Gaza civilians as hostages to achieve their ends.

Every country should be calling for Hamas to leave, I don’t hear that at all

We don’t hear it at all, plenty of support for Gaza but no international calls of outrage for hamas to hand over the hostages ( which by doing so will help aid to flood in.)
You have to wonder why.

Maremia

Jeremy Bowen's article this morning, on the BBC online, covers some of the points and positions raised on this thread.
Interesting point Iam64, that Netanyahu wanted Hamas in place at that time.
I think most of us would agree that a common denominator in the current appalling situation which many, myself included , has morphed from 'justified retaliation' into a genocide, is Netanyahu.

Hamas proved to be much worse than Fateh and funded by Qatar and others deliberately planned the destruction of Israel.

The result is exactly the fate of Nazi Germany they had to be bombed into submission and invaded BY US, regardless of civilian casualties. Japan did surrender and save an even worse fate.

Hamas could surrender and save lives I doubt they will because they don’t care how many civilians die.

Below is a small portion of the affidavit given by Ronen Bet, the Chief of Shin Bet. I have posted a link to the complete document at the bottom which I got from The Times of Israel.
this is in response to anyone saying that questions regarding the actions of the Netanyahu government in the period leading to 7/10 constitute "conspiracy theories" In Israel they are certainly not being seen as such!

"The draft of the internal Shin Bet review was submitted to the Prime Minister. It refers to the service’s failure to prevent the massacre, while also presenting the long-standing policy of the political leadership regarding the Gaza Strip and the exceptional and repeated warnings delivered by the Shin Bar, the head of Shin Bet to the political echelon throughout 2023 – which were ignored.

– A letter was attached to the review, addressed to the Prime Minister, explaining how Hamas’s military buildup occurred before the eyes of the State of Israel, funded by Qatar and enabled by a defensive policy, and highlighting the need for a state commission of inquiry to investigate all aspects of the road that led to October 7."

www.timesofisrael.com/out-of-deep-concern-for-the-state-of-israel-full-text-of-shin-bet-chief-ronen-bars-affidavit/

I read Bowens report.

Jeremy Bowen, international editor BBCnews

Jeremy Bowen's article this morning, on the BBC online, covers some of the points and positions raised on this thread.
Interesting point Iam64, that Netanyahu wanted Hamas in place at that time.
I think most of us would agree that a common denominator in the current appalling situation which many, myself included , has morphed from 'justified retaliation' into a genocide, is Netanyahu.

So you support Hamas holding all the Gaza civilians as hostages to achieve their ends.

Every country should be calling for Hamas to leave, I don’t hear that at all

foxie48

David I haven't read any posts cotradicting your assessment of Hamas. Everyone agrees that Hamas is a terrorist group that behaves appallingly. We agree that the events of 7/10 were dreadful and condemn Hamas for them. None of that is disputed. It is the treatment of civilians in Gaza that is the cause for great concern.
For the record Hamas were elected nearly 20 years ago by a tiny majority and have been supported by Qatari money (1.8 billion dollars in three years)with the complete knowledge of the Israeli government that is worthy of discussion. Why did Netanyahu allow this? Fortunately we know the answer because Netanyahu is on record telling us. He wanted a strong counter balance to Fatah to create division between the two Palestinian political parties to undermine the two state solution! Why not discuss that?

In my opinion, another good post from foxie48.

Arguing about whether the BBC is biased one way or the other is a national pastime. My view is it reports the news in as impartial a way possible. There are plenty of of alternative sources available.

We need solutions that recognise atrocities have been committed by Hamas and the Israeli government. Starving babies, terrified children and people - it needs brave leaders to focus on getting ‘both sides’ to the negotiating table

David I haven't read any posts cotradicting your assessment of Hamas. Everyone agrees that Hamas is a terrorist group that behaves appallingly. We agree that the events of 7/10 were dreadful and condemn Hamas for them. None of that is disputed. It is the treatment of civilians in Gaza that is the cause for great concern.
For the record Hamas were elected nearly 20 years ago by a tiny majority and have been supported by Qatari money (1.8 billion dollars in three years)with the complete knowledge of the Israeli government that is worthy of discussion. Why did Netanyahu allow this? Fortunately we know the answer because Netanyahu is on record telling us. He wanted a strong counter balance to Fatah to create division between the two Palestinian political parties to undermine the two state solution! Why not discuss that?

Headline this morning.

UN reports that an Israeli policy of starving the Palestinians is a weapon of war.

I think it is genocide.

David the truth

Hamas is a terrorist organization they got elected promising a new future then murdered the opposition and spent the next 15 years indoctrinating the population to destroy Jews and Israel..
They stockpiled arms, built tunnels and military command posts beneath hospitals and schools deliberately to maximize the propaganda value of civilian deaths.
Despite its bravado Hamas knew the were no match for the IDF and their main weapon was propaganda so the have used civilians as human shields throughout the war. Global media has spread the propaganda exactly as Hamas intended, they now seem quite prepared to see them die from famine and disease to achieve their aims.

I’ve no sympathy for Israel but surrounded by hostile neighbours and terrorists vowed to destroy the state they have no alternative but to fight. There will be no peace while Hamas or any other terrorist organization rules Gaza

The BBC impartial ? That really is difficult to understand, they
even commissioned a documentary narrated by Hamas

It isn't in the BBC's remit to give opinions. It reports the opinions of others. That really isn't difficult to understand.

Oreo

The usual insults growstuff

foxie48
The BBC do need to be impartial on politics and other matters,
But why should they be impartial where terrorists are concerned.If our government designates them so, and the previous government does so and all of Europe as well as some other parts of the world, why does the BBC need to be on the fence about it?
When the terrorists enter Israel and murder over a thousand innocent people and take over 200 hostages back into Gaza, why can’t the BBC call them a terrorist group? Who else bar terrorists do that?
It doesn’t make any sense.

Insults? If the cap fits ...

Curlywhirly

Just watched Fergal Keene's BBC report on starving children (and adults) in Gaza. How aid, which is available, can be withheld is beyond me, it's nothing short of evil. The footage of an innocent 5 month old baby, completely emaciated and crying was horrendous.

A timely reminder on what we need to focus on, the people in both countries caught up in events beyond their control - or choice.

Oreo

The usual insults growstuff

foxie48
The BBC do need to be impartial on politics and other matters,
But why should they be impartial where terrorists are concerned.If our government designates them so, and the previous government does so and all of Europe as well as some other parts of the world, why does the BBC need to be on the fence about it?
When the terrorists enter Israel and murder over a thousand innocent people and take over 200 hostages back into Gaza, why can’t the BBC call them a terrorist group? Who else bar terrorists do that?
It doesn’t make any sense.

The BBC aren't the governments mouthpiece. It reports on events and tells us what governments say. Many government around the world consider Netanyahu to be a criminal, in fact the majority of countries - ^our own government supports the arrest of Netanyahu should he enter the country as a criminal.

So should the BBC report `Netanyahu as a criminal No. it reports, as best possible, news, events, and what has been said about them, and where the source of news has come from, and leaves us to make our minds up.

Just watched Fergal Keene's BBC report on starving children (and adults) in Gaza. How aid, which is available, can be withheld is beyond me, it's nothing short of evil. The footage of an innocent 5 month old baby, completely emaciated and crying was horrendous.

The usual insults growstuff

foxie48
The BBC do need to be impartial on politics and other matters,
But why should they be impartial where terrorists are concerned.If our government designates them so, and the previous government does so and all of Europe as well as some other parts of the world, why does the BBC need to be on the fence about it?
When the terrorists enter Israel and murder over a thousand innocent people and take over 200 hostages back into Gaza, why can’t the BBC call them a terrorist group? Who else bar terrorists do that?
It doesn’t make any sense.

foxie48

"The BBC (British Broadcasting Corporation) is a British public service broadcaster. Its main responsibility is to provide impartial public service broadcasting in the UK, Channel Islands and Isle of Man. BBC is a public corporation of the Department for Culture, Media and Sport."
Oreo The BBC maintains it's impartiality by not taking a position but makes it clear what the British Government's position is on Hamas, ie a proscribed terrorist organisation. I really don't understand why anyone finds this difficult to understand

Because they haven't discovered how to move their brains into top gear.

Sorry, you already said that foxie.

The point of the BBC is to be impartial . .

"The BBC (British Broadcasting Corporation) is a British public service broadcaster. Its main responsibility is to provide impartial public service broadcasting in the UK, Channel Islands and Isle of Man. BBC is a public corporation of the Department for Culture, Media and Sport."
Oreo The BBC maintains it's impartiality by not taking a position but makes it clear what the British Government's position is on Hamas, ie a proscribed terrorist organisation. I really don't understand why anyone finds this difficult to understand

Oh yes, they always say ‘hamas is a terror organisation proscribed by the UK government’ they won’t ever say that the BBC think or agree that it’s a terror organisation.

I've just read the link posted by Wyllow3. There is no bias at all against Israel.

The discussion with regard to the BBC is completely erroneous, the BBC follows govt guidelines, please see below.

"The BBC has clear editorial guidelines to report Hamas as a terror organisation proscribed by the UK Government. That was its policy under the last Government, and that remains its policy now."
hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2025-02-27/debates/89B386F6-B5B4-4013-B810-B1F4A4A1C741/GazaBBCCoverage