Israel to "conquer" Gaza

I do understand. Mandela put down his sword and argued for peace. Very noble but I doubt Hamas will follow suit or Netanyahu.
I can't see peace there for a long time. Possibly if Netanyahu loses the election next year but even then a lot of damage has been done.

agree Anniebach.

Sabotage against the government of the time was a crime for which Mandela was imprisoned but bear no relation to the medieval acts committed by Hamas operatives (who were high on drugs, so it was reported).

To speak of both in the same breath as if they bear comparison is enough to make anyone cry from despair.

I met Desmond Tutu as well but was a child at the time and did not appreciate the significance of it.

Thank you Allira, I did think someone would used Mandela,
same happened in a thread on N.Ireland. It still distressed me,

As I said, my POV is certainly not that a direct comparison of circumstances can be made: I have the same enduring love and respect for Mandela and Tutu as I have always have:

But that peace was wrought in SA eventually by talking, not armed conflict and that this applies in trying to prevent the extreme solution proposed as in the O/P.

I am not comparing and contrasting😀😀

I am as wyllow says arguing for swords etc.

The accusation was Mandela = Hamas,

Anniebach

Quote Whitewavemark2 Sun 11-May-25 09:18:20
Anniebach
Which of the may countries found peace with negotiations with terrorists ?
Remember Mandela?

I knew Mandela would be named, I was invited to tea with
Arch Bishop Desmond TuTu when he came to Wales and thanked people for their support for Nelson Mandela, he spoke of Mandela crimes for which he was sentenced to life, no mention of rape, sexual abuse of tinies taken from their cribs,
smashing babies against walls, locking people in their homes and setting fire to them.

You compare Mandela with that, do excuse me I need to cry from despair

I agree Anniebach.

Sabotage against the government of the time was a crime for which Mandela was imprisoned but bear no relation to the medieval acts committed by Hamas operatives (who were high on drugs, so it was reported).

To speak of both in the same breath as if they bear comparison is enough to make anyone cry from despair.

I met Desmond Tutu as well but was a child at the time and did not appreciate the significance of it.

As I said, the interest was how "swords can be turned into ploughshares".

Perhaps its best to return to discussions on the proposed creation of the enclave in Gaza and its consequences if it goes ahead for those trapped in it - and for those creating it - that surely, there have to be better ways ahead.

I spend too much time here, I just knew Mandela would be first
to be mentioned, and you Wyllow next with a link,
mmmm, Wikipedia or Desmond Tutu,! no problem

Anniebach

How can I not be in doubt when I read your posts. which academic have you been following re S.A.?
Pass

That relates to what I read at University. So that is from my own knowledge.

So no need to pass.

I think WWM was just giving us an example of where "swords turned into ploughshares"

Yes, Mandela was one of the founding members of the military wing of the ANC, when the situation was beyond desperate for his people,

but he was also the one years later who persuaded them - with other peacemakers like Tutu

to disband the military wing of the ANC during the ending of apartheid and instead of the killings continuing set up the Peace and Reconciliation Committees

Its all in here
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UMkhonto_weSizwe

Where the only option is to come to the table to stop this escalation

How can I not be in doubt when I read your posts. which academic have you been following re S.A.?
Pass

Whatever the world thinks of Mandela now, be in no doubt that he was once classed as a terrorist (remember the “brace letting” the bombs and other violence?) and member of the military ANC and imprisoned for most of his life with no pushback from many governments.

What I say is that the violence in SA only ended when the NP began to recognise that the blacks had as much rights as the whites and overlooked the violence.

Until the Israelis come to the table, accept that the Palestinians have rights this will never end.

The fact that many Israelis look upon the Palestinians as less than human and are now planning to ghettoise them speaks volumes to me.

Quote Whitewavemark2 Sun 11-May-25 09:18:20
Anniebach
Which of the may countries found peace with negotiations with terrorists ?
Remember Mandela?

I knew Mandela would be named, I was invited to tea with
Arch Bishop Desmond TuTu when he came to Wales and thanked people for their support for Nelson Mandela, he spoke of Mandela crimes for which he was sentenced to life, no mention of rape, sexual abuse of tinies taken from their cribs,
smashing babies against walls, locking people in their homes and setting fire to them.

You compare Mandela with that, do excuse me I need to cry from despair

Anniebach

Which of the may countries found peace with negotiations with terrorists ?

Remember Mandela?

More mothers and children, only mothers and children

Hamas and the abominable taking of hostages cannot be justified but neither can what is happening right now in Gaza.
This article in the Guardian shows just how the innocent are suffering.
www.theguardian.com/world/2025/may/11/there-is-suffering-everywhere-you-look-says-mother-of-emaciated-baby-girl-trapped-in-gaza?utm_term=682040665936e4aee9bd92ff55969251&utm_campaign=GuardianTodayUK&utm_source=esp&utm_medium=Email&CMP=GTUK_email

Which of the may countries found peace with negotiations with terrorists ?

I can't think of a single country where it's been possible to kill every terrorist but I can think of many that have peace thanks to negotiations. Why does anyone think Gaza is different?

Yes and how it is supposed to function?

The only way that this siege is going to work is if non combatants are allowed out of the siege area and cared for properly, it can’t be a closed ghetto area. Identifying individuals doesn’t work because they can just hand food on to others.

Hamas is the Gaza health ministry

Iam64

I don’t appreciate the way what’s happening to the Palestinians is often glibly compared to the Holocaust.

Reading about the plans though, remind me if reading about the Warsaw Ghetto in Ww2. It’s shameful, shocking and completely wrong on every level.

How the Gaza Health Ministry is supposed to operate is beyond my creative thinking abilities

The parallels with the Warsaw Ghetto are chilling.

I'm very concerned for the best outcomes ahead for those who *all who live in the area and feel that the plans to move all to the South is going to make it worse and hostilities get worse not better for the reasons I took the trouble to look up,

we have to look to the future.

How come such healthy men

They've been spoken of since October 23. In thread after thread.

Unicef report, 2nd May, 2025, on the situation for children in the Gaza Strip after two months of aid blockade.
No paywall or cookies.

www.unicef.org/press-releases/statement-unicef-executive-director-catherine-russell-situation-children-gaza-strip

What is proposed for a ghetto in the South of Gaza is unprecedented and as described above for 2.1 million people.