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Is the U.K. really broken, or does it just need tinkering?

(137 Posts)
escaped Wed 02-Jul-25 13:16:37

Well if things need sorting, why not go the whole hog? No hesitating, just be radical. It may upset a few people along the way, but if the end product is better for it, then there's no point pussyfooting around.

David49 Wed 02-Jul-25 13:08:22

Labour are getting harangued by Badenough at question time over the U turn. Particularly getting personal about Reeves looking awful - she did took awful

LizzieDrip Wed 02-Jul-25 12:48:39

Yes, Faridge et al constantly promise the moon on a stick with bells on … yet they never say how they would actually do this. Just ‘everything is broken’ and ‘we’re the only ones clever enough to fix it’ 🙈

Doodledog Wed 02-Jul-25 12:29:42

That's true, Lizzie. If it's broken, or nearly broken but still able to be 'reformed' then they're the very badgers to do it, aren't they? Or so they say.

LizzieDrip Wed 02-Jul-25 12:22:49

There is an argument that the far right (Reform) and the far left perpetuate the ‘myth’ that the UK is totally broken, as it serves their narrative - a sort of destructionism.

Reform, particularly, purport to be disrupters, radical, against the status quo. In order to make people believe their approach is required, they have to persuade citizens that absolutely everything about the country is broken, and can’t possibly be fixed by any other party.

Gaslighting at its most dangerous!

Doodledog Wed 02-Jul-25 12:20:07

Sorry to be po-faced (not to mention predictable), but 'broken' is another of those vague terms that stop people communicating effectively. As long as we talk about the NHS being 'on its knees' and the economy 'dropping off a cliff' nobody knows what anyone else is talking about, which probably makes politicians of all stripes happy.

I'm not sure if this answers the question, but I think the welfare state and tax system both need a radical overhaul, that there should be a publicly expressed (and preferable shared) vision about rights and responsibilities of all citizens, and I'd like to see a proper citizens' contract so that it is clear what is expected of everyone and what they can expect to get back in return.

None of that is 'tinkering', and I don't know how it can be done, really, as it would inevitable mean huge disruption to many people's lives.

Ilovecheese Wed 02-Jul-25 12:11:03

The "correct way forward " means different things to different people.

Ilovecheese Wed 02-Jul-25 12:09:33

Starmer's Government is tinkering. It has not so far proved very successful. I would like to see something different being given a chance, but don't think that would ever be allowed under the current regime.

David49 Wed 02-Jul-25 11:43:02

You can’t have a radical rethink without the money to do it, we seem to be unable to create enough ourselves, we have a Centre Left government now yet they are not being allowed to do what is needed by their own extremists.

It’s the opposite of the Tory problem, extremists preventing the correct way forward.

Lathyrus3 Wed 02-Jul-25 10:57:17

Id like some really radical changes in public ownership of essentials like water and energy. A commitment to public transport and social housing even if it means higher taxes.
And a couple of other things but that would do for a start.😬

Maremia Wed 02-Jul-25 10:39:19

Changes are always needed, as we change. Industries change, either fade or develop.
UK is not completely or even nearly broken. Dramatic ideas/politicians always take priority in headlines.That's how the media feeds itself. But slow and steady wins the race. I prefer evolution to revolution.

Whitewavemark2 Wed 02-Jul-25 10:28:28

Bit of a clunky title, but just listening to some commentary, which suggested that the far right (Reform) and the far left (bits of the Labour Party) see the U.K. as completely broken and needs a complete and radical re-think as against everyone in the middle (Starmer included) which believes that there is nothing wrong fundamentally with the U.K. that a bit of tinkering wouldn’t fix.

I think I’m in between the middle and far left, in so much as I think there does need to be more of a radical re-think to some policies. But I’m open to discussion.