Charlie Kirk shot

I had never heard of him.

Now I have I see he held some very unpleasant views on women.

Charlie Kirk's widow gave a tearful speech about those who killed her husband "do not know what they have unleashed across this country" and her late husband was now a "martyr".

How many of Trump's speechwriters' worked on that piece of verbal choreography?

(from the i-paper) :- There have been a number of controversial takes from the left in response to the fatal shooting of Charlie Kirk, right-wing political firebrand in the US. Kirk had opinions that were not just politically divisive, but somewhat extreme. His statements about Jewish, gay and black people have caused many on the left to, if not celebrate his passing, not be too shy about their refusal to mourn it.
Kirk’s death is nothing less than a tragedy - he leaves behind a wife and two children.

But perhaps the worst take of all is from the President Donald Trump, who appears to have capitalised on Kirk’s death for political gain. It stands in sharp contrast to his limited response after attacks on Democrat figures earlier this summer: "In the aftermath of Kirk’s murder, Trump and the Maga establishment have immediately denounced leftist rhetoric and blamed the left for political violence in America – while ignoring entirely the extreme vitriol coming from their own side, including from Kirk himself.

To do so is to immediately, and dishonestly, weaponise and politicise his killing, and to risk even more violence in the future.

"Trump pardoned, en masse, everyone who invaded the Capitol on 6 January, 2021, including those who attacked police officers and arrived armed for a day of violence that left five dead. He shrugged off the brutal murder of Minnesota Democrats. He openly sends in the national guard and FBI to cities which vote against him. And now one of his allies lies dead, he condemns his opponents as responsible without waiting for the basic facts."

########## That text omits the extreme hypocrisy by which Chump laments the long prison sentence given to Brazil’s former right-wing despot leader (Bolsonaro), for trying to organise a revolution against the newly-elected leader, when his response to his OWN attempted terrorist revolution at the Capitol was to pardon all those concerned (a "nasty witch hunt").

For FriedGreenTomatoes, and that quite reasonable, sensible "Charlie Kirk was only 31y. He was a devout Christian and loving family man with two young children, now fatherless this morning. What an indictment of intolerance when you cannot debate, discuss or disagree with someone else’s opinions without resorting to murder." -- unfortunately followed with the quite disgraceful "This is what left liberal intolerance looks like.".

Kirk may have gone to Church, and CLAIMED to be "christian", but he was an excellent example of Americans (& others) who have no real concept what that word means.

I'm NOT religious, but throughout the New Testament there are references to Jesus preaching love and tolerance.

Kirk has stated that the West is superior to the rest of the planet, has attacked the Civil Rights Amendments of 1964 and Martin Luther King, has attacked Academics and supported the harassment of those who disagree with him, has claimed he supports Israel (genocide is OK then?) but has expressed a range of anti-Semitic views, has opposed LGBQT+ rights, actively supported and encouraged the attempted Capitol revolution to support Chump, and in an episode of his his podcast, called for a "patriot" to bail out of jail the man who broke into Nancy Pelosi's house and attacked and tried to murder her husband with a hammer.

So very Christian . . .

Of course there are more left leaning contributors on here. It’s obvious. Doesn’t matter but it is just a fact. I don’t think there are a lot of extremes, though, thankfully. I would leave if there was, don’t wish to be associated with lunatics of any political creed.

I'm in the US it's just another symptom of lack of good gun control. I don't feel especially bad about Charlie Kirk. I certainly didn't agree with his views.

Galaxy

I have seen very clear details of what was on the casings, on most major news outlets.

What did any of them mean? They appear to be related to video games.

I have seen very clear details of what was on the casings, on most major news outlets.

Did I just see on the news that the head of the FBI was very good friends with Charlie Kirk?

@Iam64

I looked up the Prevent Program. I am unaware of a similar program on the US.

The feds did have information on the rise of domestic terrorism, however Trump's team removed that particular page from the website after Kirk's death.

archive.is/1t1rm

I have seen reports of (mostly) young men being radicalized on online gaming platforms for a few years now in the US. The Guardian article I posted yesterday mentioned the phenomenon in the UK as well.

I keep seeing reports that the engravings on the casings are tied to something called 4chan. I have no idea what that is, other than what I read today.

www.internetmatters.org/advice/apps-and-platforms/social-media/4chan/

They are being very vague with the details right now, which is a difference from the anti-trans, anti-liberal stance from the last 2 days.

Trump, however, is still blaming liberals. He says that conservatives are radicals because liberals radicalized them.

He also said he couldn't care less about uniting the country.

www.yahoo.com/news/articles/couldnt-care-less-trump-rejects-180240676.html

www.pewresearch.org/politics/2024/06/06/gun-attitudes-and-the-2024-election/pp_2024-6-5_cultural-values_8-01/

Thanks for your input imaround. Good to have someone in the thick of it who can shed some light on this.

Those that live by the sword, die by the sword. Sad for the family of the man, but the choice of americans to allow guns to be held by evereyone as a right, will inevitably lead to such

Biden nominated Chipman to the ATF during the start of his term. Chipman was a gun control advocate. He nomination was eventually withdrawn because Republicans did not support a gun control advocate on the position.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Chipman

There were 3 Democrats who joined Republicans to oppose it. They were from West Virginia, Maine, and Montana.

So moderate Democrats in Red states.

Here is a perfect example of the violent rhetoric from Republicans. She wanted to death penalty when she thought the shooter was a liberal, but prayers once she found out he wants a liberal.

"With Congress gridlocked, the president in April 2021 issued executive actions intended to curb the use of guns in crime. He ordered the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives to propose rules restricting the availability of pistol braces — an accessory used in a mass shooting in Boulder, Colorado, two weeks earlier — as well as kits for making homemade, untraceable “ghost guns.” He also nominated David Chipman — a former ATF special agent — to be the agency’s first permanent director in six years.

While Chipman’s nomination was playing out on Capitol Hill, an investigation by The Trace and USA TODAY found that the ATF had routinely allowed gun dealers to stay in business even after committing violations that could have armed criminals. Biden responded by directing the ATF to revoke the licenses of gun dealers who willfully commit violations like transferring firearms to convicted felons and failing to run background checks on customers. The zero-tolerance policy caused revocations to soar. "

From the article on Biden's attempt of gun control.

This article explains how Biden's Gun Control campaign promises turned out. Some meaningful changes were made.

www.thetrace.org/2024/11/biden-gun-violence-policy-reform-record/

Then Trump took office and issued an Executive Order reversing most of the progress.

I think this proves that the Democrats did, in fact, do more to control guns then Republicans did.

Here is the executive order reversing all of Biden's gun control laws.

www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/02/protecting-second-amendment-rights/

Democrats and Reblicans are not the same in regards to gun safety. At all. It is kind of funny to hear a "but Democrats did nothing too". A simple Google search proves otherwise.

FriedGreenTomatoes2

Casdon

FriedGreenTomatoes2

Allira I only said ‘mostly’ not all are left leaning on here. It’s a bluddy echo chamber on most N&P threads. Quite deafening in intensity.

That’s not because there are more left than right leaning posters on Gransnet though, is it?

I think it is.

By the law of averages, you are wrong for our demographic. I think what you see in other posts depends where you sit on the political spectrum yourself, rather than the nuances in the views they hold.

I never said anyone deserved to die for their beliefs, so I reject the implication that I do because I am not a Trump supporter. I am also engaging in a good faith discussion on gun laws on the US.

I never Said my word is gospel, you attributed that to me, so I am not sure why you feel the need to even say it. You have the right, and the ability, to pass by any of my posts you don't agree with. You also have the right to your opinions on Trump, as do I.

I also welcome any example you can find to prove anything I say is wrong. Let me know when you have some and we can debate.

It really is that simple.

Casdon

FriedGreenTomatoes2

Allira I only said ‘mostly’ not all are left leaning on here. It’s a bluddy echo chamber on most N&P threads. Quite deafening in intensity.

That’s not because there are more left than right leaning posters on Gransnet though, is it?

I think it is.

O kayyyy 😄

This.

Oreo

I don’t know about anyone else on here growstuff but I neither like nor support the kind of things that Kirk said.I find his murder appalling nevertheless.
And we have to remember that millions of US citizens did like him.
Not our circus not our monkeys.

No, it doesn't matter whether millions of US citizens liked Trump. It's irrelevant - a strawman argument. It's actually the kind of technique Kirk used in his so-called "debates".

I abhor Kirk's beliefs and I have every right to hold that opinion, whether or not every other single person adored him.

Bravo

Suits the narrative here (mostly left leaning) on GN down to the ground though Not sure about that.

He said some pretty odious things though.

FriedGreenTomatoes2

Allira I only said ‘mostly’ not all are left leaning on here. It’s a bluddy echo chamber on most N&P threads. Quite deafening in intensity.

That’s not because there are more left than right leaning posters on Gransnet though, is it?