Manchester Synagogue Attack

Technically Christianity is now a minority religion in the UK. I don’t quite understand your argument wwm2 about your GDIL. Lots of migrants have faced abuse for all sorts of reasons- even pale skinned people. The difference is that Jews were killed yesterday. As a society we need to stop and work out future preventative measures. It’s unacceptable as it stands.

Oreo

The marches have caused so much hatred towards Jews world wide.

And I also know that the sort of rhetoric we witness on this thread and all over the media ensures that my GDIL and people like her of Egyptian descent are now at risk from hate crime and violence, when in fact apart from her skin colour -she was brought up as a Coptic Christian - the oldest Christian faith - she is assumed to be a f…g Muslim.

Every single day people of minority faiths - Jewish and Islamic - are subjected to hateful rhetoric in the media. That is bad enough, but to then conflate a faith with state/terrorist activities is making the whole problem a good deal worse.

TerriBull

Wyllow3

Is that what the Jewish communities actually want, TerriBull - shouldn't they be consulted first? There may well be disagreements for all kinds of reasons.

I imagine like all of us, they just want to feel safe, and clearly they don't. In the context of interminable persecution directed at them over the centuries, feeling unsafe has much greater resonance than the wider society might experience.

Yes.

Posters can argue on here about the rights of pro-Palestine marchers/demonstrators till the cows come home.

Jewish people no longer feel safe in the U.K.

The Jewish presence in Manchester seems to date from the late 18th century, with many of them coming from Liverpool.

WW" "It would be the same as discussing a protest March against Russia’s action in Ukraine on a thread where people had been murdered coming out of an orthodox Christian service."

This is what I was thinking yesterday. Manchester has a large Jewich population, and has had for generations. The people outside the synagogue there are not citizens of Israel, they are British. They had no connection whatsoever with Netanyahu's attacks on Palestinians, which is what the marchers were protesting about. The link between the two is that they are of the same faith - but the peoples of South American countries, Scandinavian ones, Europeans, and more are all (largely) of one faith, Christian, and the people of Japan are of a completely different one.

It is as though the Japanese were in conflict with Sweden, so a group of sympathisers attacked worshippers leaving a church in Peru. Not very accurate targetting!

unami Fri 03-Oct-25 09:15:56
Oreo
The marches have caused so much hatred towards Jews world wide.
Have they caused them or are they a symptom of hatred? There's a difference and you need to be able back up your claim.

Hate is hate

FriedGreenTomatoes2

Casdon

TerriBull

I'm wondering why given the murders a jubilant march by pro Palestinians was allowed to take place later. Fanning the flames and terrifying the Jewish community further.

I think it was impromptu, no doubt organised over social media. Given it’s impossible to know in advance about impromptu events, I think it is wrong for the media to publicise them, as giving them air time is wrong and may spur others to copy.

It was not impromptu. It was a planned event to coincide with Yom Kippur apparently.

Thanks for that, I hadn’t seen that was the case.

Where have you been. You cannot move for discussions of the dangers of white males. I have probably done it myself.

I find it very sad that increasingly people want to take sides instead of seeing antisemitism, Islamophobia and any other kind of stereotyping or othering as just the same side of the same coin.
Surely the Jew who is afraid to wear his Kippah on public transport has the same feelings as the woman who is taunted because she chooses to wear a niqab. The fear and vulnerability felt by Jews going to worship, is the same as the British Asian family who see their neighbours hanging the flag of St George out of their window.
On one hand people going on a march in support of the Palestinian people can be seen as being antisemitic by some or as humanitarians by others, whereas people waving flags on a march led by Tommy Robinson are seen as racist by some whereas others see them as merely "reclaiming" the flag and showing pride in being English.
Yes there is terrorism, yes there are people doing dreadful things to innocent people but they are not representative of the vast majority of people who are members of British minority groups and IMO I think we should all try to remember that. If we did this country would be a much nicer place for everyone to live in and I do mean "everyone". fwiw the white man who murdered his wife and put her in the septic tank is not representative of my husband, who is also a white male but strangely no one would ever try to make that connection, would they?

sunami

Oreo

The marches have caused so much hatred towards Jews world wide.

Have they caused them or are they a symptom of hatred? There's a difference and you need to be able back up your claim.

A symptom of the anti-semitism already present? Which was made even worse by the marches every week for two years.
Now erupting into angry violence, even yesterday! Of course this makes things even worse for Jews here and also in other countries.

Casdon

TerriBull

I'm wondering why given the murders a jubilant march by pro Palestinians was allowed to take place later. Fanning the flames and terrifying the Jewish community further.

I think it was impromptu, no doubt organised over social media. Given it’s impossible to know in advance about impromptu events, I think it is wrong for the media to publicise them, as giving them air time is wrong and may spur others to copy.

It was not impromptu. It was a planned event to coincide with Yom Kippur apparently.

ronib

I have discovered that the father of the assassin is apparently a trauma surgeon working here. I don’t know if this is true but if it is, I wonder how his son became radicalised and if the government needs to rethink its approach? Clearly from an educated family and apparently working as a tutor in English and computing- just what happened to cause a young man to kill?

It's a good point. Apparently the murderer came to the UK as a child (with his doctor father) and has been a British citizen for 19 years.

He was radicalised in the UK. The public needs to know what processes and influences there were because he won't be the last one.

Oreo

The marches have caused so much hatred towards Jews world wide.

Have they caused them or are they a symptom of hatred? There's a difference and you need to be able back up your claim.

The marches have caused so much hatred towards Jews world wide.

Whitewavemark2

eazybee

Whitewave, you are not a moderator on these threads and it is not your place to tell any poster about their comment: 'it is wrong.'

😄😄 now who’s being the moderator!

You, as far as I can see.

I have discovered that the father of the assassin is apparently a trauma surgeon working here. I don’t know if this is true but if it is, I wonder how his son became radicalised and if the government needs to rethink its approach? Clearly from an educated family and apparently working as a tutor in English and computing- just what happened to cause a young man to kill?

TerriBull that’s just how I feel too.

Wyllow3

^Is that what the Jewish communities actually want^, TerriBull - shouldn't they be consulted first? There may well be disagreements for all kinds of reasons.

I imagine like all of us, they just want to feel safe, and clearly they don't. In the context of interminable persecution directed at them over the centuries, feeling unsafe has much greater resonance than the wider society might experience.

What I see on here are probable pro Palestine supporters feeling very very uncomfortable and not wanting to talk about the marches.
But we need to.
The police have designated this as a terror attack and had done last evening when I made my comments so I certainly wasn’t rushing in to judge.He was a Muslim whose family fled Syria when he was a young child and settled here.
Yesterday’s disgusting attack was then built on by the Israel and Jew haters in this country who organised protests and drive by’s and over excited violence and loads were arrested by the police.

There are sections of the Jewish community who feel abandoned, quite possibly heightened by the ongoing marches, which are a symptom of what currently is being directed at Jewish communities who are forced to bear the brunt of the anger that is often evident on our streets. I heard a Jewish man mention the other day that they felt abandoned by the Labour Party in particular as their numbers weren't great enough to be considered valuable in comparison to the Muslim vote. This was much the same as sentiments expressed by the actress Maureen Lipman, who was a lifelong Labour supporter before she decided this was no longer the party to represent her people. We've heard the rhetoric from Keir Starmer, Andy Burnham and Shabeena Mahmood yesterday attesting their support and protection for the Jewish community, I'd like to think they weren't just spouting platitudes as politicians so often do in such situations.

eazybee

Whitewave, you are not a moderator on these threads and it is not your place to tell any poster about their comment: 'it is wrong.'

😄😄 now who’s being the moderator!

Whitewave, you are not a moderator on these threads and it is not your place to tell any poster about their comment: 'it is wrong.'

Is that what the Jewish communities actually want, TerriBull - shouldn't they be consulted first? There may well be disagreements for all kinds of reasons.

By discussing the protest marches which are against Israel’s action in Gaza - on a thread about the murder and violence shown towards Jewish people, is doing exactly what many anti-Semitic people do.

It is false equivalence.

It would be the same as discussing a protest March against Russia’s action in Ukraine on a thread where people had been murdered coming out of an orthodox Christian service.

It is wrong.

I think if people are concerned about a post they should report it. I won't be taking any guidance on what I post thanks.
Many of us feel ashamed that we have not spoken out more about the marches etc.